JelmerPatrol Posted November 19, 2009 Author Share Posted November 19, 2009 I've took a look at the Patrol manual and it now has a 248-240 degree duration cam. The L28E has a 240-240 degree duration. What about the WebCamShafts cam with 260-260 duration? I also found this company with regrinds: http://www.dbilas.de/dbilas_eng/index.htm Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony D Posted November 19, 2009 Share Posted November 19, 2009 Like Oz mentioned a radical adjustment by 'accident' of one tooth slipped on the big cam gear (what is that, something like 9 degrees) really changed the engine's manners. It had a bunch of torque in the lower rpm ranges, but was absolutely flat at 5500 rpms. As in you really didn't want to even run it past that point as it felt as if you were actually slowing down (like a governed go-kart doing downhill!) But from the stoplights and around town it was a really torquey change, and that was a stock cam. The Racer Brown articles go over what does what on a camshaft, it's not duration you are looking for, but altered timing events and if anything more lift. Stock cams generate pretty good down low torque, but by altereing the valve events earlier you may pick up some more low end at the obviousl sacrifice of higher rpm performance. In a Patrol, likely that is acceptable. Probably in a 280ZX as well... ;^P Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JelmerPatrol Posted November 19, 2009 Author Share Posted November 19, 2009 Thanks for the reply! So what do you recommend for cam? I'm new into this and I've searched the forum alot but everyone wants heaps of HP. I want torque but still be able to pull it to 6000rpm on steep hills in low range. I can live with the powerband I have in my Patrol now in low range but on the streets it needs a bit more power cause of the biiiiiig tires. For exemple, Ive had a 84 BMW 535i. 3.5l with 220hp and 310Nm (228lb/ft) and both numbers are at pretty low rpm's. Can my 3.1l Nissan motor have such numbers (maybe little bit lower since it "only" 3.1l) at low RPM's? Compression ratio of this BMW motor is pretty high to? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ozconnection Posted November 20, 2009 Share Posted November 20, 2009 There are several "stock" cam profiles, all with slightly different lifts and durations, but they're all essentially 'about' the same size. Having said that though, the one you have in your L28 is what I have in my car, 240 degrees intake and 248 degrees exhaust duration. This is a good cam for torque. Adjust it by advancing it to gain even more low rpm throttle response. But to get a stock cam to be able to rev (and have good power) to 6K is to build a different animal and will usually require a larger cam. You can't escape the fact that you have a heavy vehicle. You also can't escape the fact that for such a vehicle, the engine is small even if its a 3.1. So decide what you want from it. Maybe one of those BMW engines for a nice 'high tech' approach. Or a P40 OHV 6 cylinder engine or even a late model TB48 Nissan engine. Something to consider mate. You have moved away from the idea of building a turbo L series engine. A low boosted version with a reasonable high static compression ratio of 8.5 would see great low rpm response and a moderately powerful top end. You keep asking Tony D about the cam. I think you should know the answer to that one by now.....gee, he's written it down here and in other threads similar to this many times. So have others on this forum. Time to move forward. Best of luck with your project, whichever way you go! Cheers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zmanco Posted November 20, 2009 Share Posted November 20, 2009 You have moved away from the idea of building a turbo L series engine. A low boosted version with a reasonable high static compression ratio of 8.5 would see great low rpm response and a moderately powerful top end. I agree with ozconnection on this. As a point of reference, we have 2 turbo volvos as daily drivers. One has the smaller low pressure turbo and the other their larger "high pressure turbo". Off the line the low pressure turbo has lots of torque IMMEDIATELY. If you didn't know it was a turbo, you wouldn't guess. On the other hand, the high pressure is a dog below 3k and then surges to redline. In the real world the low pressure turbo is by far the faster and more satisfying car. And in case you're not familiar with volvo engines, these are 5 cylinder engines (2.3l for the HP turbo, and 2.4l for the low pressure) moving a 3500 lb vehicle. I suspect a stock T3 turbo on your engine along with some experimenting with cam timing with the stock cam would yield a lot of low end torque, and still give you some reasonable high rpm power. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony D Posted November 22, 2009 Share Posted November 22, 2009 "I want torque but still be able to pull it to 6000rpm on steep hills in low range." Ain't Happenin'... Might I suggest a BMW M-5 V8 better suits your needs. Discuss with Frank Poll in Utrecht, he knows the tricks mounting that powertrain where an L28 once sat... Cheaper than the stroker from what I understand as well... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ozconnection Posted November 22, 2009 Share Posted November 22, 2009 Cheaper than the stroker from what I understand as well... No, are you serious? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony D Posted November 22, 2009 Share Posted November 22, 2009 Hey, what's not to love? M5 making 345HP, with the ability to twist to 7200 rpms? Engine, Controls, and Six Speed Manual Transmission for under 2500 Euros? Considering what someone in Europe would pay for "Exotic Japanese Speed Parts" I'm thinking, yeah, that's WAY cheaper! I think Frank mentioned he got his for 1500 Euros. They're everywhere there. Hell, the guy is driving around in an Armored 5 Series Wagon they're so cheap! ARMORED! And from what I hear, on the Autobahn, that 2-Tonne Panzerwagen will WALK a Eurospec 350Z at 160kph and never need to look back! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ozconnection Posted November 23, 2009 Share Posted November 23, 2009 Hey, what's not to love? M5 making 345HP, with the ability to twist to 7200 rpms? Engine, Controls, and Six Speed Manual Transmission for under 2500 Euros? Considering what someone in Europe would pay for "Exotic Japanese Speed Parts" I'm thinking, yeah, that's WAY cheaper! I think Frank mentioned he got his for 1500 Euros. They're everywhere there. Hell, the guy is driving around in an Armored 5 Series Wagon they're so cheap! ARMORED! And from what I hear, on the Autobahn, that 2-Tonne Panzerwagen will WALK a Eurospec 350Z at 160kph and never need to look back! And we play around with these L Series dinosaur donks because.......? Hell, can someone please remind me!!!!!!!!! Tony D....I hate you! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony D Posted November 23, 2009 Share Posted November 23, 2009 Hey, facts are facts, when I assisted my friend do his "94 in a 74" LT swap with his Camaro and saw tunercat in action (since I had to teach him how to use it, HAVING NEVER WORKED ON IT BEFORE !).... For the price of the LT's now complete as drivetrains or hell even whole cars... it makes rationalization of expensive swaps really hard, if expense is considered. Why spend $4500 for something that is totally stressed and makes an honest 280-300, when you can spend the same and get 330 in stock form (or thereabouts?) Same goes for M-Sport crap in Europe. It's laying about everywhere. You can't even trade it for a loaf of bread. It's like rat turds, they brush them into the canals to get rid of them... When they proliferate like that, and get so cheap, it's hard to love on the OEM stuff. I mean, if I was going to do up a ZX......... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frank280zx Posted November 23, 2009 Share Posted November 23, 2009 Well it is not the M stuff, but in the Netherlands and europe M engines can be had between 2000 and 4000 euro. building an L will easely sat you back that much. Newer BMW Audi or Mercedes V8's will cost about the same. The x5's engine etc etc. But yeah my 540i MSport at 160 walks a 350z with ease akward as they roughly have the same HP specs. At 10.5 comp you could add a snail ... but why not use a thicker copper gasket to bring it down to say a 9 comp ratio? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PandaZ Posted November 23, 2009 Share Posted November 23, 2009 Lift, lots of Lift!!! Also short overlap!!! Thats what will do it for you! (+ play with valve timing!) Oh, induction & exhuast, lengths & sizes, will also have an effect too! *spose you could add an intercooled (w-a) supercharger, producing only low boost (~6psi), with a good aftermarket ecu! That would certainly help too! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JelmerPatrol Posted November 23, 2009 Author Share Posted November 23, 2009 Well, you don't buy an 400Hp M5 V8 for under €5000,-. Even the 340Hp 3.8l straight 6 costs more! I have an complete 02 M5 V8 and E28 with 3.8 L6 but I'll keep those engine's in there! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JelmerPatrol Posted November 23, 2009 Author Share Posted November 23, 2009 I'm not a big fan of carburators in offroad vehicles but what if I use an ArizonaZ manifold and a Holley carb on my setup? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ozconnection Posted November 24, 2009 Share Posted November 24, 2009 Read this and memorise Megasquirt it man! You said you already have it, didn't you? At least that's what I thought you said? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frank280zx Posted November 24, 2009 Share Posted November 24, 2009 Well, you don't buy an 400Hp M5 V8 for under €5000,-. Even the 340Hp 3.8l straight 6 costs more! I have an complete 02 M5 V8 and E28 with 3.8 L6 but I'll keep those engine's in there! I have two in my shop at 2K each ..... just look and search they are out there esp in germany and belgium Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony D Posted November 24, 2009 Share Posted November 24, 2009 Many of the offroaders and Moab Rockcrawlers swear by EFI because of it's ability to perform in obtuse angles while offroading. I would not have a carb on a car now unless I had to, the fuel in the USA is not conducive to it's proper operation unless you are shelling out bucks for specially formulated stuff, the pump crap is just that...and meant specifically for EFI'd cars now... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JelmerPatrol Posted November 24, 2009 Author Share Posted November 24, 2009 That's why I wanted EFI. The SU's that I have on there now are flooding on every steep hill I take. Ok, the megasquirt is going on there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zmanco Posted November 24, 2009 Share Posted November 24, 2009 Ok, the megasquirt is going on there.Earlier you said you're not an expert with MS. If you don't mind a suggestion, start with fuel only and get the engine up and running. Spark control is really nice, but if you try to do too much up front it can be a painful task troubleshooting it. Also, in the world of MS, there are various version of hardware and firmware. Let us know what hardware you have and we can recommend options for the firmware. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JelmerPatrol Posted November 24, 2009 Author Share Posted November 24, 2009 Thanks! I alraedy upgraded my ignition with points to ZX electronic ignition so I'll leave my ignition alone. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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