zgeezer Posted March 17, 2010 Share Posted March 17, 2010 Yea, that is definitely one that gets your attention when on frequency! Though I did hear a calm (yet interesting) exchange between our tower and a C172. The 172 was convinced he was on a long final but the tower did not have him in sight. The tower asked a series of increasingly curious questions about the view the pilot had. You see, there was a Strategic Air Command base a little over 5 miles west of our our field that had runways in the same orientation and... Ohhhh, I can relate to that. I lived in Vacaville, CA and flew my little VFR puddle jumper out of the Nut Tree airport and a dirt strip in Dixon. Right under or alongside the flight path of Travis AFB during the 60's and 70's.... lots of 141 Starlifters and once in a while a C5 Galaxie. I didn't want to share any air space with those. You could have a three mile separation and it still looked as if they were right next door. Read everything I could about clear air turbulence and terrible things that happened to civilian pilots flying behind and below those critters. By the way, a question. My AirKnocker had a service ceiling of 13,000 feet and top air speed of "maybe" 100mph. A few years ago, I was one of about 12 passengers aboard a Lufthansa DC8 as it landed in La Paz, Bolivia.... Airport was at or close to 13,000 feet. Anyone have an educated guess as to ground speed at flare with no headwind? My guess, after watching the markers move by, would be in the neighborhood of 200mph. G Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1 tuff z Posted March 17, 2010 Share Posted March 17, 2010 fred, glad to see you here on the dark side. some of my best flying memories were either noe [nap of the earth] flying hueys in upstate ny or 'skimming' the beaches in so cal in cobras! About 2000+ hours as a P-3C Naval Flight Officer, various time in CH-53E, CH-46, H-3, H-60, T-2, T-43. There is nothing like being down low screaming across the sky. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
p-factor Posted March 17, 2010 Author Share Posted March 17, 2010 A few years ago, I was one of about 12 passengers aboard a Lufthansa DC8 as it landed in La Paz, Bolivia.... Airport was at or close to 13,000 feet. Anyone have an educated guess as to ground speed at flare with no headwind? My guess, after watching the markers move by, would be in the neighborhood of 200mph. G Assuming standard atmospheric conditions and an approach speed of 125 knots indicated, true airspeed (groundspeed with no wind) would be about 160 knots, or 185 mph. So your estimate wasn't too far off! I can tell you that when flying the piaggio, with an approach speed of 120 knots, that when landing at airports like Aspen, Eagle, or especially Telluride (with a field elevation of 9070 ft MSL) you can really feel the difference in true airspeed! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mitch Posted March 18, 2010 Share Posted March 18, 2010 (edited) Armament 15Y US Army 6 years. Im out now, in college getting those cute little certifications so that I can have the FED's permission to work again. Edited March 18, 2010 by Mitch Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
S130Z Posted March 25, 2010 Share Posted March 25, 2010 Hey guys! So I recently decided to become a pilot. I am going to take private lessons to get my Private License and then work towards a commercial licence. At this moment I am searching around for recomended instructors and a good price. Anyone here know of a fair rate to pay for lessons? The closest instructor to my house is giving an average cost of $9800 for about 60 hours? The plane I would be flying is a Cessna 172 and the company is Eagle Aviation in Columbia, SC. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alxxpress Posted March 25, 2010 Share Posted March 25, 2010 I work on Gulfstreams GII-GV A just moved to TX and looking for work!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Globerunner513 Posted March 25, 2010 Share Posted March 25, 2010 (edited) Hey guys! So I recently decided to become a pilot. I am going to take private lessons to get my Private License and then work towards a commercial licence. At this moment I am searching around for recomended instructors and a good price. Anyone here know of a fair rate to pay for lessons? The closest instructor to my house is giving an average cost of $9800 for about 60 hours? The plane I would be flying is a Cessna 172 and the company is Eagle Aviation in Columbia, SC. Awesome! I assume you're looking to eventually work as a pilot correct? What kind of job are you interested in? Airlines, corporate, cargo, etc? If you don't have a 4 year degree yet, consider getting one. It's pretty much a requirement everywhere nowadays (though there are exceptions). Doesn't have to be anything aviation related, or even technical. Anyways as far as instruction goes, be prepared to spend roughly $150 per hour. $100 for the aircraft rental, and $50 for instructor fees. Each flight will likely be about 1.5 hours, with some ground instruction before and after each flight (this is not ground school). So about $200-$250 per lesson, depending on how the lesson goes. The price you were quoted sounds about right. I ended up spending a bit more than that, but that was because of a bad winter causing me to put my training on hold. Also, make sure you understand that any price you are quoted is just that, an estimate. It can take anywhere from 40 hours to 100 to get your PPL. If it does take 40 hours (minimum) it doesn't mean you're necessarily an incredible pilot. And if it takes 100 hours, it certaintly doesn't mean you're a bad one. Just happens that way. So it could be more or less expensive. But if you find your instructor is intentionally gouging you or prolonging your instruction without reason, either figure it out, or go to another instructor. I had this problem. If the only plane they have is a 172, thats ok. They are a great plane and have proven themselves as an excellent trainer. If you can find a place that will rent a Cessna 150 or 152, they tend to be a bit cheaper to rent. (smaller. only 2 seats) Personally I favor Piper aircraft like the Charokee/Warrior. Low wing plane and just seems to fly nicer. Very different characteristics on landing though, so if you start in a high wing plane probably best to stick with it until you have your PPL. Enjoy! Edited March 25, 2010 by Globerunner513 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
p-factor Posted March 26, 2010 Author Share Posted March 26, 2010 As an instructor with almost 2000 hours of dual given, I don't have a lot more to add, good advice, Globerunner! S130Z, you can save a lot of money by studying before and after every lesson. You might be persuaded to purchase a structured self-study program like the Cessna Flight Training System. It's a series of computerized, guided, video lessons with a quiz at the end of each lesson. Your results and progress are saved on a disk and your instructor can then see what areas you might've answered wrong and where he or she can then give further instruction. This way you can save the cost of hours of one-on-one instruction from your instructor, which is time consuming and expensive. Your instructor also knows exactly where you are in your knowledge base, and can then format each lesson accordingly. You will still be given ground/classroom instruction by your instructor, especially for the more complicated lessons. Expect to spent at least a few minutes before and after every flight going over what the lesson will be, what to watch for, and then what the next lesson will involve, with areas to read up on. Good luck! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Globerunner513 Posted March 26, 2010 Share Posted March 26, 2010 S130Z, you can save a lot of money by studying before and after every lesson. This is probably the advice I heard the most during my initial training, and the same advice I chose to ignore the most! I certainly paid for it, both in money and time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
macr32 Posted March 26, 2010 Share Posted March 26, 2010 well i was a crewchief on CH46e for the last 10 years. I have just over 2000hrs, 1100 of which are logged with night vision goggles. I also have in the ball park of 900hrs crewing casevac missions over in Iraq. This past summer i flew my last flight to Davis Mothen AB to retire the last CH46 of HMM 161. We (HMM 161) are now a V-22 unit in the Marine Corps. I switched over to the Osprey but decided I was done flying i am now just a mechanic. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
S130Z Posted March 26, 2010 Share Posted March 26, 2010 Thanks for all the info guys! I have been thinking about what feild I want to go in, and the two that I have given most attention to have been either cargo or corporate. I figured a four year degree would likely be a plus, but I am a fast paced person and 4 years of desk work just doesnt seem to appealing to me. Regardless, I will figure it out and I just want to have a fun career that I am interested in. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oddmanout84 Posted March 29, 2010 Share Posted March 29, 2010 well i was a crewchief on CH46e for the last 10 years. I have just over 2000hrs, 1100 of which are logged with night vision goggles. I also have in the ball park of 900hrs crewing casevac missions over in Iraq. This past summer i flew my last flight to Davis Mothen AB to retire the last CH46 of HMM 161. We (HMM 161) are now a V-22 unit in the Marine Corps. I switched over to the Osprey but decided I was done flying i am now just a mechanic. Small world. I was a 46 crewchief until '08 when I got out after 5 years. Most of my time was with HMM-262 in Okinawa, did my last year in 164 at Pendleton. I liked the Phrog too much to switch over to the Osprey and figured it was time to get back to school, which is where I am now. Semper Fi. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
proxlamus© Posted March 29, 2010 Share Posted March 29, 2010 (edited) Hey guys! So I recently decided to become a pilot. I am going to take private lessons to get my Private License and then work towards a commercial licence. At this moment I am searching around for recomended instructors and a good price. Anyone here know of a fair rate to pay for lessons? The closest instructor to my house is giving an average cost of $9800 for about 60 hours? The plane I would be flying is a Cessna 172 and the company is Eagle Aviation in Columbia, SC. My club charges $35 an hour for the instructor.. $117 for a good model Cessna 172 with GPS. so for a 2 hour session.. $70 for the instructor.. roughly $160 for the plane (log roughly 1.3-1.6 hrs per session)... average private pilot makes it around 55 hours or so. soo roughly $8,500 - $9,500 is a good average. Whats nice is if you pay a flat rate.. you can use him as little or as much as you can.. rather then paying by hour if your having difficulties. So take advantage and use up as much time and make your money worth!! Edited March 29, 2010 by PrOxLaMuS© Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Z-Gad Posted March 31, 2010 Share Posted March 31, 2010 Little late entering this thread, but I work as a regional airline pilot, currently on a Bombardier CRJ-900 based in Atlanta. It's a fun job, but somebody's got to do it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Globerunner513 Posted March 31, 2010 Share Posted March 31, 2010 Hey Z-Gad, how long have you been at your airline? What's your opinion on the ATP mins that are being pushed for? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Z-Gad Posted April 1, 2010 Share Posted April 1, 2010 Hey Z-Gad, how long have you been at your airline? What's your opinion on the ATP mins that are being pushed for? I have been with them for 3 years. I started flying in 2001. It took me a while to land my first flying job, but finally got hired. I went the GA route, had a school close and take all the $ I paid upfront ($50000 or so). I was ~ 2 weeks away from my multi-commercial when they closed, so actually lost around $24000 or so... Had to take a couple of years off after that to financially recover and decide if I wanted to continue (left a rather bad taste in my mouth to say the least), but eventually went back to aviation and finished my ratings. I flew a CRJ200 based out of Detroit for a year, and when our Atlanta base opened, I went to go fly the brand new $20,000,000+ airplanes ... shiny new jet syndrome they call it I guess ... actually I was commuting out of Orlando, so the move to Atlanta just made sense. Regarding the mins that appear to be coming forth, Experience is a valuable thing when holding people's lives in your hands, but I am unsure how flying around a pole for 1000+ hours prepares you for a right seat job in a jet. You can get really good at turns around a point and slow flight, but making the transition to an aircraft that is all glass and has a 140 knot approach speed...not so much. I also see loopholes in the legislation for people going through "airline approved" jet transition programs... much like they have today... Safety is paramount in the airline industry, and there is no substitute for experience and MATURITY (note I did not say age), but public perception comes a close second. That being said, there will be a shortage of qualified pilots once guys start retiring again at 65 and losing their medicals for other reasons, and the shortage will impact the regionals the hardest. It will be an interesting situation to watch... Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
S130Z Posted April 1, 2010 Share Posted April 1, 2010 Well guys, I take my first private lesson this Monday. Wish me luck! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
S130Z Posted April 1, 2010 Share Posted April 1, 2010 Oh! Any sarcastic words I should say to the pilot to give him a good scare? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rolling Parts Posted April 1, 2010 Share Posted April 1, 2010 Oh! Any sarcastic words I should say to the pilot to give him a good scare? Sure. Tell the instructor that you already know how to fly (and then go on to point out that the right pedal is the accelerator and the left one is the brake, LOL). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thrustnut Posted April 1, 2010 Share Posted April 1, 2010 I think what gives me the biggest scare as a mechanic is how allot of the pilots in our training program (both trainees and instructors) like to just hop in the plane and go. No preflight, not even kick the tires. We had an instructor run his airplane out of fuel in the pattern last summer (our chief pilot) with a kid in the pilots seat. When he came back he blamed it on the indicator, we did three tests on the indicating system, with no defects. Later on it was overheard that he wanted a fuel load (he took off with about 1/4 tank in a DA-20) but was told by the line it would be a little while, and he didn't want to wait. I think if you want to make a go of the piloting thing, it might not be good to mess around right off the bat, show that you are competent first. Aircraft and flight line environment are not the best place for a newbee to fart around... good way to get yourself dead. The three most useless things in aviation... 1. Fuel on the ground 2. Airspeed you don't have 3. Altitude above you Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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