240z electronic ignition help

[Mikez31ss]

You can still feel unlucky if you dont find out while the car is not running. Right now you are on track!

 

1. Swap the spark cables 180º to check that the engine starts now

2. Exchange the magnetic ring between the two distributors and see if the old one works now. Whatever you send back then, (accidentaly the new distributor with the old magnetic ring) is left to you

 

I have never rebuild a 280ZX distributor but would assume that only #12 needs to be turned 180º to fix this.

I'm ahead of you...I switched out the parts mentioned above. I now have spark with the old dizzy. And yes it would have been easy to change the rotor shaft assembly (#9). Just pick it up and turn it around. Reorienting the other shaft would have been a major PITA plus I'd have destroyed the bushings in the process.

I can now send the new dizzy back...in good conscience...more or less

Now I'm at 0 degrees on the crank marks and the rotor is pointing at #1 at TDC.

Should I rotate the crank to 10 degrees at TDC or just set the timing with the dizzy?

I really need to install new gaskets and seals in those carbs before I start the motor again. They leak like crazy.

[vantage]

I'm ahead of you...I switched out the parts mentioned above. I now have spark with the old dizzy. And yes it would have been easy to change the rotor shaft assembly (#9). Just pick it up and turn it around. Reorienting the other shaft would have been a major PITA plus I'd have destroyed the bushings in the process.

I can now send the new dizzy back...in good conscience...more or less

Now I'm at 0 degrees on the crank marks and the rotor is pointing at #1 at TDC.

Should I rotate the crank to 10 degrees at TDC or just set the timing with the dizzy?

I really need to install new gaskets and seals in those carbs before I start the motor again. They leak like crazy.

 

Now looking at the chart again, i should have said #9, not #12, which makes no sense as #12 is keyed anyway. Good job!

Its easier to start the engine with a bit of advance so set it to roughly 10º, then start the engine and use a timing light to set it around 10º.

Keep in mind that the engines exact idle advance should be checked with a warm engine and slowly turning the distributor to advance/retard the idle timing until the idle feels solid, the 10º is merely a factory recommendation.

 

Installing new gaskets and seals in your carbs does not really sound like a fun job, good luck!

[spacecase70]

ok i am sorry to hijack the thred too... I nstalled a hei modual in my 76 280z because of ignitiong failure when warm. I hooked it up as in these pictures and guess what... no start! when I jumped the red and green wires from the dizzy to the stock modual wiring it started and stayed running when I removed the jump wires. I drove it home ten miles ran great! had awsome power but after i shut it down, tried to restart and had the same problem??? i am at a loss

could I get a little help on this too! please i am confused too

here is te link to a video

Edited May 11, 2010 by spacecase70

[Mikez31ss]

Hey Adrian...still here? Hello if you are

While I was waiting for the Weber parts I decided to pull the radiator, front bumper, and airdam to get at some rust. The PO sent a new aluminum radiator with the car and now seems like a good time to install it. I have some electric fans and a controller left from my last car. I'm thinking about using them.

The controller manual doesn't mention relays. I think it needs some. If you get a chance maybe you can look at the diagram I made and the pdf manual and see what you think. I've got

this controller and the manual is here and here is the diagram I made with the features I'm not using grayed out.

 

[vantage]

The diagram looks good to me. The product description mentions the following "This switch is suitable for single and small dual electric fans.", so it depends on the size of the two fans you have. If in doubt, add a car relay, which is activated via the fan control unit (instead of the fan), and switches +12V from the battery (via a fuse) to each fan.

[zguitar71]

Vantage, I gotta say thinks for giving so much good advice on this thread. I just change to a zx Distributor on my `71 240 and every problem I had was solved with this thread. I would still be in the garage pulling my hair out without it! Thanks again!

[vantage]

Thanks, you're welcome!

[Mikez31ss]

Hope you're still subscribed Adrian. I got sidetracked by a few other things but I'm going to get back to this soon. I had spark so I'm thinking we solved that but I never got a chance to start it up due to the carbs. I'm hoping we can figure out what the problem with the tach is. I'm thinking at least part of the problem involves not getting any signal

Also I think I have one of those screwy in between models. My car has a 2/73 build date but it has a lot (or all) of the parts covered in the late '73/early '74 FSM supplement. It has the fuel cut relays etc. Maybe the original owner had the dealer install all the updates mentioned in that supplement ? I dunno. Hope you're doing well!

[vantage]

Still here, no worries. I am doing well, thanks, my 240Z is back on the street since a week as the Megajolt ECU conversion has been finished. Now need to get on a rolling road to do the maps.

 

I don't think that the dealer did install the updates, i would guess that you have a transitory model inbetween two series where manufacturing already changed/added options.

 

How are your Webers, making progress with the seals? Its much easier to fix tach issues when you have a running engine

[Mikez31ss]

Good deal. Glad you have your car to that point. I'm guessing Megajolt is similar to MS. Fuel and timing maps? That would be fun to have that much control. I had a tec3 on my shiro and I've studied Nistune a bit. Oddly enough it's less intimidating than playing with carbs lol.

Ok...I'm probably stalling on the carbs but I wanted to wait until I got a new fuel pump in and makes sure the car will start and run before I open up the carbs. That way if there is a running problem after I install the new seals and gaskets then I won't be wondering if the problem lies w/ the carbs or the ignition. It would have been great if eurocarb had sent instructions or part names with the service kits. I don't want to disassemble anything that doesn't need to be disassembled. Less chance of screwing something up

[vantage]

Good deal. Glad you have your car to that point. I'm guessing Megajolt is similar to MS. Fuel and timing maps? That would be fun to have that much control. I had a tec3 on my shiro and I've studied Nistune a bit. Oddly enough it's less intimidating than playing with carbs lol.

Ok...I'm probably stalling on the carbs but I wanted to wait until I got a new fuel pump in and makes sure the car will start and run before I open up the carbs. That way if there is a running problem after I install the new seals and gaskets then I won't be wondering if the problem lies w/ the carbs or the ignition. It would have been great if eurocarb had sent instructions or part names with the service kits. I don't want to disassemble anything that doesn't need to be disassembled. Less chance of screwing something up

 

Megajolt is an ignition controller for carb engines. I like carbs but am happy with fuel injection setups too, i just dont think that a L24 gasonline with standard compression would benefit from a conversion to FI except if you aim for fuel economy.

Good luck with the fuel pump and the carbs, looking forward to a running engine to continue our little tour of the Z's ignition and tacho setup.

[Mikez31ss]

Megajolt is an ignition controller for carb engines. I like carbs but am happy with fuel injection setups too, i just dont think that a L24 gasonline with standard compression would benefit from a conversion to FI except if you aim for fuel economy.

Good luck with the fuel pump and the carbs, looking forward to a running engine to continue our little tour of the Z's ignition and tacho setup.

Got the fuel pump, FPR, and all that in. After trying to start it a couple of times w/o success I checked for spark. No spark. No power to the coil. I must have done something when I removed the electric fuel pump. Could have happened when I did the 280zx alternator.

I guess I need to start at the coil end and trace that black/white wire back to see where the problem is.

Have you ever seen a wiring diagram that shows the 4 connectors in the pic below? There is no power now in the b/w wire that the electric fuel pump was tapped into. Strange...

Edited June 25, 2010 by Mikez31ss

[vantage]

The '73 Service Manual, Section BE (Body Electric) show the connectors on the first two pages, might help a bit.

 

There are two B/W wires for the ignition, one from the ignition key to the resistor, the other one from the coil to the tacho. I guess that the fuel pump was connected to B/W from the ignition key, so you might want to check the B/W coming out of the ignition key lock to the connector in the photo first.

[Mikez31ss]

The '73 Service Manual, Section BE (Body Electric) show the connectors on the first two pages, might help a bit.

 

There are two B/W wires for the ignition, one from the ignition key to the resistor, the other one from the coil to the tacho. I guess that the fuel pump was connected to B/W from the ignition key, so you might want to check the B/W coming out of the ignition key lock to the connector in the photo first.

Thanks for the headsup on the diagram. Two of the harnesses are labeled wrong but no matter. I noticed my Ign/flasher fuse was burned out so I replaced it. As soon as I turned the ignition key to "on" the new fuse burned out. I must have crossed a wire up somewhere. I haven't touched the flasher or turn signal circuit so I'm not sure how I did that. The emergency flashers still work but the turn signal lights do not. I'm going to try to figure out what is wrong but I seem to be digging myself deeper into the hole here...

[Mikez31ss]

This doesn't make sense. In the diagram you only see one B/Y wire from the starter solenoid. I have two. One runs into the cabin to harness "B". The other comes into the cabin to relay "B".

The diagram only shows the yellow wire between the alternator and regulator. In my car the yellow wire runs to relay "A" in the car.

The fuse that keeps blowing is the farthest right in the diagram. It has a B/W wire and a green wire. The diagram seems to show a B/W wire running to the green wire from the voltage regulator. I don't see that in my car.

 

I dunno if this has any bearing on the problem but if you remember I had a B/Y wire in the coil area. It had 12v in ignition on. I used that wire for my e-fan ignition on wire.

I'll disconnect that tomorrow and see if it makes any difference.

[Mikez31ss]

Ok...got power to the coil again. Stupid mistake on my part. Had nothing to do with any of the other changes I've made. It was too late to try to start it up though.

Still leaves me trying to figure out why that flasher fuse keeps blowing.

[vantage]

When the hazard switch is set to the "on" position, and you then switch on the ignition, does the fuse blow? If so, it is very likely the BW wire originally going to the external regulator terminal IG.

 

When you converted your Z to the 280ZX alternator with integrated regulator, do you remember what happened to the BW wire whih was connected to the external regulator terminal IG?

[Mikez31ss]

When the hazard switch is set to the "on" position, and you then switch on the ignition, does the fuse blow? If so, it is very likely the BW wire originally going to the external regulator terminal IG.

 

When you converted your Z to the 280ZX alternator with integrated regulator, do you remember what happened to the BW wire whih was connected to the external regulator terminal IG?

I haven't tried the hazard lights with the switch on and a new fuse installed but the hazard lights work when the switch is turned on. They work even w/o a fuse.

When I converted the alternator I installed a jumper wire between the b/w wire and the black wire on the harness side of the voltage regulator plug.

I also installed a jumper wire between the white wire and the yellow wire on that plug. Actually as I said there are two yellow wires together in that terminal so the jumper bridges the white wire and the two yellow wires.

I tried removing the b/y for the fan controller but the fuse still blows.

I tried removing the jumper between the white wire and yellow wires on the v/reg plug but the fuse still blows.

I didn't try removing the jumper between the b/w wire and the black wire on the v/reg plug. That b/w wire actually runs straight to that fuse, doesn't it. DOH

Think that's the problem? I'll try that tomorrow.

I see that the b/w wire goes on to the ignition switch but I'm not sure how that ties in with the turn signals unless that fuse covers different circuits.

Edited June 27, 2010 by Mikez31ss

[vantage]

The fuse to the right (Ign/Flasher) covers the side indicator and the +12V feed to the IG terminal of the alternator.

When you switch on the Hazard switch, the side indicator circuit is disconnected from the fuse, and only the B/W wire is connected to the fuse.

 

So if the fuse still blows with the Hazard switch set to on, B/W is apparently wired to ground somewhere. Try removing B/W from where it is connected currently and check if the fuse still blows.

[Mikez31ss]

The fuse to the right (Ign/Flasher) covers the side indicator and the +12V feed to the IG terminal of the alternator.

When you switch on the Hazard switch, the side indicator circuit is disconnected from the fuse, and only the B/W wire is connected to the fuse.

 

So if the fuse still blows with the Hazard switch set to on, B/W is apparently wired to ground somewhere. Try removing B/W from where it is connected currently and check if the fuse still blows.

I'll check that tomorrow. I think I may see the problem though.

If I followed my notes then I jumped the wrong terminal. It is supposed to be b/w jumped to w/b rather than b/w to black.

I'll post the results tomorrow night. Thanks for the help.

How is the Megajolt road tuning going?