Pop N Wood
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Posts posted by Pop N Wood
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Commercial auto makers do whatever is the easiest to fabricate. It sure is a lot easier to stamp out a bunch of sheet metal parts and spot weld them together then to bend, gusset and weld tubing. Hell, I saw one article where Ferrari used round tubing to fabricate a prototype, then switched to square tubing to ease "production".
As for helmets in a cage equipped car, you're kind of going over the edge. And as long as we are throwing out unsupported opinion, if you get in that serious of a wreck then my guess a bone stock, 30 year old Z would have been your coffin anyway. I am not convinced that helmets in a car add any more safety factor then helmets on a motorcycle. Which would you rather have, a crushed skull or broken neck?
I wouldn't read too much into laws making cages illegal. Maybe there is a sound reason for them, but chances are somebody just thought the law was good idea, or that cages incite people to drive wrecklessly.
But most of all crumple zones don't mean much if you get T boned by an SUV. In this case I would much prefer a couple of nice, stout door bars then the 20 gauge sheet metal on my 240.
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Absolutely beautiful!!
Bookmark that one as a prime example of what a V8 Z can be!!!
I never would have thought to hide the wiring like that. You have probably just added another 2 months to my eventual swap.
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The stock headlight wiring is goofy. I think power is always applied to the headlights while the head light switch interrupts the grounds. Thus any chaffed wiring shorting out to the chassis (or a bad switch) will cause this problem. A bigger worry was the previous owner doing something stupid.
Don't bother trouble shooting the stock wiring. Goto Pete Paraska's site and put in his headlight relay set up. His wiring diagrams are pretty clear and will make your headlights work much better.
Of course there is a chance that something is shorted out, but I would think you will have a better chance of fixing such a short in the process of wiring Pete's relays
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Make sure the flow paths around the radiator are sealed up (such as between the sides of the radiator and the support wall).
Make as much air go through the rad as possible.
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Vapor lock? Check the fuel pump.
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Might want to find someone with a carfax account and try that first. The VIN on my 30 year old Datsun came up blank. Don't know how well carfax works on older vehicles.
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I think it was the solid plastic one. Whatever MSA sells. You could use a piece of steel plate for that matter.
I also did the steering rack bushings and control arm bushings at the same time, so hard to tell which made the bigger difference. My guess is the steering coupler, since in a parking lot the rubber one takes about a 1/8 turn of the wheel before the front wheels start to move. The car went from requiring both arms to park to spinning the steering wheel with the open palm of my hand. This was with P185 tires.
Stock Z's really have too much rubber in the front end.
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This stuff will make your head spin.
The general rule of motor swaps is that the swap engine must meet the requirements of the engine year or the car year, whichever is newer. Crate engines, I was told in a recent thread, had to meet the requirements for the year of installation. I think Greimann told me this, and since he is one of the few people who has taken the time to actually certify his swap then I tend to believe him.
Thinking this through (I don't know a definitive answer), saying a 350 crate motor has a smog pedigree just because it is a 350 doesn't hold water. A 350 from a 1970 Camaro isn't remotely close smog wise to an LS1 engine. And a fast burn 385 with the hot cam kit is even more different.
From a common sense point of view, an RB engine has a stirling smog pedigree since the Japanese smog laws make our laws look downright permissive. I have been told that this is why you can buy so many relatively low mile Japanese engines. Their emission testing is so strict that cars with 50 thousand miles often flunk and require an overhaul.
Of course, Japan's laws are not our laws, and unless the referee station has some kind of direction as to what equipment the car must have, then I agree that they will probably back away from issuing a certificate.
So if the above is true, then what would it take to get a crate motor certified, and couldn't the same procedure be used on an RB engine?
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Power, force, work, acceleration. All of these terms have very precise mathematical definitions, and each of these definitions has a very specific physical interpretation. There is nothing ambiguous about any of them.
Pick up an introductory physics text. Work is force times distance. Power is the rate at which work can be done. Torque is the rotational equivalent of force. The relationship between power and torque is just like the relationship between distance traveled and velocity. They are simply not a different measure of the same thing.
Kevin’s example of a diesel vs. the BBC dragster is exactly the end result I am trying to make. It is engine power that determines how fast a car can accelerate, not torque. The more power you can produce, the more torque you can create by the appropriate gearing. A Duramax Diesel truck can out accelerate many cars off the line only because it is geared to get into the power band more quickly. But if the car can get into it’s power band and stay there longer, then it will out accelerate the engine with more torque.
To dispel another common myth about towing capacity. What vehicle can pull a heavier tow load, a Duramax truck or a vehicle with a 450 HP SBC? Traction aside, I say if geared right the SBC will out pull the diesel truck. This is because the amount of torque you can put to the rear wheels is determined by the maximum HP the engine produces. Gear the SBC to run at it’s power peak and it will have more rear wheel torque than the lower HP diesel can produce. Go to a tractor pull if you don’t believe me. Jet turbine engines aren’t exactly know for low RPM torque, but if geared down from 12000 RPM to a few hundred RPM their HP advantage can be turned into massive pulling torque. As for streetablity, obviously who want to tow a horse trailer through the mountains with an engine reving at 5500 RPM. Get an engine that produces sufficient power at low RPM’s and get the pulling torque you need with less vibration.
I honestly think people would be better off if they completely ignored torque curves and just look at power curves. And I mean the whole curve of power vs. RPM, not just the peak value. Figure out what RPM’s your engine will be running at, then tune the engine (or gear the car) to maximize the power output over those revs.
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How is an RB engine any different than a crate engine? What difference does it make where the block was cast? You still have an engine with no smog pedigree.
The law quoted above only governs the importation of the motor. Once the engine has legally made it through customs, then what does that law have to do with putting it in an old car? If it was flat illegal to import such an engine, then how could legal buisnesses exist to do so?
I am no lawyer here, seems to me once you get that referee certificate attached to your car, then you are legal. You have done all you can do.
Also I wouldn't worry about jail time for an illegal motor, especially if you went through the trouble of certifying the swap with the state.
Actually this is why I dislike smog laws, too many ambiguous laws and common sense may or may not apply depending upon who you talk to.
Hey, no ******* shit, a curse filter!! How do yoy like that Fing chit?
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What are the import restrictions? How would you get those things licensed in the states?
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My stock 70 240 got power steering the day I replaced the rubber steering coupler with a solid urethane one. It is truely amazing how much removing all the rubber in the front end lightened up the steering in a parking lot.
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The lower radiator hose is collapsing. Faster the enging turns, the more suction the water pump makes, the more restrictive the hose. Make sure there is a good spring inside the hose.
Also make sure you have the chin pan between the frame rails underneath the radiator. This smooths out turbulence under the car to increase air flow through the radiator.
And like said above, make sure the air flow goes through the radiator and not around it.
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First off let me start by saying that when I grow up I hope to know as much about cars and engines as you.
Boy, that came out wrong. Wasn't flaming you or whining, just some self humbling humor to tell you the same thing you told me. Believe me, I have learned more from your posts then I have from any Hot Rod mag.
As for for the definition of torque vs. HP, I guess just different ways of looking at it.
In physics, they define work as force times distance. Thus no matter how hard you push on something, if it doesn't move then technically you have done no "work" on that object. The classic example is if you were to hold a 40 pound weight out at arms length. Are you doing any work? No, the weight is being held without moving. Are you expending energy holding the wieght? Of course. The rate of energy expendeture is, by one definition, a measure of power.
I would just be careful interpreting the equation HP = torque X RPM they way you are. That is not so much a definition of HP but an artifact of the realtionship between force and power. I still maintain you are better off tracing the power through a system and computing the torque from that, but I am not being very sucessful in articulating why.
The important thing is when you expain to someone whether they should build for "torque" or "power", then I shut up and listen. Your years of experience are spot on. But if you want to get into technical definitions of power, work and energy, well then things get a little more technical.
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needs floors
That statement scares me. If the floor pans are rusted out, or even have a single rust hole through them, then from what you say I don't think this is the car for you. Floor pans will take anywhere from months to years to replace and will probably chew up your entire $3000 budget.
Also the "will run, great project car" == $$$ to me. You don't care about the engine and tranny, but you do care about the tires, brakes, struts, tie rods, radiatior, battery, electrical, steering rack, glass, weatherstrip..... You get the idea.
Sounds like your dad has some experience with cars. Get him or a buddy to go with you to look at the car. It is often good to bring an outsider who can look at things a little less emotionally. Be prepared to make more than one trip.
Between the two of you check the car over and make a list of everything that the car needs. Divide the list into "must do" and "want to do" items then try and put dollar amounts to each. If you are even ball park on your guesses, then that should give you your answer.
Also don't forget the cost of towing that thing home, tags and title. It adds up quick.
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First off let me start by saying that when I grow up I hope to know as much about cars and engines as you.
But..
I look at it from a basic physics point of view. Power is a measure of the ability to do work. Horsepower and kilowatts are simply different units for measuring the same thing. They have exactly the same relationship as meters and feet. And just like something doesn't get longer just because you measure it in feet instead of meters, power doesn't change by expressing it in different units.
In a way we are arguing wording. You are saying HP is derived from torque. I am saying yeah, you could look at it that way but you could just as well say that torque is derived from HP. Taking it a step further I am also saying you are actually better off thinking about torque as being a function of power and not the other way around.
What I really think is important is that power is very real, and more importantly, it is power that determines how fast a car can go.
For example, given an engine running at a constant speed I can generate virtually any level of torque I want (either up or down) by selecting the appropriate gear ratio. However there is nothing a transmission can do to increase power. The "power" out of the transmission can never be higher than the power going into the transmission. This is the first law of thermodynamics. The same is obviously not true for torque. In this case you are better off thinking of torque as a function of engine power and gearing.
You said
ITS IMPOSSIABLE to have HP without BOTH tq and RPM and that power is only torque times a measurable rpm level at which the TORQUE IS MEASURED AT.If you follow the equation that HP is torque times RPM, then that statement makes sense. However if you take a physical interpretation of power then the statement is misleading.
If you have a car with an automatic transmission sitting at the line with the engine reved up but the brakes on so the car isn't moving, is any power being generated? Yes. The engine is generating HP but it is all being dissipated as heat inside the transmission torque converter. The power has to go somewhere, it can't disappear. Now release the brakes and the car starts to move. The engine's mechanical power is now allowed to "do work" on the car by accelerating it down the track rather then just heating up the tranny fluid.
Take a car spinning it's tires. Is the engine producing any less power just because the tires are spinning? No. The engine may be producing the same power, it is just that only part of the energy is being used to accelerate the car while the rest is being used to heat up the tires and convert them to smoke. If you look at this from a conservation of power outlook then everything is simple. I can't go fast because all my power is being used to vaporize the tires. But if you try and look at what spinning tires do to RPM and torque measurements, then things get too complicated too quickly.
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That thing has been there awhile. Didn't someone post that same engine a week or two ago?
Maybe someone should see if they will take 3 grand for it.
I wonder what tranmissions it will accept.
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Jeeze. No one has ever flamed me in a PM. Kinda hard to believe, from reading your posts I am much more of a lighting rod than you.
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The Arizona Z car brakes have been around long enough that I think we would have heard about any design deficiencies by now.
Brake parts are certainly not something to guess at. But, at the same time aren't the backing plates on rear Z drums just stamped sheet metal?
1/4 inch plate may be more than strong enough depending upon the design and how things are attached. I would be more worried about stress points causing cracks at the joints. But who know? Better to error on the side of caution here.
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first thing to keep in mind is that [b'] theres no such "thing" as horsepower, horsepower is a mathmatical formula for the RATE at which TORQUE can be applied the formula for hp is (tq x rpm/5252=hp
Oh, man. We aren't going to start that again? Horsepower is very real, just as real as torque. The ONLY reason car guys compute HP from torque is because that is the easiest way to do it. It is possible to measure an engine's power output directly then use the same equation to compute torque. I have seen it done. Would that then make torque "not real" but a "mathmatical formula"?
HP is a measure of power, the exact same thing as kilowatts. You can just as easily rate a lightbulb in terms of horsepower (a 100 watt bulb is really an eighth HP bulb). But it doesn't make a whole lot of sense to try and rate a light bulb in ft-lbs.
And I have said it before. Horsepower is what determines how quickly a car can accelerate, NOT torque. To go fast, the optimal gearing is whatever keeps your engine revs closest to the horsepower peak. A fat torque curve only relaxes the gearing requirements and makes the car more pleasant to drive.
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Definately Nice, and I agree with the color, I really dont know why this engine doesnt get more installs as the Z is a light starting point. and these engines can really be made to crank out some HP. and with the import scene being what it is there is a ton of stuff out there to hop them up
Agreed, very nice install and a good engine. But the reason I would think twice is cost. Z's are blessed with an engine compartment that allows a wide variety of options, most of which would return more HP for less $$.
But not to take away from the car. Beautiful work.
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You guys really need to wire 220V into your garages! Tap off the dryer or stove outlet if you can. 220v is much better in that it won't dim your house lights when striking an arc. The less line current you draw the better everything works. Saws and air compressors included.
But I know that some old houses just don't have it....
I bought a Century 145 Amp DC mig welder close out at a Sam's club for less than $400. Nice machine. Some guys complain about Century's cheaper machines, but I have had no trouble with this higher end one. Came with the air kit but no bottle. Harbor Freight is a good source of cheap bottles, although get a larger size to reduce the need for refills.
Flux core wire is good for welding outside, but man the smoke is an absolute killer inside. Flux core wire costs more than regular wire with sheilding gas, so in the long run you are money ahead with the gas.
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Yeah, I have read California graduates more new lawyers in any single year then there are in the entire country of Japan...
adjustments for round-top su's
in Fuel Delivery
Posted
Check the carbs and manifolds for vacuum leaks. Spray engine starter fluid (the canned ether stuff) or propane around all joints. If the engine RPM changes when you hit a specific joint, then you have found a vacuum leak. With old SU's pay particular attention to the throttle shaft bushings. They wear out and cost big $$ to fix.