Tony D
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Posts posted by Tony D
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[deleted]
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I posted a reply similar to TimZ's when this was posted originally...apparently it was expunged. (?)
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N42.
P90=A lot of hype for not much real world benefit.
Non-US N42's can have radically different combustion chamber shapes, up to including the N47 style closed-chamber depending on what market they were used in originally.
You want a 'best' here's one: O5L from late model L20A Turbo.
Then hog the ports, change the valves, and CNC the combustion chamber to match. No welding on ANYTHING required. From a 'base starting point' the only real thing you have to do is buy and have installed the larger valve seats from and N42 and use the standard larger valves, which apparently you have already.
Seats and installation and then start cutting.
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Both. Thing is the diffusing action is not as important on a plenum blowthrough style, but is on a plenum with ITB's. The ITB's as MONZSTER showed withthe CFD will get uneven flow from the introduction of air to the plenum, so diffusing and straightening it is beneficual. A Cartech Box is just a box, worse than the flow characteristics of the stock N/A EFI plenum when it comes to distributing air to the cylinders.
And the stock EFI plenum has been shown to produce 500+ HP with little modification at all.
If you ahve ITB's then the diffused plenum will giveyou more even air distribution. That means one cylinder won't run lean or rich compared to it's sisters.
At 100HP a hole, that makes a difference. Especially on 5 & 6!
Look at Yetterbens comments as he lived and learned. Jetting Jetting Jetting. The jets the guys ran in the Cartech boxes were humongous compared to what I would run in mine. Or what I had to run after going smaller and undiffused.
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Bean count this:
My Frontier gets 16mpg at 80mph with nothing in it.
The EXACT SAME Navara with the 2.7 or 3.0DI Diesel does it for 35+mpg.
Towing? The Diesels kill hands down. Our distributor in Manila has a fleet of D21 Navaras (which was getting to me, since they are 2007 models, which are identical to my 2000 none of the fancy funky upgrades!) and love them. Nice clear lens H4 Lights (in Italy, our guys have D21's with the LOAD ADJUSTABLE HID Headlights!), plenty of torque for towing portable compressors to the jobsite, and great fuel economy.
Don't get me started on what vehicles are available outside the USA. Total political B.S.
The FORD RANGER (the mini) is available with a Diesel worldwide, EXCEPT in the USA. (maybe not in Canada either, don't know...)
It boggles my mind but I have a good idea it has something to do with B.S trade tariffs and more B.S. emissions laws. The world got Crew Cab 720's and Hardbodies, it took until Y2K to get them in a small pickup here in the USA. DUUUUH! Now they are everywhere. Imagine that, people want a back seat to carry the grown or medium sized adult occasionally, and don't want to make them sit sideways on a jump seat for 5 hours drive across the desert. What a concept, convienience and multiple purposes for a truck. 6 foot bed? Not like I carry lumber every day. But it's plenty big for four L28's...
If I could containerize one and VINSWAP I'd be on it in a minute. Then again, I already have one, but the engine swap is a total PITA.
I'm tempted to go on my 2003 Air Cooled Beetle for $6500 rant again, but Ill save it this time...
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I guess self-promotion is one way to do it. But then does it really matter that you are 'published'?
Isn't that like congratulating yourself for scoring with your left hand?
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Runnners running a marathon.
I would think they would skip it...
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Ecactly what 'clicks' about Mechanical FI that in concept is any different than EFI?
Alpha-N EFI runs on throttle position and engine speed--same as MFI, save the components are a buttload cheaper and you only buy injectors once... The people who ding the EFI for it's drivability issues when set up that way would ding the MFI for the same.
Setting up EFI for Alpha-N is FAR easier than any multi-mapped setup.
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Take the back way out of town through Suisun on 12 to Lodi.
You will never say Vacaville is small after that. It's the 'town' most people mention in the region when they say the are 'going to town' on a shopping trip. It's easier to stop there than fight traffic into Sacto.
It isn't Rio Linda.
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There's a nice Class Three club that meets near Kelso that has some Browing 50's. Last meet I went to (the late 90's) they were doing barrels of gasoline and tracers...
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They are out there, especially in So Cal where K. Watanabe and other JDM suppliers flooded the market with $200 used engines in the mid 90's. Here you never know what it's going to get. Dismissively passing a Maxima station wagon in the junkyard some years ago (due to the probability stats saying L24E) my eye caught 'Y70' on the head.
Car had a JDM Transplant L20E! Wouldn't have ever expected THAT here in the USA either!
There is strange stuff out there. Nissan didn't export to just the North American Market as some would try and make you believe (Channelling Alan T now...
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Well, you've said that twice now. We got it the first time. How is that relevant to the thread?
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Now that I'm looking at mechanical injection though, it looks even simpler than carbs but thats because it doesn't offer all the things carbs do. I'm going to do more research on whether the car would run... worse than horribly when part throttle. I've seen cars at the track in vintage that run and kinda sputter when going through turns but still do great as long as they can get on the throttle well without any bogs.
Lucas slide valve injection or Hillborn is a vailable and can be made to be relatively tractable for the street (Lucas moreso than Hillborn) but if you think this will be 'easier' than carbs, under the same assumption that carbs are 'easier' than EFI, you are sorely mistaken. In both cases.
I'll remind you that 240Z's had EFI in competition as early as the RAC Rallyes in Europe 1971 or 72. 45mm ITB's with 'Nissan' on the base and the Nissan Competition Manifold same as on the 44's. Run through a JECS CPU that looked surprisingly like a 68 Volkswagen Type 3 Box...
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Notice anything odd about this R32 at a local used-car lot? (Well, local to where I was the past two weeks...)
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"Now if you want to install a factory EFI intake on an L6, it must be a '75 or newer head, Z or 810/Maxima. It wont bolt on to the '70-'74 heads, unless you drill and tap it and have the injector slots machined."
75 or newer US MARKET head!
I have an unmolested N42 from a 77 Nissan Cedric that does NOT have the EFI bolt pattern, or notches! And I pulled the engine myself (30C 95% R/H bought for 2 50# bags of Rice and a Half Gallon of Whiskey) from the Cedric where I was able to review the service records of the vehicle. It was all original, unmolested, 42,000 Km Automatic!
Another thing to watch for when using carbs on an EFI head is that some of those large EFI bolt holes seem to have been tapped a bit too exuberantly, and bored a tad deep---resulting in a terribly pesky oil leak that will have you scratching your head as to how the hell you can seal your valve cover to stop it...but you won't! It's coming from the *(&%*&%$ intake manifold bolt hole!
RTV works wonders in this instance.
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I think the mix betwen Brad-Man and Braap is what I would suggest: Get BOTTOMING TAPS in the sizes needed, of GOOD QUALITY from a machine tool supplier like MSC or Rutland Tool, etc.
For the cost of half a dozen taps that will be used more than you suspect (once you HAVE a bottoming tap, suddenly all those holes seem to get chased when doing maintenance work...)
Having the bare minimum to do the job will give you a small tool box full of stuff that works on your car, without paying for anything you rarely, if ever will use.
Good machining tools pay dividends that you won't measure in $. And really, they aren't that expensive.
I miss being in Japan (even though I'm there now...) where I could go into just about ANY hardware store and pick up a set of three taps. One bottoming one was in there, and machinists will know what the other two were for... An M6X1.0 set was under $5 at the time. Extremely good quality Japanese HSS or Cobalt Taps. I just took it for granted they were sold like that everywhere... I was wrong!
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Choke tubes = venturis. If you remove the venturis from 44s they become 44s, which is the diameter at the exit hole of the carb. No change you make to the venturi is going to change the size of the exit hole. The venturis neck down the opening to speed airflow through the carb at low engine speeds. I believe Mikuni shipped most street bound 44s with 34mm venturis.
John's right. When you remove aux venturis, you get a 44 mm hole for all your air to pass through.
That would be equivalent to a common venturi size in a 50mm setup.
It's the diameter of the hole the air has to pass through. Carburettors necessarily work on RESTRICTION to airflow to put fuel into the airstream, and therfore never will flow as well as possible unless you m ake a VERY big carb (hence 50's and 55's.)
There are 40PHH's that have 44 mm bores to the throttle plates and when you remove the outer neck-down the characteristic of the carb changes necessitating new jets. Toyotas used them on early TG motors. Sleeved down 44's to 40. The part from the aux venturi to the throttle plate was 40mm, everything else was 44mm.
Generally there are larger airbox side bores simply to allow for aux components like venturis to be matched properly on their exit side to the throttle plate diameter. Due to this alone, removing them effectively gives you a 47mm bore with a 44mm venturi for main jet draw-in. Normally 36mm or 38mm is the largest 44mm choke you will see.
Compare this to even a 40mm ITB with a straight 40mm bore and you will see it will flow better than any 44 or 45 with a standard venturi in it.
A 45mm ITB will flow more through it's 45mm hole than any 44mm carb will as there is no restriction to flow at all. You might flow that will on 44's with the venturis taken out, but the drivability will be nowhere near as good.
And to put it straight, the venturis are not to speed airflow through at lower engine speeds. They are there to create a physical low pressure area to SIPHON FUEL FROM THE BOWL. The fuel must be lifted from the jet well UP to the bore where it is introduced. Differing the size of the venturi will change the ammount of depression you get and the resultant booster action. Generally a carb will not work without a booster venturi (10 or 12mm in the main bore, in front of the 36-38mm choke in the body. Without the main venturi, there would be no physical low pressure area to make the idle and progression circuit work.
And this is why carbs will never flow as well as comparably sized ITB's. They depend on pressure differential to introduce fuel to the airstream. EFI does not need this. CFM determination for Carbs is at 9" HG. For EFI it is FAR lower since that kind of pumping loss is not required to get atomization and fuel introduction to the airstream.
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Shaving Cream (Prefer Gillette Foamy) is your friend...
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I've seen 44's run with no chokes. Not a street application for sure.
I said 'looks like carburetion' because of the size of the ports. Running 50mm carbs makes for BIG runners to get the taper you need.
You get the same power from 45mm ITB's as you do from 50 Carbs, but with much smaller ports, and higher port velocities.
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Wow, Necroposting.
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I think it would be impossible to remove them with the head still on the engine. The valves need to be removed. And you would drop metal shavings all inside the chambers if you tried.
Never say 'impossible' when dealing with mechanical items. In this same vein it would be 'impossible' to thread insert the spark plugs for the same metal-shavings reasons, or for that matter blend and match port the intake and exhaust ports with a grinding burr.
Both of which I have personally witnessed being done in several different ways while the engine was assembled, in the car.
Let your mind constrict your possibilities, and it will.
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Is there any way of telling which are low and which are high?
Jeremy
Multimeter.
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flywheel weight? rear gear ratio?
There is far more to perception of acceleration than horsepower and torque.
I have been in some very high horsepower cars that didn't feel fast at all.
Hell, my Fairlady felt fast as hell with the triples and headers, and felt really tamed down and docile with the stock EFI on it. But it was almost 2X the horsepower in the stock condition, versus modified.
Butt dyno was overruled by actual dyno, g-tech, and those dragstrip passes!
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I guess one, maybe three at most from my 20's survive. This past April I went 600+ miles round trip and spent 3 days rescuing one of them when their internet purchase broke down in the middle of the night (that hasn't changed since he was 20something---not listening to someones advice and run run running to get something done instead of THINKING about it and starting out a bit later, but in better shape...)
Thing is he lives in DE, I'm in CA. Another is in PHX, and probably the closest is 70 miles away.
And that is it. Guys who would, if I called, would help.
Most of the rest are leeches on legs wearing lipstick or sunshades looking for a lot with nothing in return but my blood and time...
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Unusual FI intake manifold...
in Fuel Delivery
Posted
Egger & Vickers out of Wisconsin was the other producer.
The Kinsler piece on sale is actually a Hillborn Casting.
Egger & Vickers made both straight and bent. I've only seen bent Hillborns.
I was wondering when someone else would see that, it's been posted at the Kinsler garage sale site forever!