ktm Posted January 3, 2014 Share Posted January 3, 2014 I am having one helluva time getting the CV shafts installed on my 1972 240z. I have an R200 CLSD and specified as such to Wolf Creek. The shafts came labeled (R200 left side) so you would think the install would be a snap. Wrong. By left side I am assuming they mean driver side, so I installed the passenger side first. Even after disconnecting the sway bar and dropping the control arm as far as it would go, I can't get the wheel side part of the CV shaft to clear the adapter. It seems to be catching on an 1/8-in. lip for the inner (?) bearings. Anyone have any guidance? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dudeboy Posted January 3, 2014 Share Posted January 3, 2014 I have the Wolf Creek CV axles as well,and my dad and I questioned what side each Axle should go. Left side based on standing at rear of car. I had this page as a guide: http://buildthreads.wordpress.com/2009/11/18/project-510-cv-driveshaft-conversion/ With car on jack stands, I used another hydraulic jack to raise an lower hub and it made a difference. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mark Posted January 3, 2014 Share Posted January 3, 2014 Try switching side mine went on with out any problems. If this does not work give wolf creek a call. They were always very helpful to me Good luck. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RebekahsZ Posted January 3, 2014 Share Posted January 3, 2014 I would call Wolfe Creek and verify that they sent you R200 axles. I sold my WC axles over a year ago, but I don't recall having trouble getting them into place. Mine were for a 240z with a Subaru R180. Pointers (best I can remember): 1) Did you remove your stub axles? Maybe you forgot to torque your companion flanges adequately? 2) Are your differential side axles pushed all the way in? 3) You could always remove the inner LCA attachments to give you more installation room. 4) Chase the threads in the WC aluminum adapters with the correct sized tap and use lots of anitseize on the long allen-head bolts (I galled one of those bolts and it was a royal PITA to get out, praying the whole time that that tiny bolt didn't snap off. 5) Use red locktite on the Datsun nuts that hold the adapters to the companion flange and the diff side axles-m1noel had trouble with those loosening and one of mine was loose when I disassemble when I switched to Z31T axles. 6) Don't try to do the lock wiring on your anniversary night-not a good night to be pissed off and frustrated. 7) After the axles are installed, you should be able to "rattle" the axle shaft laterally at least a bit between the CVs. This lets you know that all the clearances are good. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ktm Posted January 3, 2014 Author Share Posted January 3, 2014 (edited) I would call Wolfe Creek and verify that they sent you R200 axles. I sold my WC axles over a year ago, but I don't recall having trouble getting them into place. Mine were for a 240z with a Subaru R180. Pointers (best I can remember): 1) Did you remove your stub axles? Maybe you forgot to torque your companion flanges adequately? 2) Are your differential side axles pushed all the way in? 3) You could always remove the inner LCA attachments to give you more installation room. 4) Chase the threads in the WC aluminum adapters with the correct sized tap and use lots of anitseize on the long allen-head bolts (I galled one of those bolts and it was a royal PITA to get out, praying the whole time that that tiny bolt didn't snap off. 5) Use red locktite on the Datsun nuts that hold the adapters to the companion flange and the diff side axles-m1noel had trouble with those loosening and one of mine was loose when I disassemble when I switched to Z31T axles. 6) Don't try to do the lock wiring on your anniversary night-not a good night to be pissed off and frustrated. 7) After the axles are installed, you should be able to "rattle" the axle shaft laterally at least a bit between the CVs. This lets you know that all the clearances are good. Thanks all. I went back out after I posted this and tried a few different things. Long story short, I got everything together and they appear to be correct but I will not know until the morning. I thought it was only going to take me around 2 hours to get everything together (I had already disassembled and greased everything), but 5 hours later I am done. If I knew then what I know now, it is a 2 to 3 hour job, but having to fight my ST sway bar, brake lines, having to drop both control arms so that that sway bar could drop all the way just to do one side, fighting to get my insulator back under the tower, etc., it turned into a small struggle. Keith, I used Blue Locktite on those nuts in conjunction with the lock washers, and torqued them to 50 ft-lbs. Torquing them to 50 ft-lbs was a royal PITA given the tight workspace. Good call on the CV play check. I'll look at that tomorrow. Dudeboy, I was doing just that (hydraulic jack) and it did work wonders, but then I needed the jack on the other side to drop that control arm as well due to my ST sway bar. I tried using my trans jack but it was too tall. I got it all sorted but damn am I sore. Oh, and thanks for the downer Keith. I thought the hard part was over but it sounds like the lock wiring is another fun experience....... Edited January 3, 2014 by ktm Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators SuperDan Posted January 3, 2014 Administrators Share Posted January 3, 2014 It's been a few years but as I recall one shaft is shorter than the other and it goes on the left (drivers side). I did not run into any other problems. I did end up ditching the bolts that require wire locking and replaced them with flange head bolts and used Nord-Lock washers. 2 years later and no problems. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RebekahsZ Posted January 3, 2014 Share Posted January 3, 2014 Sorry for the downer-the swap took me a whole weekend, but I am exceptionally slow at all car projects. If you only stab yourself under the fingernail once with the safety wire you are doing well. I was unable to use safety wire pliers due to the awkward positioning under the car, so all that safety wire twisting was done by hand. And, it was my first safety wire experience, so that may have made it harder than your upcoming experience. The blood, sweat and tears is worth it-those are the prettiest, smoothest running axles available. But, you gotta work for it! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ktm Posted January 4, 2014 Author Share Posted January 4, 2014 First safety wire experience here as well so I am not looking forward to it. I check the CV play and all is good. I shortened the sway bar endlinks by !/2-in. so now in full droop the sway bar does not hit the CV boot. If they are the prettiest and smoothest axles available, why did you change them out for the Z31T setup? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spotmy4 Posted January 4, 2014 Share Posted January 4, 2014 5) Use red locktite on the Datsun nuts that hold the adapters to the companion flange and the diff side axles-m1noel had trouble with those loosening and one of mine was loose when I disassemble when I switched to Z31T axles. 6) Don't try to do the lock wiring on your anniversary night-not a good night to be pissed off and frustrated. . This.. so much, thought it would be a quick install. Nope, running the wire lock was a pain!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RebekahsZ Posted January 4, 2014 Share Posted January 4, 2014 Four fasteners per side and no safety wire vs 20 fasteners per side with the WC axles. I am constantly taking my car apart. And, I just knew I would always worry about those blind fasteners loosening up. When I drag raced my z with a L24 with stock u-joint axles, the hub side companion flange nuts had to be re-torqued after every trip to the strip. I always found loose nuts. Now, I can do 60 clutch drops from 4500rpm with 435# torque and nothing loosens. I just never trusted my WC axles with that kind of abuse. But, i swapped them before my first trip to the strip, so they may have been fine. Im sure they are great for a non-drag car. I tried to drill the four Z31T axle bolts for safety wire, but I just broke drill bits against the grade 10.9 metric bolts. I mark all my driveline bolts with a wax marker "Torque Seal" and the Z31T axles have never needed re-torquing. That's why. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ktm Posted January 6, 2014 Author Share Posted January 6, 2014 (edited) Final follow-up to close out the thread. I finally got everything buttoned back together and took 'er out for a spin. Everything seems to be functioning fine.....for now. I was alarmed by a noxious smell when I stopped to fill up at the gas station, but then remembered that everything was new in the back and that is most likely the source of the smell. My hands are destroyed by the safety wire. When Keith mentioned doing it by hand, that is literally what you have to do at least for the differential side. You may be able to get away with pliers or a safety wire tool on the wheel side, but be prepared to twist wires by hand on the differential side. I've lost skin on my index and pinky fingers. All said, it took me around 2+ hours to run the lock wire. My ST sway bar clears the Wolf Creek CV axles with plenty of room to spare. I know this was/is an issue with other CV swaps (there is a thread here in Hybridz about the issue) and maybe other sway bar options, but for my particular setup they are not even close to touching. I did shorten the endlink by 1/2-in. so that the CV boot would not be pressed against the sway bar in full droop. I've included a picture of the sway bar clearance below. A big thanks to everyone who expeditiously jumped into this thread to help. I was at my wits end when I could not get the CV to install initially. Hell, even Todd responded that he has had similar issues where the damn thing did not want to go in. A few notes about the install that may help someone else in the future: This is not as simple a swap as it appears to be. Yes, everything does fit perfectly and the kit is very well made. However, it doe take more time than you probably are thinking. I thought it was 3 hour job when looking at the kit on the website. After realizing I had to pack the bearings after I got the kit, I added an hour. I was wrong. Plan on a full weekend (8 hours) or one long day if you are single. If you are running a rear sway bar, you'll most likely have to disconnect it from the control arms on both sides to allow the control arm to drop all the way as well as allow the sway bar to fully articulate out of the way. I had to. As Dudeboy stated, you'll want to use a hydraulic jack under the control arm to completely drop it. This means removing the nuts inside the car at the top of the shock tower. Given the stiffness of the CV setup, once you get it attached to the differential and wheel you may experience difficulty getting the insulator back into the shock tower. Don't worry, it'll go, but be prepared to compress the springs however you can to get the studs to clear. The supplied hardware is not metric. Running lockwire is a royal PITA, holy shit that is still an understatement. I must say that I must be imagining things (similar to the butt dyno), but I swear the power transfer is noticeably smoother. Regardless, time will tell on the setup. Hopefully nothing will come loose. I was running the stock half-shafts on my car for 7 years with 3 engines and never had an issue with loose nuts. Then again, my tires always spin which is why I upgraded to CV's so that I can put some stickier rubber under me. I hope this thread helps someone else in the future. Cheers Edited January 6, 2014 by ktm Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RebekahsZ Posted January 6, 2014 Share Posted January 6, 2014 That looks great. Congrats. You thought I was kidding! I like how you acknowledge that time and accomplishment are measured differently between single guys and guys with a house full of people all screaming for your attention. And the butt dyno is always right! Check exhaust clearance tomorrow to be sure you aren't cooking a CV boot with your exhaust (possible source of smell). I think that is an issue with 510s. Other source is a big greasy hand print on the exhaust pipe. Way to go! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobsZTwins Posted February 27, 2014 Share Posted February 27, 2014 I'd be interested to hear if you've had any issues with the WC install, I'm looking at replacing my 280ZX axles on my V8 260Z with that setup or the Driveshaft Shop setup. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony D Posted March 1, 2014 Share Posted March 1, 2014 (edited) You guys whine about that lock wiring? Try lock wiring the fasteners to the JFS in any F15.... At least you could SEE the fasteners! And it looks like you used 0.020 or 0.031 Monel wire. You have in that transmission flange what is known in the business as a "close geometric pattern" and if you have some 0.041 Monel, I'm betting you could have saved HOURS of your safety wiring by utilizing a single strand of wire in there! (The F15 JFS fasteners are JUST outside of the range where that is permissible...) I'd refer you to USAF T.O. 1-1A-15... But I don't know where civilians can access that. In conjunction with NAVAIR/USAF T.O. 1-1A-8, you got a veritable treasure trove of work practices used to do everything automotive! Edited March 1, 2014 by Tony D Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony D Posted March 1, 2014 Share Posted March 1, 2014 (edited) .DP. Edited March 1, 2014 by Tony D Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony D Posted March 1, 2014 Share Posted March 1, 2014 Well, I just googled it... I'll be damned if the GSA doesn't have BOTH documents in PDF format online and classified "not secure" and apparently downloadable... I know what my Saturday afternoon is going to be spent downloading to my shockproof portable hard drive! I recommend anybody considering maintenance work on high performance automobiles get a copy. It's a great basic step by step manual of the art of maintenance. 10RGL so any idiot should be able to follow it...I know I could! Here is a link to the table of contents just to give you an idea of what is contained therein: https://www.fbo.gov/index?tab=documents&s=opportunity&mode=form&id=3fc3e087e6dbf2da6d0b06aea05931c4&tabmode=list Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JMortensen Posted March 1, 2014 Share Posted March 1, 2014 I was going to mention the wire diameter. I got the thick stuff (I think it was around .040) and regretted it for my rotor bolts. It's amazing what a pain in the ass it is to twist that stuff up, even with pliers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
djwarner Posted March 1, 2014 Share Posted March 1, 2014 Single strand safety wiring is always preferred if possible especially when using the .040" wire. Remember the safety wire is not taking any load stresses, just preventing the threaded bolt from backing out under vibration. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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