Lone Star 1 Posted November 20, 2002 Share Posted November 20, 2002 How for back away from the motor can a turbo be placed? Could a turbo be placed back where the muffler on a Z goes? I realize this would reguire some searous piping back to the motor, but wouldn't this also act like a intercooler? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cody 82 ZXT Posted November 20, 2002 Share Posted November 20, 2002 Ok, there are several things that really need to be explined here before a simple answer cab be given. But, to answer the question quickly "no" it can not be placed back there in a real world application such as a performace car. For the Z car theres no real reason to mess with a turbo unless it's for added power and better times at the track where ever that may be. First, off the exhaust gas velocity would be to low and the most of the heat that helps drive the turbo would be gone also. Second, the piping to the intake much less the intercooler would be very long. This would present a ton of lag and pressure drop into the system as well. These are to very simple reasons why it would not work. I'm sure some of the other guys will or can give better exact reasons. I would suggest getting and reading some books on turbocharging such as Maximun Boost. I'm sure you can order it from Book Stop by the Mall it's about 20 bucks. (I used to live in Mesquite) It will answer a ton of questions you proubly have. By the way are you thinking of this? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lone Star 1 Posted November 20, 2002 Author Share Posted November 20, 2002 Well I have the LS1 in my 73Z and I read a post the other day at LS1.com of someone installing a single turbo under the passenger seat of the F-body, which got me to thinking about just how far back a turbo could be mounted. From what I've been reading, at about 8 psi the stock LS1's are making 500 +RWHP and 600 RWT. If the turbo could be mounted at the rear and still be capable of producing 8 PSI to the motor, well it would seem like a simple place to locate the turbo. I'm just kinda thinking out loud. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pop N Wood Posted November 21, 2002 Share Posted November 21, 2002 Respectfully disagree. While far from ideal, as long as the exhaust piping back to the turbo is well insulated you should be able to develop boost. Remember, it is not the exhaust "velocity" that spins the turbine. It is the energy released when the hot exhaust gasses expand. Case in point, the Republic P-47 Thunderbolt, a WWII fighter, had a 2800 cubic inch radial in the front with the turbo back behind the cockpit half way to the tail of the plane. Probably a good 12 to 15 feet. The turbo was the size of a small refrigerator and the ducting looks like a furnace ducting! I have pictures but didn't find any on line. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cody 82 ZXT Posted November 21, 2002 Share Posted November 21, 2002 Since we are hypothectically speaking here. I agree totally with you on every point. Anything can be made to work and work well, with enough time and money for development. But,I don't think that the posistioning of a turbo in a performance orented sports car should be in the back rear most spot of the car. Especially when the factory position has proven so well. Why would you put it back there? Anyway, Yes some Nasa developed insulation could proubly keep all the heat in but, you still have no reason to put the turbo in the back of the car. If you reread my post you'll see that I addressed heat and velosity in the first part of the answer. In the case of the LSI engine in a Z the I would think that a mount not unlike the GN's that run so good should be looked at. There is just no reason to put the turbo over 10 feet from the engine in this case. Just my .02 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pop N Wood Posted November 21, 2002 Share Posted November 21, 2002 Not trying to flame anyone. But your post stated pretty unequivocally that it “couldn’t” be done. Whether is “shouldn’t” be done is an entirely different question. Also you seem to be assuming he is working with a stock engine. What if he was planing a turbo on a V8? Moving the turbo out of the engine bay “might” be the only option. Also I don’t think the insulation on the exhaust piping would be that demanding. I once worked in a nuke plant that had an in line, 20 cylinder Diesel that was over 20 feet long. Since the turbo was at the front of the beast that meant the exhaust from #20 cylinder had a good 20 feet of piping. Your comments about the length of the intake piping are valid. However, if you were to measure the length of piping through a typical intercooler set up I would imagine the total round trip length would be on the order of 6 feet or more. Not unlike the one way distance from the passenger’s seat to the intake manifold. All that said, I agree the best place for a turbo, especially on a performance car that wants some throttle response, is as close as possible to the exhaust ports. The farther away it is moved, the less efficient it will be and the more lag that will be incurred. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikelly Posted November 21, 2002 Share Posted November 21, 2002 I think we need more data from the original poster... This is good info though... Lets keep it flowing... Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tim240z Posted November 21, 2002 Share Posted November 21, 2002 IMO, and only IMO, putting that far back may be ok for long stretches of running, like Bonneville or something, but street driving, or 1/4 milers, I think the lag and inefficiencies would make it impracticle and somewhat difficult to drive. Maybe two small turbines? Tim Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lone Star 1 Posted November 22, 2002 Author Share Posted November 22, 2002 My thinking was that by not having to reinvent the wheel, by building exhaust manifolds that would place a single turbo somewhere in the already tight engin bay, I could could use the existing exhaust system, and mount the turbo in an accesable area. Then route the boosted air back to the engin through an ovaled pipe inside the car mounted flat to the floor pan under the passenger seat and back out into the fender well area, and up and into the engin bay. With piping being about 1' by 5" ovalshaped an disapating heat by contact with the floor pan and shear lenth. The car already makes 320 RWHP a turnes 1.7 60' times, with my best ET at 12.134. So a little lag would not matter, but if it was so great as to not improve my 1/4 times by one to one and a half seconds then this would not be something I would be interested in doing. I also thought this would keep the strain to the drive line at aceptible levels. Thanks for your opinouns, and again I'm just thinking outloud, and looking at my options. I know I could buy a heads and cam pakage, and install headers for about $4500. This would put me at about 420 RWHP and low 11's. Or the cheapest way to HP N2O, but I really like the thought of a boosted LS1, then maybe later heads and cam to lower the CR. Just dreaming!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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