Guest Anonymous Posted July 22, 2002 Share Posted July 22, 2002 Is it cheaper to buy a crate motor or do the rebuild myself? How much should these crates cost? What else needs to be put on? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike C Posted July 22, 2002 Share Posted July 22, 2002 Like everything else, it depends. Depends on which crate you buy, depends on the amount of power you want to generate, depends on whether you have connections for parts and machine work. If you want a mild motor and you want it complete, GM sells one that comes with everything but an alternator for about $2800 but it's only about 300hp. If you want FI, the Ramjet looks like a good deal, but it's only 350 hp. If you want to go 400+ hp, I'd build my own so I knew EXACTLY what was in it. As usual, "Speed costs money, how fast do you want to go?" Define your goals and objectives and that will should answer your question. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Anonymous Posted July 22, 2002 Share Posted July 22, 2002 Okay let me redo this question. I am looking for a street V8 Z with up to 400 hp. I might like to run a very mild engine and run nitrous on it once in awhile. I have no connections for parts or labor and barely any skill. I have the JTR manual as well as other chevy books recommended by this site. My main concern is something quick and fun with as little problems as possible. I will not be going to a track to test for times. Are there any good deals on the web that would be recommended for someone like me? Transmissions? Please make a generalize for soemone like me. I am trying to get an idea idea Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Anonymous Posted July 22, 2002 Share Posted July 22, 2002 Or what about ebay for motors? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KiD-ViD Posted July 22, 2002 Share Posted July 22, 2002 ebay has some nice built motors on it. I am thinking about getting a 383 stroker with 430 hp for like $2300 but then again you dont know the quality of work of the people who bought it. so you might not get something that great and you might get a awesome deal. if you go ebay try to get one that says balanced and blueprinted. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Mr. Big Business Posted July 23, 2002 Share Posted July 23, 2002 Originally posted by DPG HAMMER:Or what about ebay for motors? Theres one company that seems to always have engines on there really cheap, but I don't think I'd go with them after reading through the feedback, and checking the better business bureau. I'm pretty much in the same spot as you, having no real experience in the guts of an engine, and without all the special tools that type of work requires. I've gone back and forth several times on the GMPP RamJet 350, but what really makes it less attractive is that it's not really upgradable. I'll probely go with a crate ZZ4 from Scoggy Dickens or Sallee Chevrolet. Are you looking for a manual or automatic tranny? henry Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Anonymous Posted July 23, 2002 Share Posted July 23, 2002 For what you want I would buy a GM crate motor, They come with a warranty and I think they are much better built than a lot of these low budget motor companies. I definately wouldnt shell out 3 Grand on ebay for an engine that I knew nothing about. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike C Posted July 23, 2002 Share Posted July 23, 2002 The Ramjet IS upgradeable, but you have to go DFI or something similar for a controller. I know the marine guys who have similar controllers in boats have figured a way to mod the motors, but those guys some to have dollars falling out their a$$. I would go the GM route if I weren't going to rebuild myself, but moving to the ZZ430 is crazy since the extra 80 hp costs $4000!!!! (Scoggin Dickey sells their version of the 430 since the GM was limited edition, only 430) Either the Ramjet if you'll be happy with 350hp and FI or the ZZ4 if you may want to stretch it later. 350hp in a 2500# car can be a handful, so remember to consider your abilities while building the car. Try and meet some guys locally for trans info. You can mail order, but IME, you'll have better luck finding a local Guru. There's a guy here in Austin who builds nearly bulletproof TH700's (only way to go IMO) for about $500 plus a converter. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Power_Slave Posted July 23, 2002 Share Posted July 23, 2002 383 with only 430hp? jesus man. 383s should be around 500hp no matter what. Unless it has poopy heads and an sissy cam:) Regards, PowerSlave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Anonymous Posted July 23, 2002 Share Posted July 23, 2002 From what little I know, there appears to be some serious deficiencies on a lot of the E Bay crate motors. Compare their ingredients with the crate motors vitals from Jegs or Summitt. GM has a warranty on their crate engines but if they were giving them away a reputable 383 would be my choice. Mr. Grump posted some websites what he considered reputable crate motors a while back.Edelbrock is marketing their line of crate motors. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pop N Wood Posted July 23, 2002 Share Posted July 23, 2002 Consider the GM 385 HP crate motor with fast burn heads. To create a ZZ430 just add the hot cam with roller rockers. Will give you 430 street able HP with aluminum heads, aluminum intake, a roller cam AND a 12 month warranty. From what I have read in past postings, the fast burn heads are the aluminum equivalent of Vortec heads. Grumpy is kinda down on this combo. http://www.hybridz.org/ubb/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic;f=1;t=001937 Likewise with the Edelbrock engine(s). He feels you can build bigger and better for less money. I sure won't argue with him, but for a first time engine builder who wants to get something on the road quick, this seems the ticket. And I can't believe there is anyone on this site who wouldn't enjoy thrashing a Z with such an engine. A lot of guys have more, but I suppose most have less. As for transmissions, everyone (myself included) wants the T56 6 speed manual. But as jeromio realized in one of his recent postings, http://www.hybridz.org/ubb/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic;f=2;t=001238 you can get an entire automatic for the price of a new T56 clutch assembly. The autos are also a little easier to install and possibly the better choice for a drag car. My suggestion is to write down several different combos and try to estimate the cost of each. If you are like me it will be the money that drives your final solution. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
madmanadam Posted July 23, 2002 Share Posted July 23, 2002 Can I jump in? I'm running a ZZ4 from Scoggy Dickens and love the way it has performed. As of last night I have 1010 mile on the motor with no probelms and lots of power. My first engine in my Z was a stock 350 out of my 71 truck (dead now), second engine I built 300hp put in truck and thrird and final the ZZ4. ZZ4 motor is plenty of power for a 2500lb car. -Adam Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kevin Shasteen Posted July 23, 2002 Share Posted July 23, 2002 Working on engines is not that difficult, yet, if you are new to the game there is a learning curve involved not to mention tools that are required; a hammer and screwdriver just wont cut it all the time. If I had the money I would consider buying a crate engine from a reputable source; especially one that offers a warranty. The learning curve I mentioned earlier involves making mistakes along the way and the joy of a reputable crate engine should mean bypassing the hassle of "what parts combo's should I use -vs- what parts combo not to use" game which at times can drive you crazy (if you are new to the game). I am like Terry though, in that, I wouldnt fully trust an engine (450+ hp), unless I put it together myself; and this is moot if you paid the big bucks; like a $10k engine from any of the real big name builders. Real 'HP' that is also dependable and durable costs [bIG BUCKS]. If I had to buy a crate engine, I would not blink if/when I bought the engine from a "Reputable Source". 400hp is not that difficult now days with off the shelf parts. The aftermarket vendors have really altered the consumers approach to high performance; with the numerous onslought of hi/po goodies that are now CNC mfg'd. The aftermarket crowd really has made it easier for you & I, and a crate engine w/400hp is not something I would dismiss to quickly. Anything above and beyond that magic 450hp number should costs considerably more; if you want it to be durable and dependable. If you were to build your own engine, just balancing, blueprinting, w/porting to the cylinder heads and the advent of forged pistons will easily cost you $3.5k...EASILY; and the engine is still not assembled yet-this is a part of the learning curve I was speaking about earlier. Buy the engine from a "Reputable Source" and dont expect dependable and durable engines w/BIG Hp#'s (450+ hp) w/out paying For it; buy a 400hp or under engine from a reputable source and your learning curve can take its own time coming up to speed w/out the headache of those usual pitfalls many of us tend to find. If you do buy a crate engine just be sure you know what "quality" parts are being used. Kevin, (Yea,Still an Inliner) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest buschj Posted July 23, 2002 Share Posted July 23, 2002 You don’t need 400HP in a Z car! The carbureted GM 350HO long-block crate motor has 330 horsepower, which is more than enough horsepower for $2300. The parts and machine work to rebuild a junkyard motor can easily cost you more; with the crate motor all of the parts are new. The only drawback I have found is the cast pistons, but you can’t have everything for such a low price. I say buy the new engine, drive it a 100K miles and then rebuild it the way you like it. There are enough things to worry about doing this swap you don’t need engine problems. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Anonymous Posted July 24, 2002 Share Posted July 24, 2002 Wow thanks for the info. I really like the idea of having a lot of power, but I am leaning more towards having a smaller hp engine and put nitrous in it for fun once in awhile. What would be recommended for this kind of a setup. like compression ratio. Is nitrous really harmful to these types of engines? i only plan on going as high as a 150 shot at the most Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike C Posted July 24, 2002 Share Posted July 24, 2002 Just stick with the 355 combo I outlined above with the forged flat tops. ~9.5:1 so you can run pump gas. Race motors on nitrous use up to 15:1 compression, but obviously the fuel cost would kill you on a driver! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
danc Posted July 25, 2002 Share Posted July 25, 2002 DPG Hammer I have a Fastburn 385/700R4/390:1 rear end in an 83ZX, and it runs REALLY good with no problems. It is came relatively complete, is very streetable, had a one year parts guarentee, and cost around $4,000. You can see the specs at Jim Pace or several other WEB sites. As stated in another post, the addition of the LT-4 "Hot-Cam" kit with a roller hydraulic cam and 1.6 rockers puts out an honest 430 H.P. and 430 Ft. Lbs of toque with a 780 Holley. The cost for the upgrade is around $900. (also need taller valve covers because of the 1.6 Rockers). I talked to several engine builders, and their reply was universal... If you want 500 H.P.+ "call me" if not buy a crate! (Did I mention that it runs REALLY good! Good Luck. Dan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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