Guest Mukrat Posted June 8, 2004 Share Posted June 8, 2004 I am seeing alot of older model Z hybrid conversions. Has anyone, or IS anyone attempting a hybrid conversion on the new 350Z? I have an 04 350Z Track and have been pondering the best way to get max power from the V6 already in the car. So far the after market on the Z is young but growing up fast. Theres alot of options for engine mods including some Twin Turbos and Superchargers. The problem encountered more often then not is that the VQ35DE (Stock 350Z Engine) has a 10.5:1 compression ratio and is an aluminum block. This means it cant hold more then 8 or 9 PSI Boost (Turbo) or 9 pound pully (10 psi) from a Supercharger without risking detonation. So far the most HP/Trq gained from the TT/SC kits is around 420/350ish. Now there is a stroker kit also that can put the hp into the 500+ ranges. Cost on this route tho is upwards of 20K+, thats a stroker kit plus Twin Turbo. So I did some thinking... What if a V8 could be fit into the engine compartment of that 350Z. Say a Chevy smallblock 383 Crate motor. Were talking a good 400+ hp/trq from a bare bones crate motor that costs only $4500ish dollars! Throw on some extras to actually make it run properly and maybe it will cost $5500ish? Sounds like a FAR better option to get better power then the Stroker+TT/SC route to me! Sure it's not the same stock engine, but then bolting on a Stroker and TT/SC kind of nulls the stock effect also! Soo... I am wondering if anyone has or IS doing something liek this. Someone out there looking for a guinea pig to test this on? I am open for options and ideas. Why would I want to do something like this to a brand new car? because I LOVE the Z body, looks and handling. BUT I also love the sound and feel of butt in the seat power in a V8. How to get both? HYBRID Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
datsunlover Posted June 8, 2004 Share Posted June 8, 2004 Hey man, welcome to the board! And uh.. thats a crazy thing to think about doing to a brand new 350z.... I'd say DO IT!! And Im sure you could get good $$$ selling off the stock 350z motor/trans to fund this little hybrid project! Heck, that would be a nice powertrain to drop into MY 280z... but ANyway... I'd be prepard for some serious custom fab work, and possibly space/clearance issues.. I'd say start by measuring the engine bay of the 350z to see exactly how much room you have in there to stuff some american iron. Not that you'll get it here, but be prepared for lots of negative feedback from.. heck.. pretty much evryone else.. But If you really want to do this, go for it man! I put a chev V8 in an 85 Mazda RX7, and I heard it all. But it fit, it worked, and it was damn fast! I think you'll like it here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Mukrat Posted June 8, 2004 Share Posted June 8, 2004 Nay sayers be damned! Those of you that have hybrid conversions... Do you have any problems with your car as an everyday driver? I know gas will kill me, but I'm not worried about gas. More important to me is the drivability and reliability. I havent touched an engince this way since the late 80's, I feel like a virgin again :giggle: But my objective isn't to win compassion from my 350Z piers, my objective is much easier and simpler... power and speed. Both 1/4 and top end is what I want. The 350Z is beutiful, IMO, and Nissan made a great car. But it is lacking the HP that has been sinonimous with the Z tag. So i'm going to put the power back into it, one way or the other! Maybe if I can find a front recked Z, or a :cough: power train stripped :cough: Z it would make things alot easier. Doing it alone is the hard part Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tim240z Posted June 8, 2004 Share Posted June 8, 2004 I say wait another year or so, then find a wrecked Blue Devil Vette, and pull the drivetrain and transplant it!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
80LS1T Posted June 8, 2004 Share Posted June 8, 2004 Man you took the thoughts right out of my head! I totally think the 350Z is underpowder and it deffinetly needs a power upgrade some sort! But you are deffintely on your own on this one. I dont think any one else has the balls to gut a new 350Z and put a SBC or any other engine in it instead. I say if you got the balls to do it then give'r hell! Guy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Mukrat Posted June 8, 2004 Share Posted June 8, 2004 Man you took the thoughts right out of my head! I totally think the 350Z is underpowder and it deffinetly needs a power upgrade some sort! But you are deffintely on your own on this one. I dont think any one else has the balls to gut a new 350Z and put a SBC or any other engine in it instead. I say if you got the balls to do it then give'r hell! Guy Oh I have the balls and the gumption. it's the return investment I am a little nervous about. I want the power but I need the reliability. Thats why I came to this forum and seek advice from the hybrid "pros". Like I was saying earlier. Money is a big factor and it seems to me more cost efficient to put a crate motor in the car for 10K (At the VERY most) then to spend 20K+ on a ticking bomb. Keep the advise and encouragment coming! I am like a reed in the wind, swaying back and forth. Just waiting for that gail to hit me Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tim240z Posted June 8, 2004 Share Posted June 8, 2004 Where do you live? Are emissions a concern? If so then a crate motor is likely out of the question.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
80LS1T Posted June 8, 2004 Share Posted June 8, 2004 Well if you want reliablilty & drivablily then carb'd(sorry carb'd guys ) is out of the question. I say go LS1. Great EFI, great HP & TQ stock, and the aftermarket is getting bigger and bigger all the time for that engine. The LS1 seems to be an extremly reliable engine even when the HP is increased. How much power are you looking for? What kind of 1/4 mile times do you want? Guy Oh yeah and how much does that car weight, just out of curiousity? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Mukrat Posted June 8, 2004 Share Posted June 8, 2004 Well if you want reliablilty & drivablily then carb'd(sorry carb'd guys ) is out of the question. I say go LS1. Great EFI' date=' great HP & TQ stock, and the aftermarket is getting bigger and bigger all the time for that engine. The LS1 seems to be an extremly reliable engine even when the HP is increased. How much power are you looking for? What kind of 1/4 mile times do you want? Guy Oh yeah and how much does that car weight, just out of curiousity? [/quote'] Well, I live in Maryland so emissions is a 5 year thing for new cars. But if I produce the engine numbers for a 1975? (Maybe 72?) or older style engine then emissions are skipped, if my information is correct. Emissions here are a visual check with a pipe snesor, IIRC, it's been a long time since I had to go to emissions testing. Maybe things have changed so not totally sure about that part. How big is the LS1? I am not real familiar with newer engines like that. I know the carb'd smallblocks pretty well, in terms of working on them. But way out of date on there mods and upgrades etc... it's been some 14+ years since I touched one. As for what 1/4 times am I looking for? Lets just say I want to be "required" to install a rollbar at the track. The track model Z that I have is 3200ish pounds, about 200 pounds less then the other models. Plus I got a bare bones Track Model, I don't need a navigation system for to go around the corners of a track or a straight line for 1/4 of a mile. In terms of HP I am simply looking for biggest bang for buck. the 383 Crate motor I saw was listed at $4300ish and put out over 400hp. THAT is bang for buck IMO. $2000 in fabrication would be no sweat because it is Still waaayy under the 20K that would be needed to come close with the stock engine build up. But I am totally up for ideas in the drivetrain department. Whats the LS1 with tranny going for these days? Maybe it is a better option to look at. For a hybrid on a budget I would say I want to try and stay under $10K total to make a reliable fast 350Z that will beat the pants off the stock or even a little modded Z06. There isnt much in the are thats faster, and still very few Z06 at that. Mostly muscle cars and "rice burners" in this neck of the woods. With the Z06 being pretty much top dog for street legal cars, or the very very few Vipers. EDIT: Oh and I don't mind a little tuning now and then. Heck if I didnt want to do any of that I wouldnt be looking at the Hybrid option. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dan Juday Posted June 8, 2004 Share Posted June 8, 2004 You are way ahead of the wave on this one. I'm sure there are plenty of guys even on this site whos jaws dropped when they read your post, mine included. Still a great idea. I can't imagine a better candidate than the LS1 for the swap. Seeing that engine bay, whatever goes in there needs to be compact, light, and up to date. If you can engineer, fab, weld, and sort out all the electrical yourself I bet you can do it for $10k (on top of whatever you get for the Z drivetrain). If you plan on hiring out forget it. Twin turbos and stroking would be cheaper. You'll be the star here... and hated like the devil everywhere else. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Mukrat Posted June 8, 2004 Share Posted June 8, 2004 Soo.. what are the specs on the LS1 plus tranny? How much can they be gotten for? I will work on getting the specs on the engine compartment and bell housing diameter (Body cavity size) from the tranny. It's a big tranny, so should be plenty of room. It's sounding like an LS1 would be the way to go. I could prolly do the wiring, I work with computer components and no stranger to sodering iron. The engine compartment fabrication I would have to have someone else do for sure tho. As long as the engine fits length and witdh wise, I know someone that can fabricate the hood to fit. And whats a VQ35DE plus Tranny go for these days? Motor has 9k on it, tranny is a brand new replacement with 900 miles on it. I feel a gust of wind coming on... and it brings a with it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
80LS1T Posted June 8, 2004 Share Posted June 8, 2004 Well do you want an LS1 with a 6 speed manual tranny or the 4 speed auto? LS1 + T56(6 speed manual) are usually in the ballpark of $3000-$4000 for the engine all accesories, harness, and pcm. Im not sure what years are the best. They upgraded the intake and heads I think in 2001, but Im not 100% sure on that either. LS1 + 4L60e is usually about $500-$700 less than the T56 combo. The LS1 is a 350cid(well its a little under 350, something like 346") Multiport EFI engine out of a 98-002 Camaro, TA, Firbirds and Corvettes(they also came in the 97 Vettes). Stock they are rated from 305-320HP depending on year and what it came out of. Then there is the Z06 engine LS6 which is rated at 405HP. Look at some of "mas280" posts. He is running an LS1 in his car and his putting down 398RWHP with just a cam, good intake, and good headers. And he runs a 11.2 in is car! The LS1 is the latest and greatest on here and now everyone wants one after seeing just what they can do with very minimal mods to the engine. If you supercharged one you would be just about unstoppable on the street. Now does your car already have the big brakes and good suspension? If so you got that covered so no money needs to be spent there. Since your car is new you wont need to do body work or interior. The only thing that concerns me is trying to make your gauges work. Im sure theres a way though. There always is! Guy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Mukrat Posted June 8, 2004 Share Posted June 8, 2004 I must say you guys are great for insentive and ideas But I just got the dimensions for the Fast Burn 383, LS1 and LS6... Looks like a pipe dream. There isnt enough room in the engine compartment to make it fit without doing some serious fabrications to the wheel wells. Length wise it is close, but doable. But it' dousnt look doable with the current budget All hope is not lost yet tho... I may be back! I'm gonna start shoping for front end recked Z I really want to do this swap. I think it would be the badest thing on the street! But it will have to shelved to "project car" status. Thanks for all the input gang! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qwik240z Posted June 8, 2004 Share Posted June 8, 2004 Well if you want reliablilty & drivablily then carb'd(sorry carb'd guys ) is out of the question. I say go LS1. Great EFI' date=' great HP & TQ stock, and the aftermarket is getting bigger and bigger all the time for that engine. The LS1 seems to be an extremly reliable engine even when the HP is increased. How much power are you looking for? What kind of 1/4 mile times do you want? Guy Oh yeah and how much does that car weight, just out of curiousity? [/quote'] Well, I live in Maryland so emissions is a 5 year thing for new cars. But if I produce the engine numbers for a 1975? (Maybe 72?) or older style engine then emissions are skipped, if my information is correct. Emissions here are a visual check with a pipe snesor, IIRC, it's been a long time since I had to go to emissions testing. Maybe things have changed so not totally sure about that part. How big is the LS1? I am not real familiar with newer engines like that. I know the carb'd smallblocks pretty well, in terms of working on them. But way out of date on there mods and upgrades etc... it's been some 14+ years since I touched one. As for what 1/4 times am I looking for? Lets just say I want to be "required" to install a rollbar at the track. The track model Z that I have is 3200ish pounds, about 200 pounds less then the other models. Plus I got a bare bones Track Model, I don't need a navigation system for to go around the corners of a track or a straight line for 1/4 of a mile. In terms of HP I am simply looking for biggest bang for buck. the 383 Crate motor I saw was listed at $4300ish and put out over 400hp. THAT is bang for buck IMO. $2000 in fabrication would be no sweat because it is Still waaayy under the 20K that would be needed to come close with the stock engine build up. But I am totally up for ideas in the drivetrain department. Whats the LS1 with tranny going for these days? Maybe it is a better option to look at. For a hybrid on a budget I would say I want to try and stay under $10K total to make a reliable fast 350Z that will beat the pants off the stock or even a little modded Z06. There isnt much in the are thats faster, and still very few Z06 at that. Mostly muscle cars and "rice burners" in this neck of the woods. With the Z06 being pretty much top dog for street legal cars, or the very very few Vipers. EDIT: Oh and I don't mind a little tuning now and then. Heck if I didnt want to do any of that I wouldnt be looking at the Hybrid option. I too live in Maryland (Potomac, where are you?) and I am currently installing an LS1 in my 240Z. I have a 2002 Maxima with a VQ motor and the LS1 is no wider than the VQ. I measured my LS1 Block and at the widest point it is 18". I believe it will fit in the 350Z. The LS1 is probably the best choice for your car as you will get reliability, power, and probably reduce the weight too. You can take a Camaro or Trans am motor, add a cam,new springs and retainers, headers, an air intake system and some tuning and get 400RWHP like MAS280 did. If you need it to remain emissions legal, it can be done as Briguy did with his in California. You can get a supercharger to add another 100-200HP too. If you want to come and see my motor or if you need more info on the LS1 please email me at: qwik510@aol.com I would love to help you and follow along on your project! See this link for pics of my project: http://www.classiczcars.com/photopost/showgallery.php?cat=3083&ppuser=4628 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillZ260 Posted June 8, 2004 Share Posted June 8, 2004 There should be NO nay sayers on this site. Caught of guard, maybe a bit but everyone here should cheer you on. If you can handle cutting up a new car, more power to ya, keep us informed of your 'mission'. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Savage42 Posted June 8, 2004 Share Posted June 8, 2004 Heck, I'd do the same thing if I were you. Never have been impressed with the lack of power of the stock setup. If qwik240 is right about being close on size, then it may be more of a matter of sheet metal and wheel well work than anything major. Good luck, I know that many of us are rooting for you. 8) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Aaron Posted June 8, 2004 Share Posted June 8, 2004 I have to agree. As wide as the twin cam motors are, I thing a pushrod V8 should fit fine. There was someone on here that posted shots of a 350Z with an RB26 (inline six in case you are unfamiliar) installed. It was real long, and the radiator was relocated, and the support modified, so I don' think length will be an issue. I would love to see it done. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
datsunlover Posted June 8, 2004 Share Posted June 8, 2004 Something that just came to mind here.. I know this is the chevy forum.. but have/would you consider a ford power plant? As far as I know, the 302 is a bit smaller than the chevy smal block, and can be built to roughly the same specs...maybe it would be a better fit in the 350z's engine bay? Just an idea. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Savage42 Posted June 8, 2004 Share Posted June 8, 2004 Something that just came to mind here.. I know this is the chevy forum.. but have/would you consider a ford power plant? As far as I know, the 302 is a bit smaller than the chevy smal block, and can be built to roughly the same specs...maybe it would be a better fit in the 350z's engine bay? Just an idea. NO, don't do it!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
datsunlover Posted June 8, 2004 Share Posted June 8, 2004 NO, don't do it!! Yah yah, I know. Heck, I opted for the Chev in my RX, you know 'Take yer silly import and Chev it!' I figure in my situation, the ford might have been a better fit (front mounted dizzy, smaller overall dimentions, stangs came with headers and 5 speed, ect) but I knew more Chev ppl than ford ppl (Read; Free parts and help evrywhere!) so that's the way it happened. I figured someone would say something about my *cough*ford*cough* coment though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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