Guest WHITEBOY Posted March 8, 2005 Share Posted March 8, 2005 My 240 has solid motor mount stands welded to the frame. The motor is 1 inch farther back then the jtr kit. The car came with shorty headers. The guy who originally built the car had hooker full lengths on it. The problem is that I have a really hot engine all ready to drop in, but it has angle plug heads. I found some Motorsports engineering 1 3/4 full length headers. The add says they work with angle plug heads, but I can't get a hold of them. Has anybody used these headers, and how did they fit? Does anybody have a phone number for this co? Has anybody used angle plug heads with some other header that is available? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
awd92gsx Posted March 8, 2005 Share Posted March 8, 2005 1 inch farther back? Man...I think that'd put the distributor right smack dab in the firewall on an HEI setup. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jt1 Posted March 8, 2005 Share Posted March 8, 2005 Headers have been discussed extensively in these two recent threads, one of which is even on the front page. http://forums.hybridz.org/showthread.php?t=98544 http://forums.hybridz.org/showthread.php?t=97989 Do some research. John Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest WHITEBOY Posted March 8, 2005 Share Posted March 8, 2005 1 inch farther back? Man...I think that'd put the distributor right smack dab in the firewall on an HEI setup. Can't use HEI. I have a MSD pro billet, and I am happy with the location of the motor. The car is to ran on the street, and this will help with weight balance/weight transfer/traction. What kind of headers do you run? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest WHITEBOY Posted March 8, 2005 Share Posted March 8, 2005 Headers have been discussed extensively in these two recent threads' date=' one of which is even on the front page. http://forums.hybridz.org/showthread.php?t=98544 http://forums.hybridz.org/showthread.php?t=97989 Do some research. John I have done my research. Sounds like you need to read the threads to me. There is no mention of Motorsports Engineering headers in these threads. I would like to know how they fit, and if they are well built. They are the only ones I can find to work with my angle plug heads. The car in my avatar is not the car in question. That is my chassis car, and it runs 5.54/126 in the 1/8 on pump gas. I have custom built 2 inch headers on it. I just purchased the car that I want to build as a real driver. It still has the irs and factory front suspension, and all that is new to me. I am terribally sorry to bother you John, but I am trying to get this car running ASAP. I thought one of you guys could help out. What kind of headers do you run? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
awd92gsx Posted March 8, 2005 Share Posted March 8, 2005 Isn't Motorsports Engineering the company that builds the V8 kit for MSA? I'm running some 1-5/8 blockhuggers I got off of Ebay for like $60. They have 3/8" flanges and actually seem to fit very nicely. I originally beat them in slightly to clear the steering shaft, but, once I figured out what the real problem is they clear the shaft fine and no beating should be necessary. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest WHITEBOY Posted March 8, 2005 Share Posted March 8, 2005 Isn't Motorsports Engineering the company that builds the V8 kit for MSA? I'm running some 1-5/8 blockhuggers I got off of Ebay for like $60. They have 3/8" flanges and actually seem to fit very nicely. I originally beat them in slightly to clear the steering shaft' date=' but, once I figured out what the real problem is they clear the shaft fine and no beating should be necessary.[/quote'] I really want full length headers, but I would settle for some shorties that would work with angle plug heads. Are yours angle plug? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
awd92gsx Posted March 8, 2005 Share Posted March 8, 2005 No, just plain ole straight plugs. Most block huggers work fine (some require slight modification - IE...a BFH). So, if you can find a set that work with angled plugs you should be OK. There is a company that makes a set of full length headers (S&S Engineering) but it appears as though alot of people have problems with them rubbing the ground because they go so far down. My car is lowered quite a bit, so, those headers weren't an option for me. Plus, I'm on an extremely tight budget. (IE...I'm poor!!). Amongst folks who have 10's of thousands of dollars invested into their engine swap, I only have around $1800 total into the swap. So, I'm ok with $60 Ebay headers as long as they work. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest WHITEBOY Posted March 8, 2005 Share Posted March 8, 2005 No' date=' just plain ole straight plugs. Most block huggers work fine (some require slight modification - IE...a BFH). So, if you can find a set that work with angled plugs you should be OK. There is a company that makes a set of full length headers (S&S Engineering) but it appears as though alot of people have problems with them rubbing the ground because they go so far down. My car is lowered quite a bit, so, those headers weren't an option for me. Plus, I'm on an extremely tight budget. (IE...I'm poor!!). Amongst folks who have 10's of thousands of dollars invested into their engine swap, I only have around $1800 total into the swap. So, I'm ok with $60 Ebay headers as long as they work.[/quote'] Well, that's a beautiful car you have there. It doesn't look low budget. Nice job. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pparaska Posted March 8, 2005 Share Posted March 8, 2005 Hasn't it been determined that MSA's V8 swap headers are just the S&S 5205 headers for 30s-40s Fords with the SBC? Is Motorsport Engineering a part of MSA? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buZy Posted March 8, 2005 Share Posted March 8, 2005 Im running msa mounts, hooker long tube headers with angle plug alum heads. Had to "dent" one of the primary tubes to clear a plug. #8 on the passenger side. No big deal the motor runs just fine with more than ample power. Hope maybe this help you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest WHITEBOY Posted March 8, 2005 Share Posted March 8, 2005 Im running msa mounts, hooker long tube headers with angle plug alum heads. Had to "dent" one of the primary tubes to clear a plug. #8 on the passenger side. No big deal the motor runs just fine with more than ample power. Hope maybe this help you. Yeah that helps a lot. I know these headers will fit my car, because that's what the original owner used. Now I know they can be used with angle plug heads. One more question though. What kind of alum heads are yours? The header guys say straight plug headers can be used with trick flow & GM angle plugs, but most other aftermarket angle plug heads will not work with straight plug headers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rags Posted March 8, 2005 Share Posted March 8, 2005 I'm using long tube Hooker headers, GM angle plug heads and motor in the Scarab position. Joe Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jt1 Posted March 8, 2005 Share Posted March 8, 2005 Google, Motorsport engineering headers, 5th result: "Motorsport Engineering" sells a V8 conversion kit. This company is, if I remember correctly, run by a former Motorsport Auto person. This is a fairly complete kit, consisting of the following: 1) Four-row, cross-flow radiator that uses the stock mounts. 2) Fan shroud. 3) Radiator hoses, clamps, and in-line filler. 4) Engine and trans mounts. 5) Floor-mounted auto trans shifter. 6) driveshaft w/replaceable U-joints. 7) Block-Hugger headers. 8) Electric fuel pump. 9) Stock fuel pump block off plate. 10) Throttle cable. 11) Kick down cable. 12) Speedo cable. 13) Hood latch and bracket. 14) Easy to Understand installation manual. This appears to be a very complete kit, and costs $2,335.00, plus UPS shipping. This kit uses a set back engine position, similar to the one recommended from Jaguars That Run, although the engine mount adapters are different. Motorsport Engineering A division of Silverado Industries Inc. 12510 Gayle Lane Nevada City, CA 95959 (916) 274-2331 Have you tried contacting them and didn't get a reply? I didn't find any webpage info, but this mentions blockhuggers instead of full length. The MSA headers are the S&S 5205. They will work in the JTR position but are low and tight to the footwells. If you're 1" back from the JTR (firewall mods?) they are going to be real close to the footwells. I'm running a set of S&S's with the collectors rotated down 5 deg, which still wasn't enough. The S&S's have excellent spark plug clearance with my angle plug Canfields. John Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Psykovertible Posted March 8, 2005 Share Posted March 8, 2005 i was all hot and moist over the prospect of getting the S&S headers which is one of the reasons i went with the MSA kit. However....... the MSA kit apppears to be only 0.25 inches forward of JTR mounting, 0.25 inches higher than JTR on passenger side and surprisingly lower on the driver side by thickness of set back plate which is 0.31 inch thick according to my JTR manual on driver side. is there really any notable difference..... am i missing somthing.... or is my math screwed. MSA setback mounts are 2 inch box tube. driver side has 0.25 inch plate that raises the mount for steering clearance. rubber mount is same. there are no other parts. JTR has the set back plate and the spacers. can someone with a JTR book check my math please. if i am right there is no notable benefit of MSA vs JTR when talking about long tube headers Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buZy Posted March 8, 2005 Share Posted March 8, 2005 Hey Whiteboy, The heads are alum Eldelbrock heads. Angle plugs. Think they are a few years old because that's all they say. Written in the older 'old school' cursive script on the front of the head, drivers side. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest WHITEBOY Posted March 9, 2005 Share Posted March 9, 2005 V8 Full Length Headers, 70-78 Z Code: 10-1832 Price: $439.95 Quantity in Basket: NoneThese full length headers have 1 3/4" primaries, and are intended for medium to high horsepower applications. They will fit both angle plug and straight plug heads. Oversized Package This is the add I found at the Z STORE. They are available for the Motorsports swap kit. I'm just worried they won't fit due to my engine being back an extra inch. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest WHITEBOY Posted March 9, 2005 Share Posted March 9, 2005 Oh yeah, I can't get a hold of anybody about them from the Z Store or Motorsports. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikelly Posted March 9, 2005 Share Posted March 9, 2005 I had a set of those headers in hand and I'll add a couple of comments and ask a few questionts in my quest to aid you in your need for info on this issue. I currently HAVE a set of S&S headers and I'm assisting with the build up of another members car at a local shop.. So I think I'm kinda qualified here... The S&S header has at least as GOOD a ground clearance (If not more) than the MSA header offered in the V8 kit (As has been mentioned... Same header!) ... and it appears that the S&S isn't the best solution for ground clearance... Are you going to LOWER the car? Are you worried about ground clearance? Do you plan to drive the car into parking lost or steep driveway? If you answered YES to any of these, the MSA header is gonna be an issue... The S&S header and the MSA header are NOW the same header... Only difference I'm aware of from the late 90s is the rotation of the merge collector... Just keep in mind that on a car with 4 inches clearance from the frame rail to the ground, the header had about 2 3/4 inches to concrete... We have bought back a little clearance with Jim's car and mine by doing the whole slip fit exhaust meathod and losing the three bolt flange... I still think I'm going to have to raise the coil overs to get the cars up a bit... These are road race track day/ instructional cars, so it isn't THAT big a deal, but for daily street and strip use, you will have issues. I'm absolutly of the opinion that a custom header shop will have to step up to resolve this issue... The S&S folks are not interested in tweeking their design for better fitment. They are of the opinion that their desing is "The" best solution available, never mind the complaints about lack of ground clearance and poor fitment issues... I'm convinced they are smoking crack, but that is another story for another day... the S&S system is the best solution currently "mass" produced, and I use that term loosly! Cheers and good luck... Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikelly Posted March 9, 2005 Share Posted March 9, 2005 Forgot to mention further... You can get those headers direct from S&S for $379 PLUS shipping... Cheers... Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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