Jeff Posted November 26, 2006 Share Posted November 26, 2006 280ZForce, the straps are mounted incorrectly in your pics... Look online for mounting instructions, but those straps should be at a 45 degree angle below your shoulders. They need to be anchered below those holes in the seat BIG TIME... That isn't correct Mike unless the seats are specifically rated for it. If the belts angle too much it can cause a spinal compression injury in a collision. Here is a link to the Schroth installation instructions. Click here. The click on Lap, Shoulder - and anti sub routing. They recommend horizontal to a max of 20 degrees down. Here is a fairly lengthy discussion over on Corner Carvers about 6 point harness mounting. Click here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikelly Posted November 26, 2006 Share Posted November 26, 2006 Jeff, That's news to me. When I was at SEMA a few weeks ago I specifically spoke with the folks at the simpson booth and the GForce Booth about safety and harnesses. Interesting concept from Schroth... Everything I've read has been 45 degrees, not 20 degrees. Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Posted November 26, 2006 Share Posted November 26, 2006 I'm about to buy harnesses so this is a timely thread and I've been doing some research Mike. I'm probably going with the G-Force Pro 6 point setup. The G-Force directions actually say acceptable angles are from 5* down to 30* up which really shocked me. Here is a link to the G-Force PDF installation instructions. Scroll down to page 2 and you'll see what I'm talking about. Click here. They talk a good bit about spinal compression injuries due to excessive angle. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mom'sZ Posted November 27, 2006 Author Share Posted November 27, 2006 Jeff: thanks for the great links. The discussion on corner carvers really helped me understand the 6 point and 7 point thing, now I'm convinced I want one. It seems there is more then one way to install the leg straps. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Posted November 27, 2006 Share Posted November 27, 2006 Jeff: thanks for the great links. The discussion on corner carvers really helped me understand the 6 point and 7 point thing, now I'm convinced I want one. It seems there is more then one way to install the leg straps. The Corner Carver crowd can be intense but they do bring the tech, glad it helped! It does appear there are options on how to install the subs on the 6 point harness. I like the idea of mounting them to the same points as the lap belt so that's what I'm going to try. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest 280ZForce Posted November 27, 2006 Share Posted November 27, 2006 280ZForce: yes a pic of it would be greatoh and cam lock all the way... no doubt about that. I was told NOT to mount the harness straps at a downward angle because of spiral compression and other related injuries or death under extreme circumstances' date=' so I went w/ what I and the shop thought was a safe mount (then I had them weld the cross bar), which was having them level w/ the seat harness holes. To mount the straps...run the shoulder strap from the front of the seat out the back, manuever it in through the 1st cinch and over the middle hump and down between the 2nd cinch. Then take the strap and run it under the mount bar and then up and over it. Bring the strap back to the cinch and run it through it. The extra you can just flip over the bar as shown in my 1st pic. hope this helps w/ mounting. Click pics to make larger... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mom'sZ Posted November 27, 2006 Author Share Posted November 27, 2006 I was told NOT to mount the harness straps at a downward angle ... so I went w/ ...having them level w/ the seat harness holes. From what I've read so far, that seems right hope this helps w/ mounting. excellent...thats perfect now I understand. I'm still not sure what kind will work best for me. But I'm thinking the roll bar mount style will work and save me having to weld tabs on to the hoop. I'm going to call and order a seat and harness tommorow. I've got the last three weeks of Dec. and 1st week of Jan. off to install safety stuff and hopfully be ready for the track in Jan or Feb. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest 280ZForce Posted November 27, 2006 Share Posted November 27, 2006 From what I've read so far' date=' that seems right excellent...thats perfect now I understand. I'm still not sure what kind will work best for me. But I'm thinking the roll bar mount style will work and save me having to weld tabs on to the hoop. I'm going to call and order a seat and harness tommorow. I've got the last three weeks of Dec. and 1st week of Jan. off to install safety stuff and hopfully be ready for the track in Jan or Feb.[/quote'] awesome, glad I could help. Let us know how it turns out for ya. Yeah, I helped a guy at my school who autocrosses his bmw coupe and he has it all caged and stripped down to nothing. He had his shoulder harnesses straight back (completely horizontally...like mine) but they were bolted all the way in the back of the car where his rear seat used to be and he hated how it looked. He saw mine and liked it some I helped him adjust his and get his all strapped up right behind the seats kinda like mine, and it cleaned things up for him cuz you didn't see his harnesses outstretched across the inside of the car. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikelly Posted November 27, 2006 Share Posted November 27, 2006 Thanks for this post guys... YOu've taught an old dawg new tricks. Now I need to go have a discussion with two individuals I spoke with at SEMA (Kept their business cards). Seems there's a TON of bad info being passed on this very subject. You'd think they would know more about their products than that, but BOTH told me no more than 45 degrees DOWN, and neither mentioned what I just read posted on the Gforce or the Simpson sites... Amazing... Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mom'sZ Posted December 12, 2006 Author Share Posted December 12, 2006 I got my harness a couple days ago. It says roll bar mount on the box. Here's a picture of the end of one of the shoulder harnesses I'm guesing that you remove the snap ring on the end and just use the three bar adjuster to wrap it around the roll bar cross brace? Can anyone confirm? Also I got some FIA roll cage padding (very expensive) and man that stuff is hard as a rock. I mean you can barely push your finger into it. I suppose it would hurt less then smacking your head on the roll cage. It's very stiff as well, it will be tough to bend onto curves. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Posted December 12, 2006 Share Posted December 12, 2006 Yes, remove the snap ring and wrap it around the roll bar. Then adjust the length to fit your setup. My G-force harnesses came in the other day and have the same setup. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mom'sZ Posted December 12, 2006 Author Share Posted December 12, 2006 Thanks Jeff, what did you get 4, 5, 6, or 7 point? I got the 6 point. Tried to order the sub strap but the guy said it was totally unnessasary with the 6 point. May still order it later once I get to installing this stuff, still waiting on my seat. (FIA approved MOMO start) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Posted December 12, 2006 Share Posted December 12, 2006 I went with a 5 point setup but mine is a street car that I run track events with. If it was a dedicated race car I would have gone with a six point setup as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mom'sZ Posted December 12, 2006 Author Share Posted December 12, 2006 Jeff: to what are you planning on mounting the crotch strap to? Weld in a plate to bottom of floor board? seat mount? just wondering Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bjhines Posted December 12, 2006 Share Posted December 12, 2006 ok... the crotch strap has been a point of contention recently... I have used 5 point harnesses up to now... on 240Zs... I always mounted the sub strap to the floor just in front of the seat bottom...just outside the frame-rail extension... using washers or welded plates... That brings it up past the front seat-mount stamping in a straight line to the seat hole... That is apparently NOT the correct mounting point for the 6 point harness... I have been told that the 6 point harness must mount directly under the seat... just in front of the groin position... the schroth site says under or behind groin.. I'll have to clear that up first... The Schroth website confirms that the "old way" was right(for 5 point systems)... but the new and improved 6 point system has updated mounting needs... I am welding in hard points for both positions on my new car... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mom'sZ Posted December 12, 2006 Author Share Posted December 12, 2006 bjhines: my understanding was that the 6 point leg straps mount to the same area as the lap harness. I've read a bunch of the material linked in this thread and a bunch over at corner carvers too but still am not completely clear on how I'm going to mount it. My harness came with zero documentation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doublexl240z Posted December 12, 2006 Share Posted December 12, 2006 Moms'z, I will be going to the PRI show on Thurs and Fri, can go to the man. of your harness and get directions. They usually will have have the big hitters(engineers) due to the technical nature of the show. I have always mounted them behind the groin area. Which seems to make sense because their job is to keep you back in your seat. But,,, when its installed in a race seat it comes through the hole in the base, what happens below that hole really shouldn't matter all that much. Another thing to consider when you are mounting your shoulder belts is what head and neck restraint you are going to use and follow their directions!!! HANS has particular directions on theirs and I've moved peoples belt bars in the past to accomadate that. Another option is the Isaac system really slick and technically makes more sense than the Hans. Lastly, I have an R200 with a pretty rare set of gears (4.375:1)and an R200 short nose that has a 4.08:1 ratio in it. The 4.375 only came in the Skyline or from Nismo. The shortnose came from a 240sx but the gears will fit any R200. Just another gear option for you!! Call me if you want 407.463.0312 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bjhines Posted December 12, 2006 Share Posted December 12, 2006 What happens past the holes in the race seat is very important... Always remember.. the belts hold you AND the seat in the car... You don't want the routing and mounting of the belts to collaspe the seat in ANY WAY... or you may come out shorter and one with the seat... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnc Posted December 12, 2006 Share Posted December 12, 2006 FYI... both SCCA and NASA will require 6 point seat belt mounting at some point in the near future. They already require them for open cockpit cars. If you're buying a new harness system, get a 6 point. Also, check the dates on the harnesses you buy and return anything that's over 3 months old. SCCA and NASA require harness replacement after 5 years and they are making noises about requiring replacement after 3. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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