Tony D
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Posts posted by Tony D
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Wow, I thought it looked like exhaust tubing! 0.063 wall...not for me!
I once had occasion (and believe I may have it on a VIDEO someplace) of seeing a Jeep CJ3B that went airborne, inverted, and landed on what LOOKED to be a substantial rool hoop. In fact, it was cast drain piping that was butt-welded from straight sections and elbows. Shattered on impact, pinning the driver under the vehicle. From all outward appearances it looked just like a brand-name commercially produced roll hoop. To think people do this kind of stuff is scary. Ignorance / Stupidity is one thing, but to do it intentionally whatever the reason is criminal. I hope nobody actually charged to do that job, and it was just some misinformed homebased hobby-builder who didn't know any better.
I have teched some stuff where it was obvious someone welded washers into thinner tubing to give the appearance that the tubing used was 'specification'...that was a short tech session.
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#12 in my case...
When we were doing prep underneath the Hemi, the combination of a Santa Ana Summer Day, a Blasting Hood, and several hours of sweat matted me to look like Capn' Jack. Normally my Parakeets will 'groom' the strands when I return home and sit down, they got close, sniffed and fleww off---causing my wife and son much entertainment.
So from a Parakeet's point of view, there is much funk in a day-old sandblasting beard. For myself though, I didn't notice a thing...
Then again, bacon falling into my lap from breakfast is not an uncommon occurance, either, so maybe I'm not the best hygenic example...
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There is a fuel pulsation dampener available (JeffP installed one on his car after installing the 720cc injectors) and for the price it really eases the job of the fuel pressure regulator. With that little accumulator/bladder arrangement the pulsations are evened out quite a bit meaning the FPR is not slamming open and closed to try and maintain the same line pressure---if you have smallish supply lines that will be an issue.
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Agreed, the dash gauge is useless. Use a gauge that is known to be accurate.
As long as the engine temperature is above 170F, all the stock ECU functions will be so near the 'normal operating temperature' status it will affect nothing (technically the magic number is 177F.....)
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This is why I say 'chemical overall, and blast spots'...
This did not stop me from snatching up a 185CFM Diesel Driven I-R Portable Compressor when I had the opportunity. Hey, it works, and can run those big commercial hoppers you see at the rental yards... Free is Free! It also makes a jackhammer/chipper work wonders on my clay soil and granite outcroppings in the back yard, especially when it's time to set fenceposts.
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..."tow bill and parts bill exceeds wifes allowable "stupid tax" limit."
Hello' date=' Triple A? I need a tow from Tustin to Riverside. Yeah, my number is blah blah blah...
Uh huh, what do you mean I don't have Platinum Plus Service any more?
WHO cancelled it?
WHEN?
No, I'll just drive it home, I was hoping to save the turbo...but maybe I can get it home without using boost much...
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Next Call:
Honey, why did you cancel the Platinum Plus AAA Service? Oh, it was $100 a year instead of $68 and it was 'wasted money'?
You do realize now I will have to drive my car home with a bad turbo, and it might burn up the bearings, it's howling like mad if I boost it. You saving $32 a year in tow service 'we never use' by cancelling it the month BEFORE MSA, will likely cost us $752 for a new turbo!
No, I'm not paying for it! YOU cancelled the service, you are going to buy my new turbo, honey! There goes your Emerald Ring this June! (And no lie, that is EXACTLY where the money came from: Emerald Ring Fund! Took her 6 years to get that ring...)
Every time she wears that ring, I remind her about how a Turbo as more metal than the ring, so it means more to [i']me[/i]!
I digress....
"Stupid Tax" I turned it around on her that year. Take a woman's jewlery out of her grasp and make it clear it was because of something she did...and they will start thinking about 'saving $32 a year'!
What I should have done was say "Well, at $32 a year, it's going to be another 20 years before I buy that ring!"
But that would have had other consequences....
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How is Ernie? Did he finish his book? Why are all of his techincal posts reduced to a [.]?
I have seen this in other places (sites) when people decide to go, they 'pull the plug' and go back and pull their posts as well. I understand why some people feel the desire to do that, especially if they feel they have been 'run off'...kind of a 'if you don't want me here, then I'm taking my knowledge (ball) with me when I leave'!
Not saying one way or another wether it's good or bad. I probably have been tempted to do that at one time or another myself.
Usually my [.] posts are after I have done things like called someone out to change one of their threads... Once they do it, I cull my own post. But that's something entirely different than undermining the estabilished, historical knowledge base.
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There is shock loading to think about also. Totally different that the load of say a mustang dyno.
How so? Set up a 100% Grade, and do a 7000 rpm holeshot with the car strapped to the Mustang, and I lay money something will give, and my thought is it will not be the drum or 5" Driveshaft on the Dyno's Braking Mechanisim!
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I might be wrong on my calculations, but the formula I was using was from an old trades book for calculating fluid flows in piping. I am sketchy on the particulars now, but it involved using a steel square for determining the diameters of the two pipes you wanted to flow into a single, or vice versa, then using calculations derived from triangles to come up with the diameter of the third pipe. A2+B2=C2 kind of thing. You know, the diameter of one pipe is one leg of the (right) triangle, the other diameter is the second leg, and the Hypotenuse is the required piping diameter for the 'single' pipe. It's mathematically correct, and has been used since the 30's as far as I know for calculating fluid flow capacities on jobsites... i.e. Two one inch pipes would flow the same as "the square root of 2" piping if you follow that. Cross sectional area may be different than what some are talking about. Which flow calculations are being referenced for these last few examples?
Speaking of 2.5" piping X 2, my example was 3.53" equivalent, not 4". What does the calculation for cross section come to show using that example? Using my formula twin 3" show approx the same flow as a 4 1/4" pipe... It seems in checking the math your examples are working exactly the same as my calculations and formula...
Now curious...
Matter of fact, now that I go back and read what I wrote, I suggested using twin 2.5" instead of a single 3.5" pipe, so what is all this cross sectional comparo stuff doing now when it is nowhere NEAR what I was suggesting or comparing? I would still say packaing twin 3" is STILL a lot easier than trying to fit a 4" in the back of an S30, or S-130!
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Casting a dohc head would be a minumum of 10 times the effort then bolting them together.
Making a series of 0.030" sections and then submitting them to a rapid prototyping company to do a lost-foam process would not be that difficult...
I second the idea of another thread to see that scale 13CID L-Motor! That sounds REALLY, REALLY COOL!
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So 600 hp on stock rods is possible as long as it is not an endurance road race car being spun at 6-8k for hours on end. Perfect, as Bryans car is a street car.
No, I never said that. I said that with 100 passes down the track, you have maybe 10 laps at a reasonably sized track. I don't know where the failure point is, but given most of the races they had were less than 2 hours in length, extrapolation of 'time under full load' could be done. If they didn't trust them for a 2 hour event...
As for dragracing-vs-tranny failure. Torque. Bonneville is a nice place where people run stock trannies, and then find out stuff drag guys never find out....like the stock RX7 transmission has a flex in the countershaft that allows both 2nd and 5th gears to engage when passing through a turbocharged RX's torque peak at over 140mph... Made the car jump airborne, do a 360, blow the transmission out from under the car, and then do a series of flat spins... Depending on the torque you put it through, and how will determine when it fails, right off the line, or down the end where you're going much faster...
Also, I believe I mentioned SMALL end deformation or elasticity. The gudgeon pins scored the walls. I mentioned nothing about the big end and loss of oil pressure. This is a function of piston weight, true...and of rpms and the length of time at the rpms. I would say the small end indeed stretched and returned to normal size as when checked it was all round and to spec size---the only way the gudgeon pins will move to the walls is if the small end stretched and let them move!
Unless you are on a Mustang Dyno where you hold your peak HP rpms (under load) you will never replicate the conditions.
The inertia dynos just pass through the rpm ranges too quickly.
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When I knocked off the HKS Type 1 Plenum, my air entered the box on the fenderwell side, and hit an "L" Shaped baffle plate that directed it to the floor of the plenum, where it diffused through a seried of holes drilled in the 'foot' of the "L". This gave very nice drivability compared to the rough 2X4" aluminum extrusion I retrofitted to the engine years later with the air entering near the distributor end of the plenum, unimpeded. Packaging the piping was easier, but it just wasn't the same engine after the plenum change.
I feel much better now that someone has acknowledged my years of rants and howls as more than just bluster...
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I was lucky enough to be given a Japanese aftermarket Z432 sports system to copy (which I had done in stainless steel). All I had to do was put a " small downward kink" into one of the pipes so that it would not bang on the diff/ rear suspension. The reason was since the system was designed for a slightly smaller diff, it could catch onto the larger R200 diff, especially if running lowered suspension. Oh, and pipe size is 60mm, will be running on a Rebelllo stroker.
Cheers
Ian
At last, someone else who can speak on the 'twice pipes' workability.
In the JDM, as many cars already had the 'header exhausts', HKS made a Downpipe for the stock turbo that hooked to the 50mm HKS Sports system for the S30, I ran that 2.5" downpipe into twin 50mm pipes for years on that system making 350hp. 2.78" flow equivalence.
Now Ian has inspired me to make a twin 2.5" setup (making the closest approximation to 60mm tubes this side of the pond).
Why fight trying to fit a single 3.5" pipe back there, when twins package so much more efficiently.
As I recall, there was an S130 Exhaust that was popular that ran 90mm pipe in the center section of the tunnel, then branched out to twin 60's on each side of the car...easily passed above the rear subframe just like the stock muffler tubing! I believe the front section was set up at owner's discretion to either accept dual turbo downpipes or a 90mm turbo downpipe.
They had such cool stuff in the JDM, and they weren't trying to fit it around a steering shaft!
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"600 HP is all the stock rods are supposed to be good for? Hmm. I remember when people said that about stock 2JZ pistons and rods a few years back. Now people make an easy 800+rwhp on them."
The difference is the 2JZ was people without any experience on the engine making the claims. The difference here is someone like John Caldwell of Electramotive found out failures firsthand in the 80's. They may have been detonation related at that power level, but they would not use stock rods in endurance engines, and those classes that required stock parts got changed regularly....like NHRA Top Fueler Parts.
Making 600HP on a run down the dyno, and 100 passes down the drag strip is only maybe 10 laps of a road course. Drawing conclusions on durability this early in the development stage is foolish, especially when others with far larger budgets decided they were not going to risk their engines (or race winning record) on a properly-prepared stock rod. And this was the best in the busines making this decision...
The rods were a compressive failure as I recall, splitting down the H-Beam beneath the gudgeon pin.
JeffP does not have stock rods in his engine, either.
Our Bonneville N/A engine walked the pressed-fit pins to the wall... Stock rods seem to get slightly 'elastic' on the small end above 8200rpms, and then have compressive issues at the BMEP encountered at or above 100 HP/ Hole. You freshfaced engineer-types should easily be able to calculate that BMEP point on the bore diameter, I'll leave that to you, see what you come up with!
And remember this is true engine HP that can be extrapolated back to SAE standards. A Mustang Dyno can be back-extrapolated, most Dynojets are not set up for that kind of accuracy. So the type of dyno you run on will inflate the numbers as well. KTM will verify the difference between the HP shown on the Mustang at Dynamic in Lake Forest and the DynoJet at DRS in LaHabra can be startlingly different: 20-25% in some cases. Even Dynamic's Owner said he will warrant you show at least 15% more HP on a Dynojet than what you will read on his Mustang. But his Mustang is calibrated and traceable to a Set Engineering Standard set by the SAE, so take that FWIW. If JeffP wanted to do the brag thing, he would be using his Dynojet numbers, not his Mustang numbers...that would put him above 570 RWHP, misfiring like crazy about 6300rpms.
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Speaking from a cheapskate point of view, there is a product available at Lowe's and Home Depot that is designed for freeze protection on Eaves of Roofs. It's a self-sealing ice-prevention tar compound, with a self-adhesive back. It works GREAT for the floorboards and anyplace else you want to stick sound deadener. It's CHEAP, and comes in rolls 36" wide. You guys may want to check it out if you are looking for generic sound deadener comparable to the stock stuff! You can layer it and increase the mass for more deadening capability like Dynamat, but for a fraction of the cost.
I wish I had the name, but it's pretty obvious when you go to the shingle section of the Home Improvement Warehouses what you are looking for...it's sticky on one side, self sealing, and meant for eaves. When you see how much you get for the cost...you start thinking 'brand names be damned, I'm gonna try this!' LOL
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Thanks for the translation Greg! I forget I am 'metric disabled' and many people wouldn't realize how big the JDM was actually running. Yeah, the RS Okinawa 77 S30 was cranking 444Kw on the same dyno my L20A put 97PS (I chose "PS" for my sticker, instead of the lower Kw Number! LOL). The Twins were not sequential, but parallell, eachbeing fed by 3 cylinders.
JeffP's testing with the 3" downpipe and exhaust showed no loss of down low power or torque, and in fact showed a 20 HP boost on the top end. Overall the whole dyno curve was better than stock with only the exhaust being changed!
N/A and Turbo are two different animals, but John C brought up a very valid point of operational rpm range. For a track car for sure 'bigger is better' but on a turbo car, no matter what, "Bigger is not big enough!" should be the rule!
But again, someone stating that 2.5" 'is good enough' really has to look at packaging! The twin 50's will flow like a 2 3/4" pipe, and FIT like a STOCK system (actually it IS a stock system, hanging from stock hangers replicating the 60mm Z432 Setup!)
I know some people have had issues with the 2.5" near the diffy, unless you use a later crossmember which makes packaging easier. But twin 50's fit like the stock setup on the early 240/260 diffy crossmember. Sure twicepipes cost more, are more complex, but they do also flow better. And if you package 60mm tubing, you flow BETTER than a single 3" pipe!
It's just another option. I recently sent someone the parts page from the Fairlady 432 Parts Booklet so he could compare the stock single tube system to how Nissan hung/packaged the dual system in the same chassis. The only real difference is hangers and how they routed it. Twin 60's / 50's are no more susceptible to bottoming on lowered cars than properly-hung stock systems if you follow Nissan's designs and engineering!
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Loctite and Staking as stated will be more than sufficient.
Frankly, IMO, the loctite is for vacuum sealing, and the staking keeps the things from moving.
I think I PM'd you about it, but I took an aluminum rod, threaded it appropriately (BSP Tapered Thread) and then sunk them in with loctite. After they were in there well, I staked 'em, and then ground the whole schebang flush!
I didn't even have the 'pods' sticking out! All smooooooothe! THen I 'black magic blasted' the whole tube so it all had the same finish. Painting afterwards makes the modification undetectable.
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As long as you get "N42" castings, I wouldn't worry about 'the best nickel content', what you are going for is the thick walls.
Except for the F54 which has marginally less nickel, and therfore more suceptible for wear, any of the "N42" castings will be indestructible with any rings you put in there...except if they are made of Diamonds! Those baby's are HARD!
N42=Last forever with no measurable wear!
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DELLORTOS
Remember that on Dellotros you can BUY from the FACTORY the proper seals and emulsions tubes to work properly on-boost!
The Maserati BiTurbo utilized Dellorto Blow-Through DHLAS! All the parts exist to put them together wtih an emulsion tube that richens up on-boost automatically without changing to humongo jets.
Somewhere I have a Videotape where I recorded the setup of a Cartech 44PHH Mikuini setup jetting. They were MUCH larger than I was running at the time with my modulator-ringed L28 (even if he was a 3.0, that is not enough to run the jets he was running!)
If you want to run the Dels as ITB's, pull the venturis, and sleeve the interior to 45mm with a single tube, it prevents any boost leaks. Put the injectors in a spacer behind the throttles and you will not have to worry about sealing the throttle shafts. As for a TPS, check out Kinsler Fuel Injection in Troy Michigan. They have a CW and CCW TPS setup that mounts anywhere, and can hook onto the triples manifold bar with an additional arm, linkage, and a place to mount their bracket.
Frankly, I've considered using the Kinsler TPS bracket under the dashboard hooked to the stock bellcrank through a rod simply because it's HIDDEN! In any case, the Kinsler bracket will give you a versatile way to put a TPS on any bellcrank actuated throttle system...even stock SU's! Keeps you from having to adapt something to the stock Carb throttle shaft. On the pictured Cartech system, since the Mikuini Bellcranks have 'extra' ball holes, putting a linkage to one and hooking it to the TPS is a breeze, as long as you can get the linearity worked out!
The Kinsler bracket uses GM TPS units, which are pretty much universal on EMS systems these days.
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Warning...
For all the inflated talk, it's well known that the stock rods will not last long once you exceed 100HP/Hole.
The 'failure' will not be block induced, if it's stock-rodded, it will be a compressive failure down the rod.
After that, bearing loadings will start becoming a factor.
Unless you get stupid boring the L-Gata, the block will not be the failure point. There is a flexing issue, and for that the JDM cars have introduced a girdle to stiffen the block/lower end, but cross that road when you get to it. Electromotive didn't use it, and they were making more than that.
Documentation? You ask too much. This was 20+ years ago, and most of those guys did it, and moved on. You are simply retreading the same path long enough down the road where anybody who was doing it firsthand has moved along a long time ago. Add to that the dynos used then were written down on hand written sheets, not computer printouts. If anybody kept them after the racing season was over you'ld be considered lucky. New year brought a new engine (84) and EVERYTHING would start anew! All that 'old crap' would be tossed as nobody would be running it!
And the guys who did it then really have no incentive to inflate numbers. In the day, they had an incentive to deflate numbers due to competitive secrets, but now, they will tell you the straight scoop.
If you can find them!
Caldwell is in San Diego...
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I'm a big fan of Devcon Aluminum Putty. Machines and takes threads really well. And is a heluva lot easier to slurry into places where I can never get my TIG!
The only problem is I have to make damned sure I have all the welding done on whatever BEFORE I put it in there. I've had a few 'DOH' moments since starting to use it. I really like it for intakes and T/B alterations.
Makes nice machinable plugs for casting as well (or for altering existing castings for taking molds from!)
Point of Historical Interest: Never use Devcon Titanium Putty on anything you think you will be taking a carbide die grinder bit to later on...the Devcon will win! You wouldn't think 'plastic' would make a carbide bit throw sparks....but it will! (Bad Day...really bad day!)
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I can show you four-digit serialized L24 Blocks with the remote oil cooler holes in place and functional...
Shocked me when I saw it! Didn't think they had them that early, but the did!
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One picture too many...I see Devcon! LOL
Jenvey made a nice ITB setup that was available in thickness from 109mm (stock Weber width, front to back) down to I believe 30mm wide...though welding those in would likely have distorted the bores on the throttle shaft.
Niiice!
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TEAM 2+2 is looking pretty good!
by the way, has anyone seen this one?
http://www.empirez.com/forum/gallery_image.php?action=view&iid=1641#pictop
Yeah, that is a JCR conversion kit on a V-8 Hybrid 260Z 2+2. He is in one of the Car Clubs I belong to, that car was at MSA Show last year out on '260 Island' with the Blue Turd Racing 2+2, and my 75 Fairlady Z 2/2.
Nice guy, he has several Z's and some other American Iron as well.
lightening Bad Dog subframe connectors
in S30 Series - 240z, 260z, 280z
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I wouldn't lighten them in any way, there is...as mentioned above...plenty of other non-structural areas on the vehicle to take weight from.
Seriously, how much weight will you save? I have seen a 240Z where the fenders were reproduced from Nissan FRP pieces...only in Carbon Fiber because the fabricator thought they 'weighed too much'. After he got the CF pieces, he realized the aluminum bolts that attached them were now about .5mm longer than they needed to be. So he then cut all the bolts to length. While they were in the lathe, he also gun-drilled them...and then touched the heads with a ball mill to scallop extra weight out of non-structural pieces. The same car also had Titanium A-Arm pivot bolts manufactured, which were similarly gun-drilled to save weight.
It's all a matter of where you look to save weight, curiously on the car above, the frame rails under the car were untouched in lightening efforts.
If he skipped 'em, that tells me something...