Mitchel0407

After many nights thinking about it, the current Black Friday sale and optimizing my order for the most value for my money I finally decided to pull the trigger. Maybe it’s because of the size and weight of the total order but the calculation of the shipping was a bit weird. As the parts will need to be shipped to the Netherlands I knew the shipping would be expensive but my shipping came down to almost $600!! By combining some stuff I got the shipping to drop down to $280,- while still giving me the stuff I wanted and basically a free rear strut brace. Here is a list of all the stuff I got: - Front fender brace - Frame rails - Rear strut brace - Front control arms - Steering knuckles - Front crossmember - Upper steering rack clamps - Rear control arms While weighting my options Apex dropped there Retro Mod line of suspension which allows you to keep the stock R180 or R200 long nose differential, axles and spindles. I really wanted to get the new rear suspension and subframe but found it to be too expensive for me at this time. By dropping the rear subframe I got to order the front crossmember, control arms and steering knuckle and still be a lot cheaper off. Weirdly ordering all the front suspension bits separately was almost $300,- cheaper than buying the Retro Mod front suspension kit. Seeing as I don’t need the tie rods (and the steering rack, you need to buy that separately) I’m even cheaper off. I’m hoping to get the frame rails and fender brace fitted over the winter and have the car ready before next spring.

My god, seeing that engine finally inside the car truly gives some perspective just how massive that engine is. The L series looks small in comparison!

The Datsun EFI system might look complicated but once you understand how it works it’s dead simple. Start with the basics and preform all the electrical measurements at the ECU plug. Don’t worry if the measurements are a bit out of spec and try and leave the AFM (Air Flow Meter) alone till you’re out of options. I suspect your issue might come down to something as simple as a bad connection or a broken wire. Try to look for damage to the wiring harness in the engine bay. Even though you replaced the fuel pump measure the fuel pressure just after the filter. The pump might be fine but it could still be that you aren’t building pressure. There is a fuel pump cut off switch inside the AFM to shut off the fuel supply if the engine stops running.

Unfortunately I live in the Netherlands so I will probably never be able to attend SEMA and there aren’t a lot of S30 Z’s running around here let alone modified with Apex Engineered hardware. I do plan to change that over time as the suspension kits look really good not to mention the perfect timing of new Retro Mod line which retains the original differential setup. The wife isn’t happy with me spending money on the car but I really want my 280z back on the road this spring. I’ll wait till black Friday to see if there are any good deals and then contact for an order for at least the frame rails and rear suspension.

I don’t know if they attend or what can be found at SEMA but I’m interested If Apex Engineered will be there. I just saw that they dropped a new line of suspension upgrades this weekend called the Retro Mod line of suspension. The Retro line allows you to keep the stock R180 or R200 diff and looks a lot like there I guess existing suspension (non track attack) line that seems to be renamed to the Pro Touring line.

Welcome back to the forum!

I am planning to do it the right way but finding a body shop that can straighten the car is a bit difficult. I was always planning to fully strip, repair, straighten and repaint the car at some point but if it’s possible I would like to at least be able to drive the car on the road. Seeing as I don’t have a car trailer and “officially” my daily driver isn’t allowed to tow more then 1400kg it would be a lot easier to transport the car to body shops under its own power. And for that I need an valid inspection…. Instead of diving head first into an full restauration, which will take years and tens of thousands of euro’s in one go, I’m just trying to spread out the costs and take it on piece by piece. I would like to at least enjoy the car for a bit and attend some meetings in my 280z instead of my Opel Astra diesel estate. Seeing as most parts come from the US it’s a big hurdle to buy. Shipping is very expensive, there is a 4,5% import cost and then a 21% tax on the total amount. In all I pay 50% more than someone from the US for parts. This also gives me time to calm down the misses a bit as she only sees the dollar signs flying away. I have seen this spiral before and I don’t want to end up with a stranded project. I want to keep my Z for life and I will take care of her.

As I’ve documented on this forum before I got kind of stift by the auction company and the previous owner of my 77 280z. The frame rails are rusted and need replacement to pass inspection and something is wrong with the rear suspension. I’m trying to not spend too much money at the moment but still want good parts that will stay on the car trough out the build as doing thing twice costs more in the long run. I will have to take the car to a body shop to get the frame rails welded so I’ll be looking to get pre made frame rails to save on labor cost. That gives me two choices, 1,5mm thick reproduction rails from KF vintage or the 3mm thick rails from Apex. The KF rails are send trough a warehouse in Spain so that saves a lot on import cost for me but the Apex rails are twice as thick which may give the almost 50 year old car some much needed strength and rigidity. Does anybody have the Apex rails on there car and how are they holding up? As for the rear suspension the question is if it is the chassis itself that’s crooked or something in the suspension. As I can’t find many stories of bend chassis online I’ll take the bet that it’s the rear suspension. That means I’ll have to look for adjustable rear control arms. That way even if the chassis itself is a little bit crooked I can tune it out for now till the car will be fully restored. Again that search let me back to Apex, there was also Silver Project from Europe which was a lot cheaper but I don’t hear much good from them. Has anybody installed the rear (or front) control arms from Apex with mostly stock suspension? I currently have a list of products form Apex which interests me and I’ll probably wait till Black Friday to see if they got any good deals. I don’t know if I’ll order everything but the frame rails and rear control arms I’ll probably order. This is what I’m interested in at the moment: - Frame rails - Rear control arms - Fender brace (If the car gets welded anyway, why not) - Rear strut brace - Front control arms - Low profile outer tie rods (I run 15” atm) - Inner tie rods (because of the threat difference) - Steering knuckles All combined should give the chassis and suspension a nice upgrade and the adjustability I need to get the car on the road. I do plan on keeping the four lug setup and the coilovers that are currently on the car. I do like there coilovers but That may be too much money for now. Yesterday I contacted Apex Engineered with some questions and they claim that the suspension components I’m looking at do work with the stock components. Are there people on here running Apex components (except the track attack kits) and what is your opinion on them.

I’m curious as to how the electric steering kit will hold up and what you think of it. No power steering isn’t that bad but it might be a nice upgrade down the line. Please keep us up to date once you have the car driving.

I am planning to fully restore the body, repaint and preform upgrades but I was hoping to al least enjoy the car a few seasons and to take it at a slower pace. If it is in any way possible I would like to keep the car for as long as I can. The S30 Z’s have and always will be THE dream car for me and now I’ve driven it for a bit the bug has only bit me harder. I would love to just throw a bunch of money at the car as I do have some reserves but those are supposed to help me at least the next 50 years. For a bit of background, I’m only 25 and my right leg got crush in a motorcycle accident about 3 years ago. I’m doing good now and am walking on both legs again but the question is for how long that will be the case.

As to keep the technical stuff a bit separate I decided to post the next bit as a separate comment. Last Tuesday I temporarily insured the car and drove it over the highway to S2 Classic Cars in Hengelo (The Netherlands) as they are a highly rated classic car restauration shop in the area with a beautiful showroom to booth. There I had the car thoroughly inspected in preparation for the APK (something like state inspection, MOT or TÜV). This gave me some good and also very bad news. The good news, my work on the engine paid off as the car drove great with good AFR readings while driving and an CO emissions gas reading of 2,4% of the 4,5% allowed for this model year. The inspector also noted that judging by the other reading the engine was very healthy and in great condition. The bad news on the other hand reviled that the chassis of the car was is much less of a condition. Both left and right frame rails are rusted thru which they tried to cover up at some point with underseal. They where also both dented badly in the front by improper jack usage and the passenger side frame rail had a big rust hole in it. To add on top of that the inspector noticed the rear axle was crooked. This caused the drivers side rear wheel to stick out more with an toe out and the passenger rear wheel to have way more negative camber. The inspector couldn’t find anything at this time underneath and suspects the chassis might be slightly twisted or crooked. To know for sure I will need to find a shop that has the proper equipment and reference measurements to measure to chassis. I’m quit mad about both these things as they will cost me a lot to fix (at least they are fixable so thank god). More over the car was advertised and sold to me as “…without rust and free from structural damage.” by both the seller and the auction company. The auction company even inspected the car before it got accepted into the auction and wrote the advertisement texts for the car. Because of this fact, and the surprise bill for thousands of euro’s, I’ll be taking legal steps to try and claim at least some of the costs of the repairs on the seller and auction company.

O boy has this been a productive month for me! Shortly after buying the car the engine started to turn over slower and slower and losing all power even though the battery voltage was good and hooked up to a trickle charger. So I decided to replace both the starter and the battery. It turned out to be just the battery but the starter was pretty cheap so I didn’t mind. Next up I borrowed my dad’s borescope to look inside the cylinders. The cylinder walls looked great but the pistons did have some carbon buildup. This can be explained by the car running rich for a long time and not having been driven a lot the last few years. I did see oil running down the cylinder walls on four of the cylinders but I’ll be replacing the head- and valve cover gaskets once those come in. I also tested the compression again and this time it came back to a stable 125 psi on all six cylinders. After this I dicided to put my focus back the rich idle problem. A more detailed story of that journey can be found in the two threads linked below. The thread on the Classic Zcars forum has a bunch of information about the (working of) Datsun/Bosch AFM’s and replacement units for them. https://forums.hybridz.org/topic/139136-77-280z-running-rich-at-idle/#comment-1251600 https://www.classiczcars.com/forums/topic/69530-77-280z-running-rich-at-idle-afm-screw-doesnt-work/#comments In short I found out one of my problems was that my AFM was bad. As the original Datsun 7 pin units are none existent in Europe and I can’t find anybody that can rebuild the circuit board on one I decided to head down a massive rabbit hole that is the undocumented world of Bosch L-Tronic AFM’s. During my research, documented above, I came across a 2011 Australian forum post that mentioned an Toyota AFM. The part number (F201 13 210 (197100-3420)) came back over here as from a 1988-1992 2.2i GT Turbo 12V Ford (USA) Probe (Mazda 626) for €25,- from a junkyard. So I ordered it immediately to try and test this theory out. The Ford/Mazda/Toyota AFM is larger than the Datsun unit but can be installed by stretching the factory rubbers slightly. The pinout and internals are practically the same and don’t require modification (even the electrical plug was plug-and-play!). The resistance values are different than the Datsun AFM but the output voltage values to the ECU are the same. By tightening the spring (gear) inside (clockwise) the car started and ran perfectly. During this process I also replaced my Bosch spark plugs for NGK BR6ES with a 1,05mm gap and the ignition coil for a 0,6 Ohm Flamethrower 2 unit just to be sure. I also replaced the fuel pressure regulator for a new one and cleaned the injectors using an ultrasonic cleaner and spraying high pressure brake cleaner through them. The car did run a lot better and more stable after all of this even though my idle was still very rich and the idle air screw didn’t seems to effect the idle AFR much. This lead me to a leaking and faulty AAR valve which I blocked off on both sides. My vacuum was good and the fuel pressure was slightly low at 28 psi on my cheap Chinees gauge. I suspect the injectors are just bad and will need to be replaced ad some point but for now the car runs pretty good.

So little update and probably the end of this thread. Although feel free to revive it if somebody has any questions and I’ll try to help out. First off, good news!! The Ford/Mazda/Toyota and so on AFM actually works and giving of the correct signal! I my opinion this is a huge win for everybody that wants to keep these cars alive. My intake both and the rubber booth between the AFM and TB where both flexible enough to stretch over the larger AFM unit without trouble. The new AFM unit unfortunately doesn’t have bolt holes in the bottom like the Datsun unit but mounting can be fixed by a custom 3D printed or metal bracket. I just left mine loos as I just needed to test it for now and drive to the inspection. Opening the new AFM was a bit more difficult as they used a ton of silicon sealant and plugged the idle air screw from factory. The sealant can be carefully removed with a knife and the plug can be drilled out. The new AFM was also way easier to dial in as you can rotate the spring gear with a flathead screwdriver and a bit of finagling. In my case I had to tighten the spring tension a lot but I do have more problems concerning the car running rich. Even though I just cleaned and rebuild them I think my injectors are bad. I had the car inspected yesterday and the CO gas values where down to 2,4% (4,5% allowed) and all other values where good so I’m happy. Although the car ended up failing due to rusted thru frame rails and a crooked rear axle probably caused by a twisted chassis. I started a legal dispute with the auction company and previous owner as the both sold the car as “without rust and free from structural damage” but that is something for another thread.

I also posted about this on the Classic Zcar forum but forgot to update this one. Here is a link to that post: https://www.classiczcars.com/forums/topic/69530-77-280z-running-rich-at-idle-afm-screw-doesnt-work/#comments In short, I tracked the problem to a faulty AFM (Air Flow Meter). The carbon track inside the AFM looks fine but when hooking it up to a battery and measuring with a multi meter there was a break in the track. Unfortunately it’s not repairable and I couldn’t find a Datsun AFM in Europe or somebody that could repair or recreate the circuit board (the carbon resistive track part that is). This has lead me into a pretty undocumented part of the Datsun / Bosch EFI system that is the AFM. It’s pretty much just a voltage divider (brings down the battery voltage) and a potentiometer. However nobody makes a potentiometer I could jerry rig inside of the AFM to recreate the original signal. However in my goal to make the car run (not rich) again I found a possible solution. Why not just use a different AFM? I mean it’s basically just a generic Bosch / Denso AFM module (5 pin) with fuel cut off (which makes it a 7 pin). The only problem is that the Datsun’s use the earlier > 5V AFM otherwise u could just grab one from a BMW or Opel. I did find an Australian forum post that mentioned a Toyota AFM that was plug and play with some spring tension adjustment with a part number that (over here) came back to one from a 90’s Ford Probe / Mazda 626. The part number was F201 13 210 (197100-3420) for the record. As this AFM was only €25 at the local wrecker I got one as well. I will be testing this AFM over the weekend to see if it actually works in the Datsun and also works well. I did notice the Mazda AFM is much bigger then the stock one. Maybe that second hand 60mm throttle body I saw online might be an good upgrade as well if this AFM works.

I spend the last few days cleaning the electrical connections and timing the ignition again as it was out of spec. The car runs way better but the AFR gauge still shows 11,5 at idle. I'd like to bring that down (or up depending how you look at it) to 14,7 as the car stinks of gas. The previous owner mentioned that that was the reason it didn't pass inspection (auction company didn't mention that). I tried messing with the idle air mixture screw but that didn't help. When turning clockwise a bunch the car did start to run richer but when turning anti clockwise it didn't get past 11,5 AFR. I did notice the ignition coil is a 1,5 ohm unit with a total resistance of 2 ohm with the external resistor. I believe it needs to be closer to 1 ohm total so I'll probably replace the coil with a 0,5 ohm one.