Mitchel0407

I would love to see a full weight comparison between the original and carbon fiber door. I know from lugging my 280z doors around that the factory doors are quit heavy.

A bit more time has past and a bit more work has been done. I have been trying to complete the body work and paint on the doors but I shamefully have to admit that exterior bodywork is not my strong suit. I did get an appointment at the body shop for next week to replace the frame rails and install the Apex front fender braces and asked them to repaint the doors and wiper cowl as well. I guess you win some and you lose some, and boy I lost this one (please don’t judge to hard). I moved on to some other small tasks and replaced the radio antenna for an aftermarket powered one. I did have to solder on a new connector as I don’t have the same connectors and plugs as the factory harness uses but I made sure that any changes are reversible if necessary in the future. I also ran new speaker wires to the aftermarket JBL speakers that came with the car as the existing wires where all corroded from the inside. Here again I used new aftermarket connectors on both sides so the speakers can be easily disconnected or switched from audio channel. The body shop would like the car to stay somewhat drivable under it’s own power so they can easily load her on the trailer and move her around the shop. So I threw on the trickle charger so the battery will be full and see if she will start after a couple of months of sitting still. After a bit of cranking she came to live. After letting her warm up a bit I checked the AFR gauge and to my surprise it was sitting at 14.5 idle! With a bit of gas the AFR rose to 12.3 under power and then settled back down to 14.5 at idle. Did the 280 just fix itself over winter? As the car will be off to the body shop soon I don’t want to just sit around and do nothing until the car is back as I would really like to be able to drive the car somewhere begin May. So I decided to look into the possibility of removing the dashboard while still being able to drive the car. After studying the electrical schematics for a bit I really didn’t see a reason why this shouldn’t be possible so as with anything I just tried it. Worst case scenario I have to put the dashboard back in. Turns out that the dashboard really doesn’t have anything to do with the 280z EFI system. If you disconnect the three big connectors in the passenger footwell and then take the dash out the car starts just fine. So now I have the hilarious combo of a stripped out but still drivable 280z. The car does feel really sad and empty now but soon she will be stronger then ever with some nice suspension upgrades, a new radio and a freshly restored dash and interior panels!

Yesterday after work I decided to just try and remove the dashboard and see what happens. Worst case scenario I have to put the dashboard back in place with a few bolts till she’s back from the body shop. But fortunately I didn’t have to! From what I could understand from the wiring schematics and pictures online the dash shouldn’t have any components or connections preventing the stock EFI from starting and running the engine. The dash just receives signals from the sensors but doesn’t send them. The only wiring connected to the dashboard where three connectors connected to the white panel in the passenger footwell. I disconnected these took out the dashboard and tried to start the engine. She had some trouble as the engine was cold and hasn’t started in a few weeks but after a few seconds she came to live and ran perfectly.

As the title implies I want to find out if a stock 280z with the L28E (fuel injected) can start and run without the dashboard. My 1977 280z will be dropped of at the body shop next week for new Apex Engineered frame rails and front fender braces. The body shop would like to have the car running so it’s easier to move around the shop. In the meantime I would like to restore my dashboard and replaced a few tings like the bulbs and the speedometer. But for that I need to know if I can remove the dashboard and still be able to start the car. Does anybody know if the 280z can be started without a dashboard?

You might find more info in his build thread.

What will be the main purpose of the car for you? What do you want the car to be? Seeing as you will be installing a roll gage, iMSA widebody kit and an LS big block for I suspect power and torque, you will mainly track the car and won’t be driving on the road. I like your choice of Apex over T3 but that’s my personal preference. But why the Pro Touring and not the Track Attack kit? Also don’t forget the basics of the build like chassis reinforcement, safety features and fuel delivery. These chassis are over 50 years old so if you plan to track and abuse them make sure the basics are good, rust free and reinforced. A good roll cage will do a lot together with the frame sleeves and some bolt on parts but things like seem welding the chassis will also help a lot. VA Engineering over here in the Netherlands has some great pictures on their Instagram of their cages and seem welds. The transform the S30 Z’s into period correct rally cars and yes they do get used like a rally car should.

You are flying true this! Love to see your progress!

I find the front strut brace very interesting, is it connected to the cage thru the firewall? I suspect this will mainly reinforce the strut tower from moving front to back. Will you also be adding a front strut brace for side to side reinforcement? I will be sending my 280z off soon for replacement 3mm (instead of 1,5mm) frame rails from Apex together with there front fender braces as they where not that expensive and my body shop won’t charge me extra for welding them. I wonder how different the fender braces will be in comparison.

Good to have you back! Do you have some pictures of the cars and what’s been done to them?

The money is a big consideration but the main point is more what it’s worth to you. Do you want a particular setup and is the money more secondary, is money a primary driver, do you want to slowly upgrade or go all at once. I see a lot of people mention only the costs of the build but if somebody is really passionate about something then it doesn’t matter as much. For example the fuel injection on my ’77 280z isn’t in the greatest shape, she drives good enough but the AFR readings aren’t the best (extremely rich at idle and slightly lean at open throttle). The economical thing to do is to just swap over some triple Webber carbs, but since I would like to keep the fuel injection I decided to, eventually, slowly upgrade the fuel injection with a new ECU and a set of ITB’s. I might spend 3 to 4 times the money but I’ll have a car that I want, as I like it.

I really like the L28’s as they have a lot of character and an amazing sound but a used VQ would also be a great option. I don’t know exactly what you would need but It may be a good idea to get a wrecked donor 350z and use its drivetrain components together with the Pro Touring or Track Attack suspension kits from Apex Engineered. That may be the easiest route if you want to go VQ or even RB (there subframe accepts loads of different engines). But if costs are a driving factor then finding and even building another 350 might be the best option. A swap done right can run you $10k to $15k easily as it’s not just the engine you need to swap but also the driveline, suspension components and electronics.

I agree, keep the fuel injection for drivability but if it’s in your budget I would look at aftermarket options if the current stock system gives you too much trouble. If you just want a simple plug and drive solution then the Fast EFI might be the simplest option that keeps the car closest to stock. But if you have a bit more to spend then I would suggest going for an ECU that capable of sequential injectors instead of batch fire like the Haltech Elite 750. If the stock EFI starts to fail and you just want the car to run and drive good on a “budget” then I would suggest looking for some second hand triple Webber carburetors. It would just be a case of removing all the stock EFI components and intake and slapping the Webbers on (with ideally some slight dyno tuning to dial it in). The stock fuel injection system and ECM are nearing 50 years old now and most are slowly starting to fail. I believe mine is also on the way out as the idle is very rich in fuel (10,3 to 1) and no matter what I do it just won’t change, it looks like it’s stuck on the WOT fuel setting (yes I checked the TPS and everything else in the EFI bible). The car runs good enough for now (13,0 to 1 when driving) and once the frame rails have been repaired the car will pass inspection but the next step will be an new Haltech EFI system with properly some ITB’s from EFI Hardware.

A new year has started and my battle to get the 280z road worthy goes on. I had liked to get some more things done over the holidays but sickness and other obligations got the better of me. That doesn’t mean I didn’t get some progress in. To prepare for a new years eve party I had to temporarily get the Z inside the garage so I continued my journey of stripping down the Z by removing the fenders and wiper cowl. I kind of regret but I'm also glad I did. Turns out the last “restauration” was a fairly cheap one. Some threads where damaged and instead of repairing the thread or welding in a nut they just left the bolts out, or in case of the lower mounting points of the fenders just weld and bondo them on. After getting them off I was met with the nice surprise of finding out they never painted the inside/back of the fenders or any non-exterior part for that matter, only primer. As a result I was met with a lot of surface corrosion spots. I also discovered the car has some crash damage on the front left that was never properly repaired. Some sanding, rust treatment and painting later the car already looked a lot better. At least now I know the Z won’t rust away in the next couple of years. Every panel I remove it becomes more and more clear that a full restauration to the bare metal of the body is necessary if I want this Z to survive at least another 10 to 20 years. I really wanted to start installing some of my new goodies from Apex so I decided to install the rear strut brace as it won’t interfere with any of the bodywork. It was freezing outside but with the help of a heater it was quit doable. I do love the look of the Apex rear strut brace. It’s strong, elegant, functional but doesn’t scream “aftermarket modification” which I like a lot. I don’t really want my car to stay stock but also not heavily modified, just tasteful, functional and a bit more modernized but still the classic look and feel. The last few couple of days have been pretty cold so I moved back to the garage for some of the car work. Unfortunately my garage isn’t insolated and I don’t have a strong enough heater but it’s better then outside and good enough for some paint work and rebuilding the hinges. Rebuilding the hinges was easier then I though at first. Having a vice does make life a lot easier when removing and installing the hinge pins. To get them out I just used an impact socket and an old bolt that was slightly smaller then the hinge pin. With some force they came right out. All hinge pins where worn which caused the doors to sag and the passenger side (which sagged the most) was even bent! The rebuild kit I bought from Zservices EU was great with the exception of the hinge pin bushings, both the outer and inner tolerance was out of spec on all of them. If it was to tight then that wouldn’t be that much of a problem as I could modify them but the tolerance was to loose causing the bushings to sit loosely in the hinge and the pin to have some play. I decided to rebuild the passenger side hinges anyway and will install them soon to see if they sag with these bushings installed. If they do I will have some custom made at a machine shop. Continuing with the doors I decided to do some spot repair on the upper corners of the doors as both sides had some corrosion under the paint, and the doors where off the car anyway so might as well do them now. Here to I discovered the inside of the door was never painted causing some corrosion on the inside of the doors. The more I work on the car the more I want to punch the previous owner and bodyshop in the face. Even so I can't wait to drive the Z, I guess that’s the S30 life for yea….

Last week my order from Apex Engineered came in so now I can start stripping down the car and prepping her for the body shop. Money is a bit tight right now so I’ll install all my suspension parts first and probably send the car of to the shop in February. In the meantime I decided to strip out the interior and see what’s hidden underneath. It doesn’t look that bad but for a car that has been quote on quote “restored” only 10 years ago they sure did a shitty job. Lots of surface corrosion sports throughout the interior, lots of missing bolts, fasteners and rubber plugs and unpainted parts from shotty repair work. I cleaned up the surface rust and sprayed a generous amount of rust converter on everything. I will order some more rust converter, primer and color matched paint soon to clean up and protect the inside parts. I’ll also look at some spray wax to protect the hidden parts and crevasses of the chassis. A guy on YouTube I follow (M539 Restorations) uses one from Liqui Molly I believe which seems pretty good so I will give that one a try. It's not all bad news though. It looks like that in all these years the wiring harness stayed unmolested by all the previous owners. I also found out that the car has 4 pretty big and new looking JBL speakers! They didn’t all work when I tested the radio but I believe that might be the head unit itself. I will probably replace it with a Bluetooth capable retro looking one in the future. I also found a full and intact box of original Nissan glass 10amp fuses in the trunk!

Good work! You seem to be making some great progress these last few weeks. As for me I just got my 280z to run a bit better. Today my final part from Apex Engineered should come is so I will strip the car this weekend so the car can be send off to the body shop.