Hi Def Posted March 12, 2012 Share Posted March 12, 2012 First off,let me start by saying,I know this all could have been avoided "if" I just woulda did what I did in the first place,which was,BUY NEW HEAD BOLTS!!! I had brand new Nissan head bolts and washers when I started this build. I shoulda known better but here's what happened. I started building the engine after taking is semi apart to replace all the seals and what-not since I bought the motor used and it sat in a garage for a few years. Well,everything came apart fine and cleaned up very well. Engine was is great shape inside. I believe the owner's story about the engine now,forsure. Anyways,I get it all cleaned and painted,put together,HEAD TORQUED DOWN,when I discover,there is 2 broken exhaust bolts!? No way I say... Take the head back off,and send it to the shop.. Buy another gasket kit for the timing and oil pan,clean it totally off again,and get the head back 2 days ago. Everyone tells me,BOLTS and HEADGASKET should be fine,since the engine was never ran or heat cycled.... Why I believed this,I still don't know. HENCE WHY I BOUGHT NEW ONES IN THE FIRST PLACE!! So,I end up putting the engine back together lastnight and SNAP!!!! The ***:&!! head bolt snapped!!!! Omg,I say... Well,much worse then that,but I'm sure you guys/girls know what I mean.. Now I need,New head bolts,engine overhaul kit,and take it back apart(All again mind you) and possibly have to ship/transport it somewhere to get fixed and back again!? In that case paint it again? Wow!!! Btw,my car is a 79 ZX coupe 5-speed and I swapping in a 83 turbo. F54 with a P90a... Factory everything on the engine. Wanted to get it running before putting any kind of real performance parts or work yet. My question is,has anyone ever had this happen??? What was your solution to fixing it? My friend,who is btw,master tech,Audi,BMW, and Porsche,and has a 1400hp car himself offered to bring some specialized tools over,but I have to buy the bits.. Those can't be cheap!? Something about drilling out the hole,from smaller to bigger,untill almost thru the bolt and to the thread size.. OR I mentioned a machine shop... If I go the machine shop route,would I have to take the crank and pistons and stuff out??? I swear,I am losing my patients with this car!!!! This all started from a blown headgasket in a N/A. Head is,like welded to that block,I found this turbo motor to swap in with almost everything,inc auto tranny that's not gonna get used and now I'M the one killing it with a stupid mistake!!! Really starting to weigh on me. Just looking for my options on how to repair/fix this self induced,avoidable problem. Was totally turning out to be a killer looking engine!!!! Now its gonna look like a pos cause,I'm about to ready to drive it with that broken head bolt!!!!!!!!! Seriously!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
m1ghtymaxXx Posted March 12, 2012 Share Posted March 12, 2012 I presume the bolt broke below the deck of the block? Did you oil them before torquing them? I think a competent machinist shouldn't have too much trouble extracting it. My machinist didn't charge me to take a broken exhaust bolt of out my head that had been there for god knows how long (broken exhaust manifold bolts are quite common on cylinder 6 as the manifold warps over time). As I understand it, the headbolts can be reused as they're not torque to yield in design. I think you would risk compromising the seal of the headgasket after torquing it down though, since I thought the rings get "crushed" and conform to any irregularities. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
proxlamus© Posted March 12, 2012 Share Posted March 12, 2012 Let me advise you on something you might enjoy. I broke the cylinder head bolt in between cylinder 3 and 4. I tried tapping it and removing it.. and i broke the drill bit in the stud and in the block. I tried welding a nut to the end.. the weld broke. Compression remained equal across the board, I ran 18psi and daily drove the Z for 3 years. NO problems. As crazy as that sounds. Maybe I got lucky.. but it didn't effect a thing. Good luck. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hi Def Posted March 12, 2012 Author Share Posted March 12, 2012 Yeah,I had anti-seize on them from the previous attemp at doing this. Shouldn't have re-used the head bolts I think. And yeah,had 2 snapped exhaust bolts in this head. So deep,I never seen them till I tried screwing the new bolts in. Lol Been in there for years I'm sure. And def good to hear (althou not really) about your good bad luck! If that happens to me,I'll shoot this dam car with everything I can even barrow! Lol Thinkin I'm gonna run it,(it poss) untill I can afford to do it again. :/ Just hoping the turbo don't blow it out right away. If it does,? Shop,I'm thinking since hearing drilling didn't work... Then weld broke? Yeah,that sounds like machinst work... Still to mad to go in the garage. Lol Rookie! Lol I sooooo,know better too.. Ugh. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hi Def Posted March 12, 2012 Author Share Posted March 12, 2012 Also,yes.. It's broken below the deck. Over tightened it and snapped it about 3-4 threads below the deck I'm sure. Head is torqued down. It was my last "logical" pattern sequence pass.. Number 2 cly,short bolt manifold side.. Inbetween the cam tower long bolts. New Fel-Pro headgasket,copper sprayed (this time cause it was the 2nd time torquing it down)and new 2nd time used turbo Nissan bolts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
luseboy Posted March 13, 2012 Share Posted March 13, 2012 Have you tried anything to get it out? New headgaskets aren't that expensive... I've heard that headgaskets aren't that bad to take out... I'd see if you can get your hands on a left hand drill bit and just give it a shot. If your running a turbo, then I'd think it would be even more important to have all the headbolts in there. The fact that you put anti seize on the bolts in the beginning gives you a pretty good chance of extracting that thing... I have a feeling it wouldn't be that hard. Don't use an easy out, those things are crap. Left hand drill bit is what you want. Your friend might have one, you might be able to borrow it. Then it's basically like trying to drill a hole in the bolt but you put the drill in reverse, and the idea is that it will catch eventually and screw out the bolt. That's the first thing I'd try in your situation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
djz Posted March 13, 2012 Share Posted March 13, 2012 (edited) What did you "torque" it down with? Also why are you changing/replacing so many gaskets when you are only removing the head? Edited March 13, 2012 by djz Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hi Def Posted March 13, 2012 Author Share Posted March 13, 2012 Gettin to the head gasket isn't bad at all,this just be the third time taking it off. Engine is on a stand out of the car,so its really ez to get it off again. Head bolts aren't cheap. Nissan turbo bolts costed me 90.00. Headgasket kit is 84.00. Which comes with the timing cover gaskets. And I think that's what my friend was talking about. Left handed drill bits. Just don't wanna mess up the block. But as you mentioned it may be worth a try. Outta money for the project at the moment so I'm kinda stuck on what I am ABLE to do. :/ And I'm changing ALL the gaskets cause I bought the engine used and it was sitting on a tire in a garage for atleast 3-4yrs and also cause I found it on Craigslist. Besides,It really needed to be cleaned and painted. Engine sat thru a few paintings. As in,the guy I bought it from,painted his ZX in the garage next to the engine and never covered it so it was full of over spray. Primer,paint and sanding dust. Looked like hell. Lol And yes,hoping the anti-seize will help in gettin it outta there. NEVER RE-USE HEAD BOLTS! Let my mistake teach all!!! And,btw,I used a generic torque wrench. Set at 55 ft lbs. And was on my last pass. I torqued down in 4 stages,ending at 55 ft lbs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BluDestiny Posted March 13, 2012 Share Posted March 13, 2012 Should have been 65ft lbs I think. Also I get my head gaskets from autozone, the felrpo's cost me $20 or so. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hi Def Posted March 13, 2012 Author Share Posted March 13, 2012 I went to Advance Auto I think. Also,I got the Fel-Pro headgasket kit. Just the headgasket alone is 45.00? I'll dbl check as,I will def get another new one. Shitty part,I have the timing cover and oil pan on. Althou,on the oil pan side,I used anti-seize,cause I knew I'd prob be taking it off again,as that is the 2nd pan gasket also. Pan gasket was only 6.00. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BluDestiny Posted March 13, 2012 Share Posted March 13, 2012 You're getting ripped off. Here it is for $20 http://www.autozone.com/autozone/parts/1982-Nissan-Datsun-280ZX/Head-Gasket/_/N-il4clZaliz3 Head gasket SET is $60, but that's the intake/exhaust gasket, valve cover, thermo housing and other knick knacks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
m1ghtymaxXx Posted March 14, 2012 Share Posted March 14, 2012 Since the block is out, I would just take it to a machine shop. They should be a breeze since they won't be corroded, and machinists have probably done it many times before. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hi Def Posted March 14, 2012 Author Share Posted March 14, 2012 I thought about it,and went to the speed shop and was quoted 40-70 bucks.. So I'm gonna take it back apart with a frown and a pile of salt on my shoulder. Lol New bolts and gaskets also.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
luseboy Posted March 15, 2012 Share Posted March 15, 2012 I thought about it,and went to the speed shop and was quoted 40-70 bucks.. So I'm gonna take it back apart with a frown and a pile of salt on my shoulder. Lol New bolts and gaskets also.. That's not too bad! Heck we have charged people more to extract broken bolts off bike parts. No need for the frown and the salt, just look at is as one step forward. Forget about the three steps backward haha. Maybe the gasket you have on there now would have blown after a couple days anyways, and now the one you will be putting on will last for a long time . Haha positive thinking is key. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
djz Posted March 15, 2012 Share Posted March 15, 2012 Either get your torque wrench calibrated before you try again or borrow a known good torque wrench. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hi Def Posted March 15, 2012 Author Share Posted March 15, 2012 Def gonna barrow a known good one!!! IF I even bolt it down. Lol Thought about having them bolt it down. Not like they would charge me a lot for that.. Hard part is gonna be gettin it there. Got a cpl trucks I can use,both pick ups,and I have the option to throw it on a trailer. Def a step forward and def would be at a much better peace of mind while driving. If ARP's weren't so dam much,I'd def drop the cash tor them now but,wow! Pricey pricey... 250? That's steep. For me atleast! Lol I also have a friend that wants to sell me the turbo off his EVO 8,but I told him no since the bolt broke. Might have to call him back on that now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FricFrac Posted March 15, 2012 Share Posted March 15, 2012 (edited) ARP head studs - 202-4206 $150 Edited March 15, 2012 by FricFrac Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LowCarbZ Posted March 15, 2012 Share Posted March 15, 2012 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BLOZ UP Posted March 15, 2012 Share Posted March 15, 2012 I don't know any Nissan, or import really, that uses stretch bolts. You are allowed to reuse them. As long as they aren't corroded, pitted, rusted, whatever, I reuse them. If they are, I find a used one in my stash that isn't. Never had this happen. Man, I thought exhaust studs were bad, must suck to have to take the head off again and get a new head gasket. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hi Def Posted March 16, 2012 Author Share Posted March 16, 2012 FricFrac,where did you find those ARP's for 150.? Def interested in those. As the Nissan bolts are 90.00. And Bloz,if you re-use the factory bolts,are ARP's worth the xtra 50? What do you guys think about ARP's? I'm not doing a major build or anything,but def may do some turbo,fuel,ecu upgrades in the future... If I had to name a HP limit,I'd have to say like 300-350ish... Anything more then that,I'd prob build something else.. Also,what does anyone thing about the metal headgaskets? Another pricey option I see!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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