Who has an aftermarket turbo manifold?

[zboi]

Anyone running aftermarket turbo manifold?
I see the ones at protunerz and cx racing.

Protunerz one is very poorly engineered, places turbo right next to intake and brake distribution block. Have found someone running it, confirmed brakes get boiled and on top of that it is full of cracks (not surprised seeing that 6 into 1 T3 junction).
CX racings manifold looks far better, but says it only works with their intake. Anyone try that or any other ones?

[Zetsaz]

On 8/23/2023 at 12:40 PM, zboi said:

Anyone running aftermarket turbo manifold?
I see the ones at protunerz and cx racing.

Protunerz one is very poorly engineered, places turbo right next to intake and brake distribution block. Have found someone running it, confirmed brakes get boiled and on top of that it is full of cracks (not surprised seeing that 6 into 1 T3 junction).
CX racings manifold looks far better, but says it only works with their intake. Anyone try that or any other ones?

 

Not that things can't be done better, but the protunerz manifold is on some pretty high budget cars. It's limitations and most of its "poor engineering" has nothing to do with their design and everything to do with the L series. Unless you do full custom with longer piping running behind the engine or under the oil pan to get the turbo on the passenger side, it's always going to be right under the intake and will also always be at least somewhat close to the brake master unless you have a right hand drive car. The stock manifold had the same issues.

The L series regardless of the manifold you pick will always have some heat issues to deal with due to it's reverse flow/non-crossflow design.

Haven't heard anything about them being full of cracks, that might be a one off, and they're pretty good about backing up their work. 

 

For what it's worth, I would trust the quality and customer service of ProTunerz over CX any day. The fact that CX's turbo manifold for the L series looks  better has no bearing on its actual quality. I'm more than happy to be wrong, but it's not for nothing that many people are running the ProTunerz and almost no one is running the CX one. 

[AydinZ71]

The protuners one is good for what you are paying. I agree with Zetsaz on the L-series being a non-cross flow head as the primary issue. Saying something is poorly engineered is bold statement. Detailed engineering and testing costs money. It is very difficult to get a custom manifold made out of 304SS, hand welded, sold for ~$1k, and still make some profit. There really isn’t any engineering that went into it at all. they picked a primary diameter, and arranged bends and straight lengths to have them all come together one one location. If you want a manifold that takes into account actual fluid dynamics etc, you are looking for something double the price or more. There isn’t enough volume to make money off them. We have some talented TIG welders out there, and none of them offer something better because they know they couldn't make a decent return with the labor necessary. I suspect Hussein orders many at a time out of China. Take a look at there NA headers for instance. You can get a pacesetter or MSA for cheap, but they are garbage compared to the $1-$3k stainless headers from Zstory, Kameari, Fujitsubo, etc. you get what you paid for

I suggest contacting a header fabrication shop and ask them to quote you a custom unit. You will likely end up again choosing between the two options you mentioned. 

Edited August 24, 2023 by AydinZ71

[zboi]

I'm asking for people with experience with them guys, not some emotional crap. Yes everyone knows the head design sucks, yes people with lots of money buy it, but if anything someone shilling out big bucks on a l28 is not the ideal model for intelligent choices.
I will reiterate, I have asked actual people running protunerz manifold and have posted the actual findings. If you look at the photos of theirs you will see the turbo is literally millimeters from the brake distribution block, wheras the stock turbo manifold and CX one are much further away. 
I would like actual experience from someone with CX or some other brands.
Also as you stated, any person with a brain would look at the L-series and think "why don't we put the exhaust/turbo on the other side?" Further enforcing that these people should not be held highly for design choices.

[AydinZ71]

You got a pretty shitty attitude. No one really cares about what you want. Good luck with your search. 

[Zetsaz]

Agreed with everything @AydinZ71 said here. 

 

1 hour ago, zboi said:

I'm asking for people with experience with them guys, not some emotional crap.
Also as you stated, any person with a brain would look at the L-series and think "why don't we put the exhaust/turbo on the other side?" Further enforcing that these people should not be held highly for design choices.

 

You're not helping the discussion by criticizing feedback as "emotional crap." I'm running a lightly ported stock exhaust manifold, but I know 3 people personally who are running the protunerz and have seen its fitment, helped them work on their cars, and driven with them. None of them have had issues with cracks so far. It's decent quality for what it is, but the limited engineering time was focused on allowing it to work with the size of turbos they were aiming for  and clearing stock components like the steering shaft and even AC which is why it's farther back than the CX manifold which doesn't have much clearance for that. People who are running oversized GT35 turbos with a large hot side are going to get progressively closer to brake components, there's no getting around that.

Moving the turbo to the other side is definitely an option, but as a vendor its pros are outweighed by the cons. I've seen at least one person recently that moved the turbo over to the passenger side, only one other before that. I think they ran a stock NA manifold or did custom parts added onto an aftermarket NA part like the MSA header. You run into the issue of hot exhaust gases running right underneath the oil pan or behind the head which is already the hottest part of the engine. As far as making any sort of off-the-shelf production manifold like that, you have to start considering the fact that you're running somewhat long lengths of pipe before you get to the turbo. It adds weight and size which affects shipping cost, as well as adding to materials cost, and it gets progressively harder to guarantee your welds will hold based on how people reinforce where the turbo is mounted and how heavy their specific turbo is. If you think the ProTunerz manifold is poor quality and prone to cracks, something designed around moving the turbo to the opposite side will be way more likely to develop them due to the torque placed on bends created by a much longer lever arm the turbo is acting on. If you're adding supports to provide for people to mitigate this, it's hard to guarantee they'll actually fit if people are running any aftermarket parts like ignition coils, and again, adds even more to the cost of materials and design time. Depending on where you have the turbo end up, you can also be close to aftermarket ignition coils which you don't want running too hot. That's its own other problem.  

I've only seen one person that had their turbo as close to the brake distribution block as you mentioned and it was massive (probably way oversized for what their engine was capable of honestly). At some point you can't account for every other mod and option people choose to go with if you're trying to make a mass produced product. 

TL;DR - You said the people making these shouldn't be held highly for their design choices, but they didn't just not think of this - they just aren't aiming for maximum performance . Its a high-ish volume part intended to be usable by as many people as possible while keeping costs down for themselves and the end buyer. 

 

Like Aydin said, what you're looking for is going to cost plenty of money and will probably never be available as a ready-to-go aftermarket part. 

[Zetsaz]

Just as an example of the engineering costs adding up, the ProTunerz intake is a fine piece that looks pretty but it's pretty basic and not overly engineered.

 

@lowrider from Milkfab is in the final stages of an actual performance intake, and the preorder is about 60%+ more than the ProTunerz intake despite being a low volume part that seems like more of a passion project. The price is only going up after the initial pre-order. 

 

Good engineering isn't just amazing parts, it's also working within specific limitations, and I think your complaints about the limited aftermarket options are ignoring that. 

[Brad-ManQ45]

When you can get over 600 hp with a ported stock manifold I don't see getting an aftermarket one...particularly since Boone has done a before/after...

[zboi]

1 hour ago, Brad-ManQ45 said:

When you can get over 600 hp with a ported stock manifold I don't see getting an aftermarket one...particularly since Boone has done a before/after...

Who is Boone and where are the results? Stock turbo manifolds go for ~$400 these days, in questionable condition.. 

@Zetsaz Thanks for providing examples. Have they been driving their cars a lot, and for a couple years?
Doesn't sound like there are any other vendor offerings then. I have been leaning towards the NA manifold + crossover. Seems aftermarket only has long tube headers that merge too far back to be worth modifying. 

Not really interested in intakes, though since you mention, I imagine the protunerz one with its significantly shorter looking runners would be really bad for these cars. A shame cause it would make fitting DBW throttle body easy. Milkfab one looks nice, maybe someone will buy it.
 

[Zetsaz]

5 hours ago, Brad-ManQ45 said:

When you can get over 600 hp with a ported stock manifold I don't see getting an aftermarket one...particularly since Boone has done a before/after...

 

Do you have a link to the before/after? Would love to see it

[Brad-ManQ45]

https://www.angelfire.com/extreme/280zxt/

[HowlerMonkey]

Cast steel wins the day.