"Operation Iraqi Freedom III"

[David K]

Call it what you wanna call it, but i call it pure BS. My family got the email yesterday that my brothers unit 3/69 based out of Fort Benning, Georgia (along with MANY others across the US) is being sent back to Iraq sometime between October 2004-March 2005. My brother had been back in Cali training out in the Mojave desert for 2 whole months for some reason he couldnt explain. So close to home but he couldnt see us. He did not plan on telling my mother about his plans because she cant handle it. The Army sent an email to my mothers house telling us that hes going back. My brother is a little upset that they did that.

 

I guess the US is "fighting" a war in chapters? Part III? Wow, dont get your hopes up people, we are going to be there for a very long time. The end is not near, more people are going to die, which really phucking sux.

[Pop N Wood]

Having been in the military, in peace time, all I can say is that people take service members for granted until they are truely needed.

 

Send him a picture of the towers on fire to remind him why he is there, and tell him thanks from me. Probably not much to offer him, but it is the best we can do.

[blueovalz]

Ok, I'm confused. Are we in Iraq because of 9/11, or was that why we are still chasing Usama in Afganistan? I was raised to take care of first things first, then do the clean up work later.

[David K]

I dont know. My brothers unit was the 3rd inf mechanized who punched through up from Kuwait and took Bahgdad. He brought some of his buddies from his unit when he came to visit home in cali. They are all good guys. I dont understand why the men who were there before need to be sent back. Hopefully, since my brother is a tank mechanic, they have him working on tanks 24/7, no patrols. But who knows.

[zeeboost]

This whole crap about going to Iraq doesn't make any sense to me. From what I understand, they didn't really have anything to do with 9/11. That came from Afghanistan, Palestine, etc. The training and the suicidal maniacs came from Afghanistan, and I'm pretty sure the funding for 9/11 came from Palestine -- Palestine or Iran -- but I distinctly remember reading that it didn't come from Iraq. I'm curious as to why we put Saddam into power there, and then we go on this huge powertrip to go remove him. Even when we knew he was slaughtering his own people, we were still supplying him with weapons

 

Then again, I'm not authorized to view classified information, so maybe there's something that the public just doesn't know about to prevent chaos...or perhaps my sources are all out of whack. Who knows

 

Sorry, I'm not trying to start another political argument again...

[Moridin]

As far as I remember, Osama and Saddam where bitter enemies. Iraq was a secular state and Bin Laden could hardly handle that.

[johnc]

Every expatriate Iraqi that I've met has said that they are grateful for what the US has done (and is still doing) for the Iraqi people. There are also a lot of blogs out there from Iraqis in country that feel the same way.

 

http://healingiraq.blogspot.com

 

Iraqi women representing fifty five women groups and organizations from all over Iraq gathered at Fardus square this morning to sign a petition against Resolution 137, to demand equal rights, and fair unbiased representation (at least 40%) in the future Iraqi Transitional Council, governorate, and municipal councils.

 

The sit-in was organized by the Supreme Council of Iraqi Women, the Advisory Committee for Women Affairs, and the Iraqi Women Network. Other noted women groups were present such as the Iraqi Contemporary Women Movement, Organization for Women Freedom in Iraq, Iraqi Hope Association (Amal), Independent Women Organization, Womens Union of Kurdistan, Kurdistan Free Women Movement, Iraqi Women Revival Organization, and the Iraqi Students and Youth Union. I think AYS or Omar have a list of the groups.

 

Several women activists gave speeches. Yanar Mohammad, Zakiyah Khalifah, Maysun Al-Damluji, Hana Edward, and GC member Sungol Chabok also made a late appearance. Planning Minister Dr. Mahdi Al-Hafudh shyly gave a brief word of support and signed the petition.

 

It got interesting when a woman in a burqa showed up at the gathering with her three kids. Reporters all stormed forward trying to interview her. Her husband was imprisoned for years by the former regime for political reasons only to be executed in the end and for her to pay for the bullets. A very heartrending story. She held his death certificate as you can see in the pictures. She said "We didn't wait all these years without the most basic rights to be denied them now". An Arab reporter asked her if she was Sunni or Shi'ite. "I'm neither!" she snapped at him "I'm an Iraqi citizen first and foremost, and I refuse to be asked such a question".

 

Maybe the reason's we went into the country are a bit muddled now but removing another genocidal dictator is always a good thing. We forget that too often when looking at things from a US political perspective.

[JMortensen]

If Clinton had gone into Iraq in '94 instead of sending in a couple of cruise missiles, no one would have any gripes about this whole thing. I think the WMD pretense for this is BS, and we had justification regardless of WMD's. Hindsight being 20/20, we probably should have taken him out in '91, but NO ONE wanted to do that back then. Funny to listen to Gore a few years back blaming Bush Sr, then look back a couple more years to his "We should not take out Saddam" stance from '91.

 

I don't think Iraq has to be justified as part of the "war on terror". I think there was ample justification since Saddam didn't keep his end of the cease fire agreement from '91. IMO Dubya's biggest mistake was trying to justify this as part of the war on terror, and making such a big deal out of the WMD's.

 

But that is just my interpretation. And calling Iraq a quagmire or comparing it to Vietnam is laughable. McNamara would have killed (maybe I should say would have killed MORE) for the type of gains we've made in Iraq in the timeframe that we have made them.

 

I'm not happy that we are there either, but I think the opposition is on shaky ground with a lot of the rote arguments...

 

As to why we supported Saddam or Usama in the past, people again look at the situation from the present viewpoint. At the time, Iran was a much bigger threat to us being a fundamentalist dictatorship than secular Iraq, so we supported Iraq. Same with Usama. It wasn't that we liked him, it was that we were fighting the cold war against Russia. The Northern Alliance guys aren't going to win any popularity contests here either, but they were the group best suited to fighting the Taliban. The US does this all the time. We have a choice of being isolationists which sucks, or getting into everyone's business which sucks. I can't tell whether we're making the right decisions or the wrong decisions in all of these cases, but it's more complicated than I think some of you are making it out to be.

 

My $.02 political sense...

 

Jon

[Kevin Shasteen]

I always like to take a look at Politics through the eyes of Religion. Inspite of the cliche' "Separation of church and state" I believe you can not make that separation on a metaphysical level. Therefore both Economics and Politics becomes Religious in nature.

 

Without going into a 1000 word report on Politics and Religion I would simply say, that my belief for the purpose of our military being in the Middle East, is bascially "A Road Map to Jerusalem". I believed this before 9/11. IMHO, my belief was only confirmed with the after affects brought on by 9/11. The confirmations were the so called "War on Terror", with our military going to Iraq: instead of Saudi Arabia-where most of the "Terrorists" responsible for 9/11 were reportedly from.

 

What is interesting is that the UN DESIRES the HQ to be located in Jerusalem. The Pope has some interesting ties to the Arabs. George W was asked during his run for the presidency, "Would you support the decision to move the UN to Jerusalem" of which he agreed he would. George W was also asked if his beliefs would interfere w/his dad's globalists ideolgies. George W responded by looking square in the camera, "Make NO MISTAKE, I am a Globalist!" So I guess to understand what is going on we would have to familiarize ourselves with what the globalists want-the perhaps our state of affairs might make more sence.

 

I have also read reports that the Vatican owns 60% of Jerusalem investments (no I can not confirm this-I can only report what I have read): if this is true then the Vatican has a huge role in ensuring "Peace-Peace" in the Middle East. Certainly the creation of "The Dept. of Homeland Security" and its following Patriot Acts are alos very telling.

 

I dont like how things have played out either yet I find the fundamentals of Problem-Reaction-Solution within the realm of Economics, Politics, and Religion rather facinating...and no this doesnt help anyone or their family members that are currently experiencing hard ships: these are just my thoughts on what is going on.

 

As far as attmpting to identify all the dynamics in our current state of affairs, well-that is an immensly complicated issue. The best book, besides the scriptures, that I have ever read is a book called:

 

"The Third Wave" by Alvin Toffler...undercaption: the Classic Study of Tomorrow with a Copywrite of 1980 and published by Bantam Books. ISBN# 0-553-24698-4.

 

Another insightful book is, "The Creature from Jekyl Island" which outlines the stance in Economics, Politics, and Religion that the US Govt has taken leading up to now. Just do a search on the net for that title.

 

Another insightful book was "Pawns in the Game" by Commander William G. Carr. Just do a search on the net and you will find plenty of info: as it is still in print. He was brought up with a Bravarian education. He escaped that lifestyle and moved to Canada. Commander Carr wrote his book in the mid 1950's. In the introduction to his book he identified what WW1, WW2 were about, and what would initiate WW3. His assumption on what would initiate WW3 was based on his Bravarian upbringing. He said WW3 would be initatiated by an Arab strike on the USA. Remember he said this in the mid 50's: quite a prediction.

 

In Toffler's book he talked about how one could identify the struggles between the 1st Wave Society, 2nd Wave Society, and the 3rd Wave Society. He claimed with the advent of the computer and microchip that a 4th Wave Society was on the verge...but in the late 70's and early 80's when he was actually writing his book-it was too early to tell what the impact on Economics and Politics this 4th Wave Society would have when it clashes with the previous 3 Societies.

 

Anyway-his book was about how one could identify the different waves of Socicities. His presumption was that by identifying a particular Wave of Society that you could also identify its Regulatory Checks and Balances.

 

By doing so you could then also identify what stage in their transition to a higher Wave they were in. Also, another presumption he made was that when a new Society Wave comes along it clashes with the previous Societal Wave. As a result, the up and coming Society wants control but doesnt have the Authority to surplant the previous Society (Grandfather Clause)-therefore a struggle, battle or war in economics and politics must occur. The outcome of the struggle ends up with the stronger of the two ruling the weaker of the two. So much for freedom and free choice

 

The book was very insightlful. However, the author didnt dive into the realm of Religion so IMHO his comments lacked a third depth of understanding as he only concentrated on economics and politics: yet his comments in that area were on point.

 

Anyway, I'll continue going on record and out on a limb that our military will be there for a long long time. Peace in the Middle East is the current agenda. It doesnt matter if our military is under the control of the US, UN, or NATO (it does matter to me but the US govt never asks me for my opinion) as there will continue to be an International Military in the Middle East until Jerusalem is conquered (Peace...not).

 

I believe that the lines in the sand will narrow between the 2nd/3rd and 4th Wave Soceity, in the next few years. The clash is between the common man -vs- the king/queen/president and the 4th Wave Soceity which is Nationalism -vs- Globalism.

 

IMHO-as I said at the beginning of this post: You can not separate Politics from Religion. The problem I think with our governmental controls is human nature-in that there will always be someone who wants something they dont have a right to: as a result-who stands up for those who are being tresspassed upon?

 

It is a twisted quagmire of muddied water-where it ends..,

 

Kevin,

(Yea,Still an Inliner)

[Guest Phil1934]

The good news is Iranian radio reported we captured Osama. The bad news is they say we will keep him under wraps until closer to election day. And did you know the gov't gve MCI/World Com an $11 billion telecommunications rebuilding contract in Iraq and only cancelled it due to public outcry? I guess the scandals did not influence them. I also guess that's why Kenneth Lay has yet to even be indicted. He was a major campaign contributor, but surely that wouldn't influence them either. Remember the stories that people got sick using containers from the nuclear plant for water storage after the loss of infrastucture? If we were worried about nuclear weapons you'd have thought we would have sent troops to guard a nuclear plant. We did send troops to guard the oil fields, though. And we did hand the majority of contracts to Halliburton, who is also involved in bribing Nigerian officials while Cheney was president. And at home we are bombarded with one nation, one opinion billboards and I support Bush and our troops. I do support our troops, but here's where politics and religion are alike. You should have enough faith to be willing to ask questions.

[johnc]

This thread is like reading the script to an Oliver Stone movie...

[Kevin Shasteen]

.., The good news is Iranian radio reported we captured Osama. The bad news is they say we will keep him under wraps until closer to election day.., We did send troops to guard the oil fields, though. And we did hand the majority of contracts to Halliburton, who is also involved in bribing Nigerian officials while Cheney was president.., You should have enough faith to be willing to ask questions..,

 

I've been hearing the rumor that we've had Usama for about three months now-and that he was not alive but dead and on ice. Being put on ice and the news of his capture/death was not to be let out until election time.

 

BTW: his name is sama, with a U not an O: the media changed it as too many people were complaining that the first three initials in Usama's name were USA.

 

Phil,

 

Did you read the article where Haliburton has controlling stock in the company that makes...get this, Duct Tape and the majority of all Plastic Sheeting! Remember when the presidential admin proclaimed we (the idots chickey little's) could only protect ourselves by buying duct tape and rolls of plastic sheeting?

 

About having enough faith to ask questions...all I can say is, "I heard dat!"

 

Johnc...life is stranger than fiction (definately Oliver Stone material here).

 

Kevin,

(Yea,Still an Inliner)