Guest iskone Posted March 9, 2004 Share Posted March 9, 2004 I've got rust in my floor boards and my passenger side inner fender. I don't know how to weld but I'd like to learn, all I have for welding is books so I would have to buy the equipment. But I think it could be cheaper to have some body shop do the work not to mention the work quality. Does anybody know of a good body shop that works with Z's in the Puget Sound area of Washington? Or should I just say screw paying a shop and try to do it myself? Should this be in the Chasis forum? If so could somebody move it? Thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PUSHER Posted March 10, 2004 Share Posted March 10, 2004 My halfass method: Cut out all the rust affected metal and fiberglass over it. That should take care of the floor pretty easily, and if the holes on the outside arent to big you can easily fiberglass over that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tim240z Posted March 10, 2004 Share Posted March 10, 2004 The Z has a unibody. weld in new floors and weld in patch panels for the rusted areas. The Z body is weak enough without just band aiding the problem. You have the right idea, Iskone...sorry don't have any recommendations in your area. Try just driving around and looking at shops in the area and talking to the owners. Tim Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
datsunlover Posted March 10, 2004 Share Posted March 10, 2004 Well, it's good to weld.. but before I had the know how/cash to pay a welder I had to fix the floor's in a few cars, (two Z's in there..) and some sheet metal rivited in place works quite well. Cut out the rusted metal, wire wheel the spots that still have surface rust, then cut a patch to fit with 2" or so overhang. With plenty of rivits, and then a good thick application of tar over the patch, it does the trick. No good for exterior areas, but this will work well on the floor pan and iner wheel well. Keep in mind though, as Tim pointed out, Z's have a unibody.. meaning if the rust has eaten the floor, and is starting on the tranny tunel or rockers, it will need more than sheet metal patch panels and tar. You really need to pull up the carpet, interior panels and see how much rust is hiding in there. Then figure out where to start! That is, if you want to do it yourself. I have found though, when you pay a shop to do this kind of work, they hack it and do a $hitty job. So a few years later, the car is actually WORSE off than it was. I was rebuilding my rad saddle one day and a 'profesional' body man came by to look at it.. He said "Heck man... why are you doing it the hard way? Just put the new metal right over the old rusted stuf, and tar it up man! Takes a while for it to rust through that way." Yah. That's what the last shop did to my car (8 years ago) and it is a nightmare for me now. Just check out the shop good if you're gona pay someone else to do it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gramercyjam Posted March 10, 2004 Share Posted March 10, 2004 I'm pretty sure the floor is a structural member of the car because of the unibody construction. Pop rivits may attach the floor to the rest of the car, but you will have lost some rigidity. If the floor wasn't an important part of the structure, Datsun wouldn't have bothered with adding the frame rail from the firewall back to the seat support. I am not aware of any bodyshops that will do the kind of quality work that I would want on my car. To have that kind of work done, you should really see a restoration specialist who has the skills and will take the time to do it right. Of course for that kind of money, you may be able to equip your own shop properly and DIY. If the car is just transportation for you, yea, go ahead and have somebody weld in some patch panels and tar them over. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest iskone Posted March 10, 2004 Share Posted March 10, 2004 Thanks for the advice. There is no way I want to fiberglass over the rusted spots at all. I want my car to handle well so my car needs all the strength it can get. It looks like I would be best off buying a welder and picking up some scrap to practice on for a week or month or year. How ever long it takes. Plus when you're modifying your car a welder is kind of a must anyway, or at least really nice to have around. I think I'll get a mig welder. Any suggestions? I would obviously need to weld sheet, but I would also like to weld heavier for motor mounts or lsd braces etc... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gramercyjam Posted March 10, 2004 Share Posted March 10, 2004 Get the most expensive welder you can afford. You get what you pay for in welders. Get one that uses gas shielding if you can afford that too. It makes all the difference. I use one of the Lincoln SP 135 plus with a 122 cu ft bottle with Argon gas mix. Anybody can do a good job right away on 18 gauge up to about 1/8", and with some practice, you can go thinner or thicker with good results too. It seems to have a pretty good power supply that isn't real sensitive to line voltage variations. Before I got this unit, I was using a Century 155 flux core welder, and that thing just aggravated me to no end. Slight dips in the line voltage made it all but unusable and welds have a very poor appearance with a lot of inclusions. Of course, if you can find a TIG unit, all the better, they weld the best. If I could ever find a decent used TIG setup for about the same price as a MIG, I'd go for it. You get much better control on the thin stuff with TIG. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iaconsultants Posted March 10, 2004 Share Posted March 10, 2004 I believe that rust is just car cancer it needs to be removed completely to get rid of it. Also if you are looking for a rust free floor, I think the wrecked 240Z I have might be good for what you want. Let me know if you want me to find someone that will cut it out for you. I don't have a torch where the car is in California but I could probably find someone that does and then it would just cost you the cut out cost and the shipping and you can have the entire floors with the trans tunnel if you want. I am taking the few parts I need from the car at this time and going to put anything that people might want for real cheap on ebay just so it does not go to the junk yard heaven so fast. Let me know if you are interested in it and its yours. I would still recommend practicing on some scrap metal and then replace anything that might have rust. I will try to go tonight to pull the brake cable of it because I need it for my rear brake conversion on my 78 280z and at that time I will see if the passenger side area you need is any good or not. The car is not rusty but it was hit hard near the passenger door and rear wheel. Hope this helps Robert Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SHO-Z Posted March 11, 2004 Share Posted March 11, 2004 If you get some estimates on what you need done compare them to the cost of the tools you need to do it your self. I think you will have some new tools and fun doing it your self. One of the best things about having one of the old Zs is working on them and modifying them. I do agree with the post above, using a cheap mig welder, they are a pain and I was a pipe welder for years and fought that welder all of the time building my convertible, but it was borrowed! Have Fun Fixing the Rust! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
datsunlover Posted March 11, 2004 Share Posted March 11, 2004 I'm pretty sure the floor is a structural member of the car because of the unibody construction. Pop rivits may attach the floor to the rest of the car, but you will have lost some rigidity. If the floor wasn't an important part of the structure, Datsun wouldn't have bothered with adding the frame rail from the firewall back to the seat support. Well, I wouldn't say the floor is a big of a structural member as the rockers and trany tunnel. Yes Datsun put 'frame rails' of a sort... but they were very thin and would really only prevent the floor pan from flexing along the long flat areas. Try jacking up a Z on the factory 'rails'. I just suggested pop rivets and patch panels because it's cheap, and if the tunel/rockers are ok, the car will still hold up fairly well structurally. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lilj Posted March 11, 2004 Share Posted March 11, 2004 try ebay, they sell some replacement floors for the 70s z-cars.. i know there was a guy sellin some for a 280zx right now.. he might have some for your car. -- his auction is no longer on there.. kinda wish i could figure out who it was =( i'll keep an eye out though. -- also, i have a rust... HOLE.. under where my spare tire goes. lol.. i'm removing all the tar and stuff from my hatch and going to use a torch to cut out around the spot and just weld up some sheet metal and form it. lots of work for fixin some damn rust lol. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
waynekarnes Posted March 11, 2004 Share Posted March 11, 2004 years ago, my buddy was having trouble finding a body shop that was willing to work on his 60 impala convertible ... too old, we don't do custom work, you can't afford us, ect, was about all he heard from the body shops. he found a rust free floor and trunk. got the wrecking yard to cut the floor and trunk out. called around to several welders in our area, took the impala to Drakes welding. he removed all the interior, before taking it there. they cut the old floor out, welded in all the replacement parts. cost him about a 3rd of what the body shops wanted . you may want to call around to welding shops in your area. what about Zedd's auto parts in canada ? they have almost all the replacement parts you need for the floor and under the battery. good luck, wayne Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
j260z Posted March 11, 2004 Share Posted March 11, 2004 if you want to do it right then check out this site http://www.datsunzparts.com/start.htm these panels are designed to be replica parts but stronger. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest iskone Posted March 11, 2004 Share Posted March 11, 2004 IA I'm not ready right now, I have to wait till I'm done with my house before I can start on my car. I was planning to get some estimates vs. the price of a welder, but I am leaning towards a wedler because I want to do supensions mods that will require a welder. I priced some welders that were around $500 is that goining to be a quality welder? What about $1,000 but that's a little step for me. Thanks for the help Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gramercyjam Posted March 11, 2004 Share Posted March 11, 2004 Well, I wouldn't say the floor is a big of a structural member as the rockers and trany tunnel. Yes Datsun put 'frame rails' of a sort... but they were very thin and would really only prevent the floor pan from flexing along the long flat areas. Guess what the frame rails ahead of the firewall attach to at the firewall. No, not the tranny tunnel or the rockers. Yes, it is the firewall, the floor and the floor frame rails. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
datsunlover Posted March 11, 2004 Share Posted March 11, 2004 Dude.... I'm not gona get into a flame war with you over this, I was just trying to help someone out. (You know.. the guy who SATARTED this post?) And you think you know it all, and I think I know.. whatever man. I'm not doing this crap. ISKone, sorry about your thread getting hijacked here! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gramercyjam Posted March 12, 2004 Share Posted March 12, 2004 You have convinced me. Pop rivters rule. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest iskone Posted March 12, 2004 Share Posted March 12, 2004 I just wrote a gaint post and then it asked me to log in again! I'll sum it up: I can't weigh in on the poprivet thing because I have no exsperince. If I but a welder it would probally be a MillerMatic 175 for $660 of ebay with free shipping. With other the other stuff I'll need I should be in for $900. A welder in my area charges $80 per hour to come out to your house and work. All the work I need done would be the floors, passenger rocker panel just behind the wheel, passenger side inner fender, and some work on the the cross member(for the pivot relocation mod). Thanks Isk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Your Car is Slow Posted March 12, 2004 Share Posted March 12, 2004 The Lincoln SP135 will do everything that miller will..and cost 260 bucks less...and can be found at lowes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest iskone Posted March 12, 2004 Share Posted March 12, 2004 Really? I'll have to look it up on the net to be sure, not that I doubt you but I gotta see for myself. You know how it is, can't just listen to whatever people tell you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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