Guest z31_drifter Posted December 6, 2004 Share Posted December 6, 2004 Ok I guess I was wrong, sorry . You guys think I can do the V-8 swap for cheaper and have more H.P then a turbocharged 3.1L from Rebello. If so, then I'll do the V-8 swap. I mean it would be better then a turbocharged 3.1L right? I would like to run in the 11's down the 1/4 mile too so a V-8 would be the best way to do that right? Magnum - My AIM SN is My Z31 300ZX Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikelly Posted December 7, 2004 Share Posted December 7, 2004 Uh, Yea Magnum I've PERSONALLY broken cranks in 350 Chevys... And What I typed above I stand by... Cast cranks are fine for production cars that won't see severe duty, but anything I'm building won't have that garbage on it... as for those heads, yea they are nice... But not on a Zcar project...Not in my opinion anyway... $800 for those heads, when you could have the same performance for about $350 more and a LOT less weight, yea that makes sense... But again, you get what you pay for. But I guess everyone's budget is different and everyone's version of "Hard Driving" has a different definition... Mike 8) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikelly Posted December 7, 2004 Share Posted December 7, 2004 Z31 Drifter, My question for you is this: What do you intend to do with your car? Will it be your daily driver? Do you plan to put 100K trouble free miles on it? Will it see 6K RPMs of hard reving on a daily basis? Is this car your only means of transportation? IF you want to build something reasonable and cheap, GO the route that Magnum has set up for you. It will probably get you into the 13s (Check here with other members who have built budget motors) and will probably feel faster than anything you will imagine. However, If you truly plan to build an 11 second car, you should seriosuly consider a NEW budget and a NEW set of expectations for parts. Racersoutlet is a vendor on ebay who sells performance parts very reasonably... You can get a Scat 9000 crank, Hbeam forged rods with ARP Capscrews and a set of Wiesco Forged pistons W/ oins and rings all for about $800 shipped. That is an internal balance setup and would be good for well into 450HP range for many many miles... I'd start sourcing a block and buy some books and learn how to assamble your motor properly... Or talk to a local builder who could assemble the parts for you... Mike 8) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest z31_drifter Posted December 7, 2004 Share Posted December 7, 2004 Mikelly - I would like to build a streetable car, that I can drive around and have fun with but is also fast. Maybe 450 - 500 HP is too much, I dunno. I don't want a full out drag racing car. I want a car that I can drive around, is fast and is quick in the 1/4 mile. I know there would need to be alot done to it to be able withstand that much HP. I'm having new frame rails put in because the ones on it now are rusted, well it's at the body shape, what other things should I have them do to strengthen the frame? I'll get a roll cage for it later. I don't know how to weld yet but I am going to learn, hopefully I will get into Wyotech. I am gonna take there automovite technology and Chassis Fabrication and High Performance Engines programs Also, would it be better to buy a shortblock with pistons, crank, and rods allready in it or buy a "naked" shortblock and choose my own pistons, crank and rods? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grumpyvette Posted December 7, 2004 Share Posted December 7, 2004 IF you insist on a NEW ENGINE, you have several options IF you are not willing to settle for an available crate engine, and there are dozens of combos available,in the long run the cheapest way to build an engine is to decide EXACTLY WHAT PARTS you want and either collect and assemble them yourself or purchase them and have a TRUST WORTHY local machineshop assemble them for you. but in many cases its far cheaper to pay a little more up front and install a factory crate engine. the other popular option is to buy a complete wrecked car and swap as much of the drivetrain into your (Z) as you can,YOU DON,T need 500hp in a (Z) to have excellent performance! find a late model LS1 corvette/camaro wreck, as an example heres a complete LSI with TRANS for under $4000 http://www.gmsportssalvage.com/ http://www.gmsports.com/album.asp?cat=ENGINES%20FOR%20SALE2000%20LS1%20350 performance is mostly about the power to weight ratio a 400hp corvette at about 3400 lbs (driver included) will have similar performance to a 2900 lb (Z) with only 341hp Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest z31_drifter Posted December 7, 2004 Share Posted December 7, 2004 Which block would be better? A 350 sbc (1973 - 85) or a ZZ4? I am kind of leaning towards the ZZ4. This might be a dumb questions but would I be able to use the SCAT 9000 cranks and the other items that Mikelly listed above in it or are there certain cranks and pistons, etc for this engine. I just wanna be sure. Or would it be better to buy a ZZ4 shortblock complete with crank, pistons, rods, etc allready in it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Magnum Rockwilder Posted December 8, 2004 Share Posted December 8, 2004 Old cars with semi-built motors are dime-a-dozen... example: 80's camaros, monte carlos, pickups, etc. They make great donors. There's a local ad for a wrecked '93 Z28 with an LS1 and T56 for $1500. There's also an '87 Monte Carlo with a 350 installed in it, and the whole car is $300. There's an El Camino with a built up 350 for $600... I could go on all day. I'd say the best thing to do is get your mounts made and ready to go since you already have the JTR book, then start gathering all the parts you need. You can either build up a balls-out high hp motor from the getgo, or install a basic V8 and upgrade it here and there. Either way you'll be better of than trying to build a hopped up L28... considering your budget (or lack thereof). When you buy a complete donor car, many times you can end up MAKING money off of the leftover car after you yank the motor/tranny. I'm a broke redneck, so I speak the truth. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest z31_drifter Posted December 9, 2004 Share Posted December 9, 2004 Well I am probably gonna go with a ZZ4 shortblock, add some JE or Wiseco forged pistons, Scat 9000 crank, Eagle I beam rods, plus all the other goodies. Gonna start working with my dad to earn some cash so I can get started on building the bottom end. What books are good to read, to learn how to assemble the bottom end and everything else? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest DiZeased_240 Posted December 9, 2004 Share Posted December 9, 2004 Magnum, Just for the record is the '93 Z28 you listed have a transplanted engine because the LS1 didn't show up in Z28's until '98. The correct engine for that model should be the LT1. That of course unless it had a swap performed. z31_drifter, There is really no right or wrong block to use. Most people perform their swaps based on their budget. It seems you have a direction you want to go in, now I suggest you sit down and see if your money can attain that goal. Do as much research as possible and make list of everything you need before you buy anything. One of my favorite sites to reference is a Z built by one of the HybridZ members, Pete Paraska. Here's the link: http://alteredz.com/ You'll find a lot useful information at that site. If you have a specific question by all means ask and good luck. BTW the shortblock ZZ4 is a great bottom end for decent power. With the right combo of cam, heads, intake and carb you should make 400hp/400ftlb. Just remember that the car you are putting it in weighs a lot less than what these engines were originally built for, and you will be able to feel the difference! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Magnum Rockwilder Posted December 9, 2004 Share Posted December 9, 2004 Magnum... the '93 Z28... LS1 Sorry, LT1, not LS1. It's already sold, too. It was hit front and rear, but supposedly ran good. I didn't need it anyways, but it was a helluva deal. I've seen a couple of them for <$2500 lately. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest z31_drifter Posted December 9, 2004 Share Posted December 9, 2004 Well I am probably gonna go with a ZZ4 shortblock, add some JE or Wiseco forged pistons, Scat 9000 crank, Eagle I beam rods, plus all the other goodies. Gonna start working with my dad to earn some cash so I can get started on building the bottom end. What books are good to read, to learn how to assemble the bottom end and everything else? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikelly Posted December 9, 2004 Share Posted December 9, 2004 Anything by David VIzard is well worth reading...Go to borders books and start looking at the selection of books.. Grumpy and others can recommend books, as all mine have walked off with others who have borrowed them over the years... I just rely on "How Tos" on the web now... Mike Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest z31_drifter Posted December 13, 2004 Share Posted December 13, 2004 Ok, I am going with a ZZ4 shortblock, with pistons, rods, and crank allready in it. I am trying to choose a cylinder head now. Which cylinder heads are the best for what I want to do? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Magnum Rockwilder Posted December 13, 2004 Share Posted December 13, 2004 Dart Pro 1's are cheap and powerful. You can get them off Ebay for under a grand. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillZ260 Posted December 14, 2004 Share Posted December 14, 2004 Drifter, could you please post the cost of your build up and the hp you ended up with ect? I think it would be good to start doing write up's on our engine builds so other members would have a place to look up what they want and build it. I know there will still be questions, but I was thinking how awesome would it be if all the guys with SBC's has a standard form type write up on all the parts they used (maybe even part #'s) and what they ended up with RWHP wise. Just thinking. I am going to get moving on my engine once I get my dad's estate settled. VROOM! BTW I am using vortecs, I think that a bit of reworking of the ports by someone experienced can net you plenty of power with less cost if you can get a deal on them. Just my .02 if you you want Iron heads. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest z31_drifter Posted December 14, 2004 Share Posted December 14, 2004 Yeh sure, I can do that. Just remember. I won't get started on this project untill spring time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest z31_drifter Posted December 14, 2004 Share Posted December 14, 2004 Would I be better off getting a ZZ4 shortblock with pistons, rods, and crank allready in it or should I get a bare ZZ4 shortblock and put Scat 9000 crank, Eagle I beam rods, and wiseco or JE pistons in it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillZ260 Posted December 16, 2004 Share Posted December 16, 2004 zz4 short block is a regular 4 bolt block with chevy internals. If you want the scat and other internals, just get a 4 bolt rebuildable block and get machine work done on it or a new 4 bolt from GM. Then add your parts to make the shortblock you want. I don't think there is anything special about the BLOCK, with a ZZ4 engine. Right? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest z31_drifter Posted December 16, 2004 Share Posted December 16, 2004 Yea I was thinking about that. I will probably get a 4 bolt block and add my own pistons, rods, and crank to it. It save me some money too probably. Or Would an LT-1 be better then a SBC? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tim240z Posted December 16, 2004 Share Posted December 16, 2004 An LT1 is a SBC.... Crate engines will likely be your cheapest route, and you will get a warranty. Any used engine (LT1 in your example) may be a good way to go, but yoou won't likely know the history. My recommendation (FWIW): Get a running 350ci donor car for cheap....find something that has body damage etc. Swap into the Z and get everything working. Upgrade your suspension, brakes, chassis etc. After some time working out all the bugs etc, pull the motor and hop it up if you want more power. Tim Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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