Powder coating wheels

[CruxGNZ]

I'm looking at upgrading my wheels. I found some nice Centerlines that I like, but they are all shiny. Is it possible to powder coat just the five spokes on these wheels? Here's the wheel VENTURA

 

If it's possible, I'll see about getting it done locally, or get an Eastwood kit and an old oven and do it myself.

 

 

(I'm going to see if I can fit the 9.5" wide wheels in the back )

 

!M!

[Chewievette]

If I remember the process correctly... Its simply a matter of masking off the part you dont want coated. much like painting them.

[DaleMX]

Be carefull. If the wheels get too hot you will destroy the temper.

[CruxGNZ]

What temperature do you bake the powder coating at? I guess I'll have to bring this up to Centerline and ask them about doing this.

 

What would an alternative be to make the spokes a charcoal grey color? I don't want it flaking off in a year, so most rattle can paints won't cut it.

 

!M!

[Dead Roman]

What temperature do you bake the powder coating at? I guess I'll have to bring this up to Centerline and ask them about doing this.

 

What would an alternative be to make the spokes a charcoal grey color? I don't want it flaking off in a year' date=' so most rattle can paints won't cut it.

 

!M![/quote']

 

 

if you dont want it flaking off you are gonna have to sandblast it.

 

you will have to cook the wheels at 400 degrees for 15 minutes.

 

i know i beez a powdercoater.

[Guest JAMIE T]

Most factory wheels are powder coated. All remanufactured wheels are powdercoated. You won't harm them with the little time it takes to cure it.

 

Dead Roman, 15 minutes? Have you ever used a DataPAQ to check a wheel to see how long it's substrate is at the 392* or higher degree to fully cure? I have a DataPAQ that we use on our furniture, and we can't cure anything for less than 30 minutes. Granted our items are larger than a wheel, but It would be cool to know for sure, don't you think?

 

If you use Tiger, they will bring a there own DataPAQ to help you get a signiture on all the items you coat. We borrowed thiers for a couple of days last year but decided to buy our own. We got the one with 8 probes. I kidded my boss and told him I wouldn't cut the PO unless he'd let me use it to measure my turbo outlet temps, IC inlet temps, IC outlet temps, and intake temps while at the track. I can then load the info on my lappy and chart a graph. Do it under different boost pressures and see when my system becomes inefficient. LOL.

[DaleMX]

A low temp powder is used on aluminum wheels. It wouldn't hurt to ask Centerline.

 

A quote from this page http://my.execpc.com/~davewrit/Powder.html

 

Found your article most enlightening. A metallurgist friend told me a few years ago that things like aluminum wheel spindles should not be powder coated. He explained that aluminum billet material (6061-T6 ?) changed crystal structure at a critical temperature around 410 degrees F (as I recall). The thrust was that the heating step would adversely affect the strength of the material. Non-structural components would be OK, but not something that "holds the spokes on". The metallurgist is correct. Products like wheel billets, scuba tanks, etc. can be powder coated, but only with powders which cure below peak metal temperature of 300 degrees F. The magic temperature is about 275F. The crystalline realignment at 400 degrees F causes the previous ductile aluminum to become brittle. Imagine the catastrophe when an 80 cu. ft. scuba tank explodes under 3000 psi pressure after an unauthorized powder coat (this actually happened). To my knowledge, all Aluminum wheels and other strength-critical aluminum components are powder coated with these cooler curing powders.

 

Heating Al alloys above this temperature causes a granular rearrangement of the metallurgical structure resulting in a significant change of bulk properties. The tensile strength of the metal is dramatically lowered, much like a stress relief anneal on a steel piece would do. The resultant metal is not as strong, nor will pressure vessels made of such treated aluminum (e.g., scuba tanks) hold near the pressure that they were originally rated for. Since wheels are essentially load-bearing structures, they should never be heated like this unless the alloy is known to tolerate it well.

[Mikelly]

Exactly... Dale is 100% correct. Make sure you know what the material you are throwing into the oven can handle.

 

There was a thread on one of the sportbike websites where a guy had a failure of a wheel the day AFTER he picked it up from being powder coated. The wheel was not designed for the temperature that it was subjected to and the owner destroyed the bike in the resulting failure, and got himself a stint in the hospital for his troubles...

 

Powdercoating NON-load bearing items is one thing... But I'd be careful on wheels, hubs, and other items, especially those made of aluminum. Contact the manufacturer. To those of you who do powdercoat for a living or side work, I'd be real friggin' careful what you powdercoat. Good way to get a lawsuit from some whiner who will look to place blame elsewhere...

 

FWIW, I trust Jamie Taylor with ALL my powder coating info... He's been in this buisness for a long long time and his company does the largest volume of powder coating in this area to my knowledge. Their oven could hold two of Mike's Scions!

 

Mike

[Dead Roman]

Havent used a data pack yet. We tend to stick with industry standards for curing methods(all powders come with suggested curing times and temps). I cant say that i have ever had a failure, or any complaints sticking with this method and i have been doing this for a long time. No offense to you, or the company you work for, but i dont trust tiger drylac(bad experiences with thier powder). I try to stick with cardinal, dupont, and sherwin williams. The only other company i use extensively is prismacolor, and thats only for custom colors. We are fairly low tech, and we arent a big company,about 1.5 mill a year(this years is gonna be a record high). I try to stay away from motorcycle wheels unless they are spoked, i have heard similar horror stories and its just too muchg of a liability as far as im concerned. Cars on the other hand, i never turn anythign down, and ive never had any issues,

 

i didnt know you were a coater jamie.

 

 

forgot to say, we dont just shoot our wheels and such cold. they are cleaned and prepped, rolled in the oven to preaheat, and then i switch out my colors, by the time im ready to shoot the wheels(or whatever part) thay are already heated all the way through. This cuts our curing times down quite a bit.

[CruxGNZ]

Thanks Dale! I'm damn glad I threw this powder coating question up on the board.

 

!M!

[blueovalz]

The tech person I spoke with today at Billet Specialties said that even though they do not powder coat any of their wheels, they do not see any problems with this being done. I posed some of the above information to him and he maintained that this would not be a problem with their wheels. I then contacted my local powder coater, and he has, at specific customer requests, reduced the temp to about 370º for this reason and is aware of the above concerns. So, now I'm wondering if I should continue my quest to powder coat the center section of my wheels, or use a conversion coating and paint them myself? Being the center section is so deeply inset into the rim, I hardly see future chipping as an issue.

[Dead Roman]

The tech person I spoke with today at Billet Specialties said that even though they do not powder coat any of their wheels, they do not see any problems with this being done. I posed some of the above information to him and he maintained that this would not be a problem with their wheels. I then contacted my local powder coater, and he has, at specific customer requests, reduced the temp to about 370º for this reason and is aware of the above concerns. So, now I'm wondering if I should continue my quest to powder coat the center section of my wheels, or use a conversion coating and paint them myself? Being the center section is so deeply inset into the rim, I hardly see future chipping as an issue.

 

 

go with powdercoating bro, you wont be disappointed.

[dot]

if you dont want it flaking off you are gonna have to sandblast it.

 

you will have to cook the wheels at 400 degrees for 15 minutes.

 

i know i beez a powdercoater.

 

My oven is officially now off limits for powder coating, for relationship longevity reasons. IF I could keep the temp steady, would my old barbeque do the job for some small steel parts? Or would it make a mess?

[johnc]

Wrought aluminum allows (6061 is typical) are artificially aged/hardened via heat treatment. The initial heat treatment is at 1,000F for for 1/2 hour and then quenched in water. This gives a temper designation of T4 and gives 6061 significant strength over as wrought (T0). An additional heat treatment (generally referred to as "aging") of 400F for 2 hours brings additional strength and is designated as T6 temper.

 

Any additional heating of the material to 400F is considered an additional aging process. In the case of a T6 temper, an additional aging will reduce the tensile strength of the material and is considered "overaging." In the case of 6061 T6, the ASTM minimum specified strength is 40ksi. Any additional aging process will reduce the tensile strength some amount and the material can no longer be considered in T6 temper.

 

There are additional temper designations for aluminum beyond T6, but T7, T8, and T9 require cold working to increase strength. Using heat again (artificial aging) on T6 material reduces the temper to T4 (if you're lucky) and more frequently to T0.

 

When welding 6061 aluminum that has to meet specs its much better to weld 6061 T4 and then post weld age (PWA) it for one hour at 400F to get a T6 temper. If 6061 T6 is welded the material has to go back to square one and go through the 1,000F and 400F aging processes again to get back to a T6 temper.

 

EDIT: T7 temper is not reached via cold working. T7 temper is reached via precipitation which is heating the material to a bit under 200F and keeping it at the temperature for 24 to 48 hours.

[johnc]

The only power coating related failure I've seen had to do with some BBS 3 piece wheels on a Viper. The owner took them apart sent the centers out to be powder coated. The coater wasn't told or forgot to mask off the mating surfaces and bolt holes that held the 3 wheel pieces together.

 

The owner reassembled the wheels and drove them on the street for a few days. That weekend he went to a Viper Racing League event and in the second race the front wheels feel apart at 100+ mph and the Viper was totally destroyed. The owner luckily survived with just a few broken bones.

 

Seems that the powder coating under the bolt head and nuts softened under the brake heat and wheel loads causing the bolts to lose torque and the wheels to break apart. The lawsuits are still in court.

[CruxGNZ]

Thanks for the information John! I love reading that stuff.

 

!M!

[Dead Roman]

My oven is officially now off limits for powder coating, for relationship longevity reasons. IF I could keep the temp steady, would my old barbeque do the job for some small steel parts? Or would it make a mess?

 

 

never tried it, i guessif you could keep the smoke out and keep the temperature high and steady anough, and create some kinda oven type box i dont see why it couldnt. But why not just buy an ol piece of crap used oven and use that eh?

[chucky]

If your still looking for a powdercoater there is one in madison and I used one by port washington.

[Guest JAMIE T]

Yeah, I'm a coater. Though it's not all I do. We've used most brands of PC and have had the best customer service from Tiger. We also cout our product hot. Actually we go way further than just shooting powder.

 

Our process begins with a thorough cleaning via a Fremont Systems hot pressure washer with Bulk Kleen 749 cleaner, then it's followed by a thorough rinsing. After that, it gets rinsed again with DI water(city provided water has too many deposits in it). Then, it goes on to get a rinse of Bulk Chemicals E-CLPS 2100 pre-treatment specifically for aluminum. The part is then pre heated(dried and heated for the first coating). Afterwards it gets coated with Zinc-free primer. It's coated hot and gels out. Then it goes into the oven to be re-heated(but not to cure the primer), after is warm enough, it comes back out of the oven to get its final coat. Then, back into the oven for final curing. The gel'd primer literally bonds with the top coat. That, along with the E-CLPS pre-treatment makes for the most high performance finish available.

 

Stainless Steel booths anyone?

 

 

Outer doors leading to the air conditioned and humidity controlled room with the booths.

 

 

Huge oven.

 

[Guest JAMIE T]

I forgot to mention, our procedures produce a finish that scores 10's in a 3000hr salt spray testing.