Bartman Posted June 16, 2005 Share Posted June 16, 2005 I'm looking for nice 3 point retractable seat belts for my '73 240Z. I don't have a roll cage or roll bar, and I have replaced my stock seats with ones from a Miata. I don't like how the stock shoulder belt isn't retractable, and doesn't stay connected very well to the lap belt buckle. I know 260Z's and '75 280Z's have a retractable shoulder belt I could use, but I'm having a hard time finding one and it would still need to bolt on to the buckle of the lap belt. I'm thinking maybe a universal 3 point retractable belt might work. Anyone used one of these? Here's one I found on eBay. http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=7979715616&category=33725 Do you think these would work? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wheelman Posted June 16, 2005 Share Posted June 16, 2005 You know Bart, you and I are almost exactly paralleling each other in the things we're working on. I just discussed this very subject in another thread and Aux said he had one that he would try to find for me. I was under the impression that the 240s had retractable belts, is this not true on yours? The one concern I have about those in the auction is where to mount the upper bracket that the belt slides through (can't think of it's name), any ideas? I know the original mounts on the roof above the strut tower. Wheelman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pop N Wood Posted June 16, 2005 Share Posted June 16, 2005 240's had the solid, non retractable belts. I swapped in a retractable set up from a Mazda 808 (many moons ago). I mounted the retractor mechanism on the sholder belt mounting point above and behind the rear quarter window. The nice thing about the Mazda set up is it had semi solid extenders that held the latch mechanism above the side of the seats. Worked out perfectly since the stock buckle would always fall down between the seat and the tranmission tunnel My suggestion is to hit a junk yard and start looking around for something that will work. The Mazda unit actually mounted the retractor spool in a verticle position. To mount it horizontally I had to remove a gravity lock mechanism in the unit to allow the belts to spool. So if you can find one that already mounts the retractor spool horizontally you will be better off. I know some of the old Volvo station wagons mounted them this way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phantom Posted June 16, 2005 Share Posted June 16, 2005 77-78 280Z's have fully a retractable one-piece lap and shoulder belt. I believe the lap part mounts in the same place as the 240 and the shoulder belt mounts on top of the rear strut tower. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bartman Posted June 16, 2005 Author Share Posted June 16, 2005 My '73 has a retractable lap belt, but a fixed shoulder belt. Here's the source that I used for my seat belt information: http://www.automedic.org/smzcc/tech_tips.htm#seatbelts Phantom, This link doesn't mention taking a complete 77-78 280Z seat belt mechanism and swapping it in. Do you think there would be any issues mounting the shoulder belt to the strut tower (Does it need extra bracing)? If this would work, this may be the best solution. Wheelman, I've also noticed that we've been almost paralleling each other in our projects. Hopefully we will both be done fairly soon:shock:, and be happy with our toys. I've been very happy with my progress and the results so far. I assumed that I could mount the shoulder belt of the units on eBay to the same location that my current shoulder belt mounts. Pop N Wood, You may be right about searching the junk yards. I may have to try that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ezzzzzzz Posted June 16, 2005 Share Posted June 16, 2005 I have a 11/71 240Z with non-retracting belts. Later 240Z's had the small pockets pressed into the floorboard behind the seats to install a retractable unit. The retractable shoulder belt spool mounted to the top of the rear strut tower to my knowledge. I have a complete set from a 76(?) but I can't install it because there are no pockets in the floorboard of my Z AND the shoulder bracket is made for the FLAT topped strut tower while my Z has the triangulated tops...bummer. I'd like to have the retracting shoulder belt at least. I haven't given up entirely on the project as of yet. The Mazda system sounds okay except I question if the shoulder belt locks properly under emergency braking or impact with the modifications mentioned by Pop N Wood. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pop N Wood Posted June 17, 2005 Share Posted June 17, 2005 I was going to mention the no floor pocket issue of the early Z's. Retractables from later Z's really don't backfit into the early vehicles. I was also a little concerned about removing the tilt mechanism from my retractors. However they seem to have multiple mechanisms that make the retractor lock. If I tug on the belts too fast they will lock. Hopefully I wil never know if this is enough or not. But if you can find some in a JY that mount horizontally, then you should be good. Anything was better than the stock units with the lap belt constantly getting lost under the seat. BTW, I also have a Simpson harness that I used for autocross. I mounted the sholder part to the strut tower bolt, as did most the people I knew at the autocross. This is not a popular mounting point on this site. Most people seem to think mounting to the strut tower is unsafe. Can't argue that mounting it to a roll cage is the preferred solution, but absent a cage the strut tower seems to be the best option. I didn't really install the harness for safety so much as something to keep me in the seat during hard cornering. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zgeezer Posted June 17, 2005 Share Posted June 17, 2005 I've put the complete 280z retractable seat belts into an early 240z. First, you cut out pockets from the 280 and weld them into the 240. The outside seatbelt attachment bolt locations are the same. Cut out the appropriate pockets in the 240's pan, bolt up the seatbelt retractors for mockup and then weld in the pockets cut out of the 280. Then mount the shoulder belt retractor on the rear shock towers. This will require mocking up and welding a steel plate on each tower to hold the 280 shoulder retractor and plastic cover/guide. I took my scissors, straight edge, razor, and flat poster board into my jy and made templates of the 280 mounting plate. Easy to do, hard to describe. Just look at a 280 and duplicate that plate and side supports onto poster board. You'll end up with one top plate and two slightly different side pieces. The plastic retractor cover on the 280 clips onto another metal mount: take this mount and transcribe each of the three bolt holes onto the plate, drill the plate, weld a nut on the underside of the plate and then weld the plate and the support pieces to the shock tower. Bolt the retractor onto the plate and you are almost home. The final step is to secure the inside belt/shoulder buckle. In early 240Zs the inside mount is a reinforced nut on the side of the pan "shelf" directly behind and to the side of each seat. As the 240 inside belt was, in fact, a belt, this location makes sense. However, the 280 inside buckle is attached to a stiff cable that, in a 280, is attached to the side of the transmission tunnel. The simple mount would be to locate the cable attachment on the side of the 240 transmission tunnel and weld in, on the inside of the tunnel, a plate with captive (welded) nut. Later 240's might have the inside belt attachment relocated from the back shelf to the transmission tunnel. My z was in a rotissiere at the time. Cost: $55.00 for the 280 belts and all. $60.00 for the beer and marianated flank steak, and 2 hours of cutting, welding, bench racing and other forms of liarcraft. There are some caviauts: 1. If shopping JY don't buy any belts that might have be "streatched", 2. Make sure that the retractors work b/4 you pay money. If I ever figured out how to post pictures, I'd do it here. g Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zgeezer Posted June 17, 2005 Share Posted June 17, 2005 You locate the flat plate referred to above, by the plastic cover. One end of that cover clips directly over the three bolts holding the shock strut, the other clips onto the mounting bracket that you will ultimately bolt to the plate. Clip the mount to the cover and the cover to the strut. At that point you can precisely locate the plate. It helps to have the plate drilled so that you can bolt the plate to the mount. g Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bartman Posted July 14, 2005 Author Share Posted July 14, 2005 I purchased a set of complete seat belts from a 260Z. The shoulder retractors work great and they should bolt up to the same location as my non-retractable shoulder belts. I just need to remove the rivet holding the 260Z shoulder belt to the lap belt, and bolt the 260Z shoulder belt to my existing 240Z lap belt. I'll let you know how it works. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
auxilary Posted July 14, 2005 Share Posted July 14, 2005 double check the lower retractor, make sure it's the same length and bolt holes line up I had a set of 280z retractable belts like that that looked like they'd fit, but didn't. I don't know about 260Zs, good luck Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bartman Posted July 15, 2005 Author Share Posted July 15, 2005 double check the lower retractor' date=' make sure it's the same length and bolt holes line up I had a set of 280z retractable belts like that that looked like they'd fit, but didn't. I don't know about 260Zs, good luck[/quote']The lower retractor will not fit in the 240Z...that's why I'm using just the shoulder belts from the 260Z system and connecting them to my 240Z lap belts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
auxilary Posted July 15, 2005 Share Posted July 15, 2005 Right, that's what I meant. I think I told wheelman the same thing when he was going to get the whole assembly from a junkyard Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wheelman Posted July 15, 2005 Share Posted July 15, 2005 Right, that's what I meant. I think I told wheelman the same thing when he was going to get the whole assembly from a junkyard Yup, thats what Ya told me so I decided to skip the whole thing for now. I've driven the Z around a little and not been hassled so maybe they won't pull me over just because they don't see a shoulder belt. Good luck with you're plan Bart, I don't know that I would trust myself to rebuild a set of belts like you are, I'd be worried the shoulder strap would separate from the main buckle. Wheelman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnc Posted July 15, 2005 Share Posted July 15, 2005 Some people call me chicken little... http://www.circletrack.com/techarticles/76778/ http://www.schroth.com/installation-instructions/en/index.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bartman Posted July 15, 2005 Author Share Posted July 15, 2005 I'm not changing the geometry of my existing seat belt system, and it will be safer than what I have now. The stock shoulder belts in my 73 240Z do not retract and don't mount permanently to the lap belt. I tried wearing it at first, but it's very uncomfortable and it doesn't even stay together! The stock 260Z seat belt shoulder belts are mounted with a rivet to the lap belt, so the only change is that it will be mounted with a nut and bolt rather than a rivet. I think that with the proper bolt and nut (which will be out of view in the loop of the seat belt webbing) will not compromise the strength of the system. If I ever decide to make my car more into a race car than a street car I can upgrade the seats and belts to support a 4-point system. I think for my application this system will be a nice improvement that will allow me to be more secure by being able to use the shoulder belts in addition to just the lap belts I am wearing now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bartman Posted July 16, 2005 Author Share Posted July 16, 2005 I installed the 260Z shoulder belts this morning and they work great! Here's a couple of pic's: It bolted right up to the same location as my old non-retractable belts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
240Z2NV Posted August 17, 2005 Share Posted August 17, 2005 I found this thread by accident; but, I had planned on mounting my 280Z retractor set on my '73. Very interesting. I am clear on the detailed description, thank you "ZGeezer", until I get to the 'plate' that will need to be welded to the top of my tower. The towers on 280Zs are totally flat, which makes for a perfect surface to mount the plastic cover. My tower is not flat (240Z) and has the angled 'face' for the strut nut & spring 'hat'. How would any of you recommend that I fab the top piece to properly accomodate the plastic retractor cover? I already have the flat piece to weld in for the actual mechanism; but, got 'hung up' on the angled surface of my tower and what to do to overcome that 'issue'. I hope that you can understand my predicament based upon my description.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zgeezer Posted August 20, 2005 Share Posted August 20, 2005 Yes, you're right: the 280Z rear shock mounts are flat. It is this surface you are replicating in the early 240Z. The plate I cut out is the same shape as the 280Z's mounting surface. The two small triangles are the sides that locate the plate on the early 240Z's. I'll try again this weekend to post photos to this site's photo album. g Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
240Z2NV Posted August 20, 2005 Share Posted August 20, 2005 Or, you could just email me the pics directly as it seems that I am the only person doing this right now. Either way, thank you! handymanstan@comcast.net Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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