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Z32 300ZX SR20DET Engine Mount question

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Guest ivanqz
Here is a link to pics of my car.

I have been building it for over a year now.

I travel for a living so i only have about 3-4 days a month to work on her.

I am doing a complete overhaul to the body and and building the Car for Drag. NHRA Sport RWD. I expect over 800HP and should see low 9's with the Z32 5speed.

Swap is already done, just waiting on body work to be completed.

 

http://www.drag240sx.com/plug-e-gallery-f-55.html

 

If you all are wondering why I went the SR route i will be more than happy to explain. But with me racing only 1 specific class, we have to stick to same manufacturer. So with all my other Nissan options I would be happy to say why i went the SR route...

 

Good luck to anyone else trying the swap..

It was very easy for me and i would recommend it to anyone else.

 

Danny

 

 

That is impresive, It reminds me of an article on a magazine 5 or 7 years ago of a Japanese drag Z32 with an SR20. I think the numbers were 600 HP and maybe 8 sec 1/4 mile. Don't quote me on this I'ts been a long time. And that is how long I've been thinking about this. At the time the price of a NA Z32 was still too much. I recently found a hard top for 3k but it had some front damage so I had to pass.

 

I got my brother on board with this project. So now we sre looking at 2 cars. One for road race which we will do first and a street car for me. This is going to be a 2 or 3 year process, no biggie.

 

Danny, have you looked into a SR20VE head? Basically Vtec for nissans. That is what I got. PM me for more info.

 

And yes please tell us all reasons you went this route. I'll pm you with my email.

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First off, I have been building Z32's for over 6 years now. So i have some experience with them ;). I have done simple stuff from Stock motor rebuilds to Full Builds/ Internals GT2530's to make a 500+whp Z. But never anything more extreame than that...

I did design a Single turbo Kit for the VG30DETT but never emplimented it. in the middle of building it on the Car i made the decision to change the motor.. So i have no proof that it would have worked perfect. but i did like the idea's i had.

 

But on my resume I have assist building a 1300+ supra and 3 800+ Honda's. If you follow any racing at all you have seen or heard of our Utah Cars Tearing it up at IDRC, NHRA, NOPI on the West Coast..

Our Fastest Honda Just wend 9.50@156 last weekend at Nopi. and the Supra Has gone 8.8@167.. These are full interior cars might i add, not gutted.. Just simple saftey features that are required and they are also manual Tranny's...

We have a Race at Palmdale this weekend. IDRC...

 

Now on to my Ride..

First off, remember i said that i am building this car for Mostly Drag only.. it will see a highway every now and then.. but at the same time in my class i have to have License plates and be registered. I have to have full interior and all the required stuff on the Car that would have to Pass Saftey in any state.

Now in NHRA to race in Sport RWD you have to stick with same motor manufacturer as chassis. So that left me with Nissan. NO problems there we have plenty of amazing motors availible.

Now with that being said for amazing power i could have went with the RB or even the VG. But with a 6 cylinder you have to have minumum weight of 3600lbs with 1 power adder and 3700lbs with two power adders.

a 4 cylinder has to weigh 2900lbs with 1, and 3000lbs with 2.

1 power adder being a turbo, and 2 being turbo/Nitrous.

Second was the fact that the RB can make crazy power in the 1000+ range but parts are not as easy to come by if i start breaking stuff often at that power. along with the price of everything and 6 of everything to buy.

Now on to the VG. WE all love the motor. it is the heart of the Z. I know it inside and out so i am comfident in all my knowledge and theory's and thinkings of the motor. Also i have talked with Teams like Escort Z who build the 1200+_ 7.1@192+ drag Z with the VG...

It can make crazy power But again you have to buy 6 of everything and Escort told me on there car that once they started breaking 900+ hp they were going through main bearing like butter. at 1200+hp they had to change them every race.. That's 7 passes on a motor.

So with that being said if i could get 1100 out of the VG i would have 1100+3600lbs=fast

Now on to the SR.

They are Everywhere, They are cheap, Parts are cheap, Parts are readily availible for it. I only have to buy 4 of everything.

I did the weight comparison and the SR is 250lbs lighter then the VG. now that is fully loaded. Turbo's and all on both motors.

So with drag racing 250lbs off the front of the car equals a lot better weight transfer.

With my experience from our honda's i don't see why i can't get 800+ on the SR with boost alone and maybe a little more with spray. I know a SR head does not compair to the Honda head, but just trust me on this one.

so 800+2900lbs=faster.

 

Now onto my setup. Like i said the car is not put together right now due to a complete overhaul on the body.

But i have

 

GT4294R

AEM

1600CC injectors

12x24x4.5 IC/Vband ends

4" DP

Tial 44mm WG

Tial 50mm BOV

Weldon FP/FPR

Tilton Twin plate

Richmond 4.10 Gears/Rear

Custom Intake Mani.

Z32 5speed Tranny

 

Im sure there's more but that the basics.

 

As for the Questions.. I have heard of the VE head, but as far as i know its for the FWD motors only.. If there is a secret to addapt it to the RWD block i would love to know it.. But with that being said I am running the Tomei 280 cams and i have never heard of a company making huge cams for the VE head?

 

Thanks for the compliments and I hope to learn a lot more from the people on here. I am always willing to listen and learn to what others have to say.

 

Danny

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funny you should say that, read my sig closer. :-D

 

and check out these threads

VVL to DE port comparison

 

the VVL head flows better than the standard DE or DET

 

http://www.sr20forum.com/showthread.php?t=162336 same mod would be performed for a rwd VE

 

you need a custom intake manifold [i cut the plenum off mine, and am making my own. cant weld it yet because i need a 50amp circuit, but that'll change soon.]

 

I you want the engine close to the firewall you either need to notch the firewall for the vvl solenoids and dizzy, or run a standalone that doesn't need the dizzy,[ ie megasquirt n EDIS... or what have you...] and get some plates machined to relocate the solenoids [this is what i'm doing, long process...lazy machinist

 

and for cams.. theres 2 companies that make them, but people have been too cheap to buy them/ and they're not satisfied with the testing that went into making them. most people run sr16ve or sr16ve N1 cams, but thats for NA. People who boost VVL's usually use sr20ve cams

 

VVVdig around here and do a search for kelford cams and franklin camsVVV

 

http://www.sr20forum.com/forumdisplay.php?f=41

 

search around and check out the stickies, lots of good info.

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First off, I have been building Z32's for over 6 years now. So i have some experience with them ;). I have done simple stuff from Stock motor rebuilds to Full Builds/ Internals GT2530's to make a 500+whp Z. But never anything more extreame than that...

I did design a Single turbo Kit for the VG30DETT but never emplimented it. in the middle of building it on the Car i made the decision to change the motor.. So i have no proof that it would have worked perfect. but i did like the idea's i had.

 

But on my resume I have assist building a 1300+ supra and 3 800+ Honda's. If you follow any racing at all you have seen or heard of our Utah Cars Tearing it up at IDRC, NHRA, NOPI on the West Coast..

Our Fastest Honda Just wend 9.50@156 last weekend at Nopi. and the Supra Has gone 8.8@167.. These are full interior cars might i add, not gutted.. Just simple saftey features that are required and they are also manual Tranny's...

We have a Race at Palmdale this weekend. IDRC...

 

Now on to my Ride..

First off, remember i said that i am building this car for Mostly Drag only.. it will see a highway every now and then.. but at the same time in my class i have to have License plates and be registered. I have to have full interior and all the required stuff on the Car that would have to Pass Saftey in any state.

Now in NHRA to race in Sport RWD you have to stick with same motor manufacturer as chassis. So that left me with Nissan. NO problems there we have plenty of amazing motors availible.

Now with that being said for amazing power i could have went with the RB or even the VG. But with a 6 cylinder you have to have minumum weight of 3600lbs with 1 power adder and 3700lbs with two power adders.

a 4 cylinder has to weigh 2900lbs with 1, and 3000lbs with 2.

1 power adder being a turbo, and 2 being turbo/Nitrous.

Second was the fact that the RB can make crazy power in the 1000+ range but parts are not as easy to come by if i start breaking stuff often at that power. along with the price of everything and 6 of everything to buy.

Now on to the VG. WE all love the motor. it is the heart of the Z. I know it inside and out so i am comfident in all my knowledge and theory's and thinkings of the motor. Also i have talked with Teams like Escort Z who build the 1200+_ 7.1@192+ drag Z with the VG...

It can make crazy power But again you have to buy 6 of everything and Escort told me on there car that once they started breaking 900+ hp they were going through main bearing like butter. at 1200+hp they had to change them every race.. That's 7 passes on a motor.

So with that being said if i could get 1100 out of the VG i would have 1100+3600lbs=fast

Now on to the SR.

They are Everywhere, They are cheap, Parts are cheap, Parts are readily availible for it. I only have to buy 4 of everything.

I did the weight comparison and the SR is 250lbs lighter then the VG. now that is fully loaded. Turbo's and all on both motors.

So with drag racing 250lbs off the front of the car equals a lot better weight transfer.

With my experience from our honda's i don't see why i can't get 800+ on the SR with boost alone and maybe a little more with spray. I know a SR head does not compair to the Honda head, but just trust me on this one.

so 800+2900lbs=faster.

 

Now onto my setup. Like i said the car is not put together right now due to a complete overhaul on the body.

But i have

 

GT4294R

AEM

1600CC injectors

12x24x4.5 IC/Vband ends

4" DP

Tial 44mm WG

Tial 50mm BOV

Weldon FP/FPR

Tilton Twin plate

Richmond 4.10 Gears/Rear

Custom Intake Mani.

Z32 5speed Tranny

 

Im sure there's more but that the basics.

 

As for the Questions.. I have heard of the VE head, but as far as i know its for the FWD motors only.. If there is a secret to addapt it to the RWD block i would love to know it.. But with that being said I am running the Tomei 280 cams and i have never heard of a company making huge cams for the VE head?

 

Thanks for the compliments and I hope to learn a lot more from the people on here. I am always willing to listen and learn to what others have to say.

 

Danny

 

Nice job! Could not have said it better myself! I've been talking about doing this swap since 1998 when I torched my first engine. I completed the swap about a year and a half ago and was very pleased. It made good power for stock form and was a pleasure to drive. I am kinda a big V8 buff and now working on putting a v8 back in (no class restrictions here). I've decided to go with an LS1/T56 combo with a single turbo setup. I have been working on nissan's for about 9 years now and I love the vg but like you said I'd rather buy 4 than 6.. I new that vg engine was heavy. I will get some exact numbers soon. I am replacing some turbos on a TT and I will put it on the scales for comparison. Good luck with the car! BTW heard of Stage6Motorsports in Jacksonville Florida. Great guys and that is whom I do side work from time to time when they get TT's in there. They also have a few cars they ran but have been too busy the last year or so!

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so its Sr20Det with VE head or Sr20Ve with a turbo?

 

 

In your opinion Lunor240z, how will this option benifit you? What are some upgrades seen with adding the "vtec" haha to the sr?

 

 

faster turbo spool, better torque curve, more expensive, more hp/torque in general compared to an identical but non VVL sr20, more time to fabricate everything needed, better mpg, more headaches, and more jdm-ness?

 

sr20det block, sr16ve head, w/turbo.

 

 

woohoo 510 posts!

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faster turbo spool, better torque curve, more expensive, more hp/torque in general compared to an identical but non VVL sr20, more time to fabricate everything needed, better mpg, more headaches, and more jdm-ness?

 

sr20det block, sr16ve head, w/turbo.

 

 

woohoo 510 posts!

 

 

So here is all my questions about the SR16VE head?

Are you saying it bolts right up to the SR20DET-RWD Block? or the SR20DET-FWD Block? Cause they are different?

 

Also, how do you pick up Crank Angle or Cam Angle then? Cause the SR20DET-RWD head has a Cam Angle Pick up that works with the ignitor chip and ECU to control Spark and Fuel.

I know on the SR20DET-FWD it uses a Distributer.

So how do i Go from my SR20DET-RWD to the SR16VE-FWD head and get my Pick ups to work? If you saying go to a distributer, then how does it fit between the motor and the engine bay in a RWD application.

If your saying change it to a Cam Pick up, the SR16VE head does not have the appropriate holes for that.

 

Please explain the swap a little bit better?

I already have a SR20DET-RWD in my car and the Bolt pattern for my Adaptor plate is different then if i had to throw a SR20DET-FWD Block in my car.

 

and last,

How and where could i get a SR16VE head if you can answer all my questions above.

 

Thanks,

 

Danny

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i've thought of two diy options for a cam sensor. one involves drilling a hole in the front of the head and running a hall effect sensor in there , and a magnet on the cam gear...but thats unlikely, because i have to idea where would put the sensor.... what ill probably end up doing is using a distributor i modiefied. they have an optical trigger wheel inside them, pics are in here in someones rwd ve thread i basically took all the crap out...left the optical sensor, and i'll have the shaft machined so that it's shorter. idk if i'll go through with this or not. it depends on how much the machining would cost.

 

http://www.sr20forum.com/showthread.php?t=189071&page=3

 

 

or you could order a sr20ve 20V CAS which is a direct bolt on

 

http://www.sr20forum.com/showthread.php?t=189976

 

inquire in the VE forum for getting a VE head. if you get just a sr16ve head it'll be like 1000, you pretty much wont be able to find a complete sr16ve. your best bet is to find a complete sr20ve and take the head off, through "andreas miko" on the forum to get engines

 

the price of a sr20ve "$1600 is a rip. $1300 on average, $1200-1250 if he cannot prove low miles and great condition. $1400-1450 if the motor is really low miles and clean as hell."

 

fwd head bolts up to a rwd block. and run the external vvl oil feed line as explained in the earlier link.

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Guest nos1ser
i've thought of two diy options for a cam sensor. one involves drilling a hole in the front of the head and running a hall effect sensor in there , and a magnet on the cam gear...but thats unlikely, because i have to idea where would put the sensor.... what ill probably end up doing is using a distributor i modiefied. they have an optical trigger wheel inside them, pics are in here in someones rwd ve thread i basically took all the crap out...left the optical sensor, and i'll have the shaft machined so that it's shorter. idk if i'll go through with this or not. it depends on how much the machining would cost.

 

http://www.sr20forum.com/showthread.php?t=189071&page=3

 

 

or you could order a sr20ve 20V CAS which is a direct bolt on

 

http://www.sr20forum.com/showthread.php?t=189976

 

inquire in the VE forum for getting a VE head. if you get just a sr16ve head it'll be like 1000, you pretty much wont be able to find a complete sr16ve. your best bet is to find a complete sr20ve and take the head off, through "andreas miko" on the forum to get engines

 

the price of a sr20ve "$1600 is a rip. $1300 on average, $1200-1250 if he cannot prove low miles and great condition. $1400-1450 if the motor is really low miles and clean as hell."

 

fwd head bolts up to a rwd block. and run the external vvl oil feed line as explained in the earlier link.

Ok im new here but I have an sr20 fwd fully bult motor in my sentra. I want to go rwd. I have a 90 300zx. What I want to know if the bolt patern for the tranny is the same for the fwd and the rwd? Also I know I have to make an intake manifold to make this work but how much diffrent is the fwd motor compaird to rwd motor when it comes to motor mounts?

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Trust me, you would love every aspect of putting a fully built SR20 into a RWD/300zx.

As for the differences in the two blocks i honestly don't know. I do know the bolt pattern is different from the RWD's. But things like the motor Mounts, water lines, ect. i don't.

But also to let you know, your gonna wanna use a SR20DET/RWD head. your FWD head has the distributor coming off to the Driver side and if you turn your motor 90Degrees, you would have to cut your firewall to make it work.. not worth it to me. But since your bottom end is built. just find a RWD head.

But if you get a RWD head, then you have to deal with the Coil on Plugs and no longer have the Cap/Rotor set up. Which also means you would need a RWD wiring harness and ECU for a RWD, and ignitor chip ect..

Sounds like a lot of work...

Honestly i would just try to Sell your Built FWD set up and buy a RWD(Motor/Harness/ECU/Ect.) Cause there is already parts made for almost everything to do that swap the easy way.

 

So you will need custom Motor mounts/ modify CrossMember, and a Custom adaptor plate for the tranny.. and you wanna use the Z32 tranny, it will hold more than tripple the power than the SR20DET tranny.

 

Now back to Lunar240,

I have looked some more into the VE head...

I still see they are a pain to get ahold of. and also im not about to cut my firewall, so do you know where to get the 2001/SR20VE CAS?

 

Thanks

 

Danny

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the rwd and fwd are sooo different. its not worth it to try to use them when the correct ones are readily available. unless its a VE head IMO. the fwd block WILL NOT bolt to the rwd tranny, the basic block casting is very different. the motor mounts are different, the way the ancillaries mount the water lines are different... etc etc etc...

 

the guy in the VE forum, GregV should be able to get one for you.

 

im going to modify my dizzy into a CAS.

 

you can always check ebay for a sr20 VVL

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Um.... S13's weight 2700 lpbs Z32 weigh ma good bit more.

 

 

250WHP and 260 WTQ is about what a stock VG30DE-TT throws down with a K&N filter in the stock air box.

 

I can understand the extra room you'll get and if the SR20 Bolts up toy your FS5R30A trans I would just bolt the motor to the trans and supportthe motor with a T-bar ans start making motor mounts.

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Actually the hatch back that 80% of drifters prefer for the S13 is closer to 2800, and those are smaller, and have a slick top with no t-top options. I would still love to find out what a bone stock slick top NA Z32 weighs in at, since slick top weights were never publicly available from nissan.

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Goes to show you how much that VG weighs! Considering mine weighed in at 2750 lbs with an SR. Thats a 450 lb difference. WOW!! I must have a freak Z. I wonder if he was in the car? HMMM He looked like a pretty big boy.. I have taken out alot in my car but not all the paneling in the interior. He did get it down to 3140lbs. eh I guess the engine tranny combo could be 390 lbs less than the VG!

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Guest ivanqz
Goes to show you how much that VG weighs! Considering mine weighed in at 2750 lbs with an SR. Thats a 450 lb difference. WOW!! I must have a freak Z. I wonder if he was in the car? HMMM He looked like a pretty big boy.. I have taken out alot in my car but not all the paneling in the interior. He did get it down to 3140lbs. eh I guess the engine tranny combo could be 390 lbs less than the VG!

 

 

That is what I am trying to figure out. The information is a little contradicting. Which tranny did you use to get 2750 lb the SR or the VG? I am still go with this project but it is going to take me a lot longer than I thought. Even "Bigplansnocar" weight was still at 2900 lb. And that is on a drag car. Hopefully "lexshimmy" will his car runing soon so we can get some recent weight scale numbers.

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That is what I am trying to figure out. The information is a little contradicting. Which tranny did you use to get 2750 lb the SR or the VG? I am still go with this project but it is going to take me a lot longer than I thought. Even "Bigplansnocar" weight was still at 2900 lb. And that is on a drag car. Hopefully "lexshimmy" will his car runing soon so we can get some recent weight scale numbers.

 

Sorry it took me a while to get back! I was having fun on a cruise!! I used the sr tranny. Also I believe Bigplansnocar has a t-top car. I am sure of the weight we weighed the car when I had an LT1 in the car at a different shop and set of scales and like I said it weighed 2850 lbs. I am in the progress of putting the LT1 back in so as soon as I do so I will have pictures of the whole build including the pictures of the coner scales when I weigh it again. It should be a little lighter this time considering I will not have all the A/C compressor, heater core, evap, blower motor, condensor and etc... I will be putting a cage in it so that will probably make up for some weight that I'm taking out. We'll see!

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