bjhines Posted October 3, 2006 Share Posted October 3, 2006 I have been wondering what these weld nuts in the sides of the car near the back edge of the door jamb are for... I originally thought they were from some sort of fixture used to assemble the unibody at the factory... but LOOK WHAT I FOUND!!!!! The Works' cage uses these as side supports... very interesting... although I have pushed and pulled on this area and found it to be very weak... the metal is too thin to provide any real support... it looks like they were using these to jam the hoop against the wheel well... similar to the design used by the AutoPower cages that mount on the wheel wells... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
veritech-z Posted October 3, 2006 Share Posted October 3, 2006 That's a really cool picture, where did you ever come across something like that? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HS30-H Posted October 3, 2006 Share Posted October 3, 2006 Welcome to 1969........... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bjhines Posted October 3, 2006 Author Share Posted October 3, 2006 HS30-H.... You have been a good source for these WORKS team photos... There are several things I would like to see on those cars... It is very hard to find pictures of the cars' internals... Considering Nissan went to the trouble to include quite a few factory design changes to accomodate homologation rules... It might be nice to make use of those points with current designs... obviously Nissan made the car.. they knew best how to reinforce it... I would love to see how they tied the front rocker tips to upper supports... supposedly there was a diagonal in there somewhere... or was that a private team that did that...??? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HS30-H Posted October 3, 2006 Share Posted October 3, 2006 Some references: Works cage in a circuit race car: Works cage in a rally car: Detail of original Works side bracing brackets: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HS30-H Posted October 3, 2006 Share Posted October 3, 2006 I would love to see how they tied the front rocker tips to upper supports... supposedly there was a diagonal in there somewhere... or was that a private team that did that...??? That was never done on a Nissan works-built S30-series Z to my knowledge. JAF and FIA Groups 1, 2, 3, 4 or 5 rules would not have allowed it at the time. These works 'cages' were simply roll-over protection ( in Japan they called them 'Safety Bars' ) and were not actually intended to strengthen the 'shell in any major way - although they did brace the 'hips' of the car quite well. Are you perhaps thinking of the BRE cars? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HS30-H Posted October 3, 2006 Share Posted October 3, 2006 That's a really cool picture, where did you ever come across something like that? The original artwork ( penned by Takeshi Hosokawa ) was printed as a fold-out in a 1971 issue of 'Autosport' magazine of Japan. The other side of the fold-out is arguably nicer..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JMortensen Posted October 3, 2006 Share Posted October 3, 2006 I would love to see how they tied the front rocker tips to upper supports... supposedly there was a diagonal in there somewhere... or was that a private team that did that...??? BSR did that on their CP cars. IIRC there is a picture in How to Hotrod your Datsun. It's not very hard to do. Just run a diagonal from the top of the rocker tip to the upper frame rail as far forward as you can without causing interference issues with the front tire. I don't recall if the BRE team did that too, but I'm 99% sure it was the BSR car in the book. I remember that the BSR car had a HUGE brace, it looked like the same size bar as the roll cage. I think the rules at the time said that all the bars in the cage had to be the same size though, and I don't think that the brace needs to be that size to get the job done. I think of it like a strut tower bar on a different plane. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mom'sZ Posted October 3, 2006 Share Posted October 3, 2006 HS30-H... very cool pictures, I've always felt the wheel houses were a pretty good mounting area for the main hoop, all things considered (available space, structurally ect)for a Zcar. People laugh about the (aforementioned) autopower cage bolting to the wheel houses, but as a former unibody repair tech I knew it was one of the strongest parts of the structure. (so long as rust hasn't compromised them) These pictures gave me some new ideas for the mount plates. I like how they run up the inner quarters. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bjhines Posted October 3, 2006 Author Share Posted October 3, 2006 Can anyone post a pic of what they did with the rocker braces...??? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony D Posted October 12, 2006 Share Posted October 12, 2006 Oh, wow... Now the thing up in my rafters is identified. Alan, where in the world did you get those braces? I had put the bar up against the weldnuts in my "Mystery Car" back in Japan, and figured something was missing---those brace plates are it! The side brackets seemed to fit fine, but the gap to the wheel well just didn't make much sense. I see they are sitting on some prints...any chance of getting those prints so I can properly fab up this part? One step closer to fabricating my 71 into something that looks like a Rally Car..... HORROR STORY: Because I was remiss in securing my "Factory Wroks Bar" a gent came along and used one mf my rear uprights (that go to the rear floor area) as an "adjustable brace" in his project---drilled many holes through-and-through so he could slide another tube inside it and brace it with bolts. I still have the tubing....with all his added "Lightening Holes", I guess one day I will have to match that tubing for an installation.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HS30-H Posted October 13, 2006 Share Posted October 13, 2006 Alan, where in the world did you get those braces? Hi Tony, They are from a genuine ex-works rally car that is being restored here in the UK. You can read about it in an upcoming issue of Nostalgic Hero magazine. The Editor in Chief and a staff photographer were over here a few weeks ago, and we covered two ex-works Zs and an ex-works 240RS ( chassis no.1 no less ). I think it will be published in November. I see they are sitting on some prints...any chance of getting those prints so I can properly fab up this part? Sure. They are more complicated that they might look in the photos though ( quite complicated pressings in very thick material ). Contact me offline about that. Cheers, Alan T. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HS30-H Posted October 13, 2006 Share Posted October 13, 2006 HS30-H... very cool pictures, I've always felt the wheel houses were a pretty good mounting area for the main hoop, all things considered (available space, structurally ect)for a Zcar. People laugh about the (aforementioned) autopower cage bolting to the wheel houses, but as a former unibody repair tech I knew it was one of the strongest parts of the structure. (so long as rust hasn't compromised them) These pictures gave me some new ideas for the mount plates. I like how they run up the inner quarters. You are very welcome. I am glad that they were of interest. I'm also pleased to read your comments about the strength and location, as quite a few people with personal experience of these works and Sport Option roll-over bars say the same thing. Once the whole thing is bolted down in position it really is very strong. Still pretty frightening to think that this was just about the only crash protection that the works rally crews were given....... ( ! ). Different times indeed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1 tuff z Posted October 14, 2006 Share Posted October 14, 2006 every time i log on i learn something new about our beloved z cars. alan, thanks for providing the archival info & photo's. keep it coming! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bluto Posted October 14, 2006 Share Posted October 14, 2006 Alan, If you were to make a coffee table style book with all of your pics and info I would pay whatever you would want to charge for it. I dont think I would be alone in that. Sam Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
proxlamus© Posted October 15, 2006 Share Posted October 15, 2006 lol.. id love a coffee table book from Alan T .. =) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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