Oil choice for break in?

[HICKL]

I have heard and read too many different ideas then I can even remember. Hot Rod had a big recent article on the high potential for damaging a solid lifter cam with "today's oils" on break in. I had a guy tell me to use non detergent 30 weight to seat the rings quicker, then drain it out. What is the best method in you guys' opinion to get good ring seating and not fry a solid lift cam? My last motor seemed to take forever to fully seat the rings if it ever did.

 

Thanks

Jeff

[Alf]

I recomend using Shell Rotela diesel truck oil. The truck oils still retain wear additives that passenger car oils do not because trucks are not as strickly regulated by emissions.

 

What kind of rings does your engine have? What about your old engine?

[jnjdragracing]

I use the car quest brand 30w in the race engine and a good top of the line wix filter, Prime and fire up the engine, check all vitals, adjust carbs, let it warm up to operating temp. Re-adjust the valves and then go to the track make some passes, then go home, drain it and install royal purple racing 21 oil and again anothe top of line wix racing filter.

 

John

[HICKL]

I recomend using Shell Rotela diesel truck oil. The truck oils still retain wear additives that passenger car oils do not because trucks are not as strickly regulated by emissions.

 

What kind of rings does your engine have? What about your old engine?

 

 

I have already forgotten the ring manufacturer, but looking back at the Jeg's site it calls them "plasma moly cast rings" I have heard of the diesel oil as well, after break in I could go back to something normal right?

[grumpyvette]

if you add the moly assembly lube and the E.O.S. the mineral base oil used becomes less critical, but Id sellect the VALVOLINE RACING OIL as its high in zinc..you might find the chart on this site useful

 

http://www.micapeak.com/info/oiled.html

[HICKL]

if you add the moly assembly lube and the E.O.S. the mineral base oil used becomes less critical, but Id sellect the VALVOLINE RACING OIL as its high in zinc..you might find the chart on this site useful

 

http://www.micapeak.com/info/oiled.html

 

I wish I was knowledgeable enough about all that to make a decision based on what I jsut read!

 

Is your recomendation for break in only or for the life of the motor? Would you go with 30 weight?

[Nismo280zEd]

I recomend using Shell Rotela diesel truck oil. The truck oils still retain wear additives that passenger car oils do not because trucks are not as strickly regulated by emissions.

 

What kind of rings does your engine have? What about your old engine?

 

I've heard of this before as well.

[grumpyvette]

Id use the mineral base oil for breaking in the cam, theres no real down side to continued use of the oil if filter and oil changes are fairly frequent , provided the engine oil temps are kept below 250F and yeah ID use the 10w30 or strait 30w with no real prefferance durring the cam break in. the advantage synthetic oil has is both a longer use life and higher temp tollerance, mineral base oils tend to start breaking down after about 250F, most synthetics are vfine to at least 300F, you really should change mineral base oils before 5000 miles, synthetics can easily go 3000-4000, swap the filter and go an additional 3000-4000 before changing out BOTH the filter and oil

one mistake guys make is running oil too cool, it needs to reach 215F to burn off moisture.

 

 

its a flat out proven FACT that oil temps in an engine that fail to at least slightly EXCEED 215 F durring engine operation for several minutes tend to hold moisture and create ACIDS from the combustion bye-products trapped in the oil mixed with that moisture, those acids can and do cause problems if the engine sits without running for awhile.

then theres the fact that widely varing engine temps. tend to make tunning more difficult also., if your engines temp swings from 160F-235F theres no way the engines going to run as smooth and efficiently as one that tends to stay in a far more limited range of lets assume 190F-210F on the coolant like MY corvettes been designed to do .the fans come on at 210F and I run a 195F t-stat

short answer, Id sellect the 180F or 190F or even a 195F as a far more reasonable choice than the 160F T-stat and Id sure pay more attention to keeping the average OIL temp in the 215F-245F range than the COOLANT TEMP! under 180F

 

this might answer a few questions

 

http://www.micapeak.com/info/oiled.html

 

http://www.nordicgroup.us/oil.htm

 

http://minimopar.knizefamily.net/oilfilterstudy.html

 

http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/

 

http://data.melling.com/TECH.php

[HICKL]

So basically, you are saying basically any non synthetic 30 wt for break in...right?

[grumpyvette]

any quality HI ZINC CONTENT 10w30 or 30w

zinc is the main hi pressure lubricant in the oil that MATTERS to you durring the break in that VARIES to a large extent between brands

again look thru the chart

 

http://www.micapeak.com/info/oiled.html

 

and adding MOLY assembly lube and G.M. EOS (ENGINE OIL SUPLIMENT) is a very good idea

[jt1]

For break in of a new flat tappet cam, I would only use the Joe Gibbs breakin oil, Valvoline VR1, or diesel oil with GM EOS added to it. You must have a high level of ZDDP for a flat tappet cam to break in properly. None of the modern auto oils have the ZDDP.

 

John

[grumpyvette]

zDDP= Zinc dialkyl dithio phosphate = ZINC .....FOR SHORT in oil

 

 

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zinc_dialkyl_dithio_phosphate

 

http://www.maintenanceresources.com/ReferenceLibrary/OilAnalysis/oa-m.htm

[HICKL]

any quality HI ZINC CONTENT 10w30 or 30w

zinc is the main hi pressure lubricant in the oil that MATTERS to you durring the break in that VARIES to a large extent between brands

again look thru the chart

 

http://www.micapeak.com/info/oiled.html

 

and adding MOLY assembly lube and G.M. EOS (ENGINE OIL SUPLIMENT) is a very good idea

 

 

That chart does not list any straight 30 et, and in the 10w30's the only one that really stands out on zinc content is the Valvoline race. Are the ones in the .12 range adequate or is that too low in your opinion.

[grumpyvette]

the .12 are ok....but why not use a .15-.20, they are common and you may as well take full advantage

KENDALL AND VALVOLINE ARE BOTH EASY TO LOCATE AT MOST MAJOR AUTO STORES

[Pop N Wood]

I copied this off of an LS1TECH post. It is SDPC reccomendation for their crate motors

 

Information and Break-In Recommendations for

Your SDPC Engine or Short Block

 

Thank you for choosing Scoggin-Dickey as your engine supplier! Scoggin-Dickey Parts Center opened its doors in 1929 and since that time we have been one of the leading suppliers of complete engines, short blocks, and engine components. It is our goal to provide you with the latest in engine technology and the highest standard of performance. Whether you have purchased a new OEM factory built crate engine or a custom built SDPC engine or short block, it is imperative that you take the time to read the following instructions in regards to engine oil, PCV systems, fuel systems, and engine break-in.

 

Today’s Oil and What You Need to Know

Motor oil has had several significant changes in the last ten years and more importantly in 2004 a decision was made to reduce the sulfur and the zinc-phosphorus compounds (ZDDP). The ZDDP is used as the primary anti-wear agent for internal engine components. Beginning with the 2004 model of new vehicles, the Federal Government has asked auto manufacturers to warranty catalytic converters for 120,000-miles.

Most catalytic convertors eventually fail from harmful gases emitted thru the exhaust, and two of these are the phosphorous and sulfur which were a prevalent make-up of our older motor oils. All engines will consume some oil thru the exhaust! While in most cases this is only a very small amount, the automakers decided it was time to change the chemistry of motor oil rather than adding to the cost of catalytic converters.

This change in engine oil has had a significant impact on the performance engine world, specifically engines with forged pistons and/or flat tappet camshafts. The lack of the zinc-phosphorus compounds has been a primary cause of premature failure in flat tappet camshafts and lifters. Current oils for gasoline engines have the ZDDP compounds reduced by 20% or more. We have seen an overwhelming increase in piston scuff and premature ring wear. We have torn down performance engines with less than 1500-miles and seen piston scuff and ring wear that looked as if the engine had 100,000-miles! All caused from super low viscosity oils with poor anti-wear characteristics and a lack of following proper break-in procedures.

If you have purchased a custom built short block with forged pistons and a performance ring package, then we have taken every precaution to coat the cylinder walls, pistons, and rings with an anti-wear agent. However, it is imperative that you choose engine oil with a significant amount of ZDDP and we require the addition of GM Engine Oil Supplement (EOS) for a minimum of the first 90-minutes. For forged pistons with moly rings or HD steel rings and engines with flat tappet camshafts we suggest an engine oil with a minimum ZDDP content of the following;

Approximate Percentage by Weight

Zinc – 0.120

Phosphorus – 0.115

 

 

 

Suggested Oils;

Shell Rotella-T 15W40 API Specification CI-4 Plus

Valvoline NSL Racing Oil 10W30 (Conventional Motor Oil, excellent for break-in!)

Pennzoil 25W50 Racing Motor Oil

 

PCV Systems

The LS-Series engines are prone to excessive crank case pressure build-up resulting in oil blow-by, oil consumption, and oil wetting of the intake manifold. One of the first changes from GM to help resolve this issue was the bay-to-bay “windows†placed in the main webs of the blocks. Any increase in cubic inches places more demand on the PCV system, regardless of the engine type. GM has made several changes to the PCV systems over the years and many consumers have a mismatch of parts and components. It is imperative that you inspect your PCV system and make certain that it functions properly. If you are using a factory PCV system it is required that you use a new “fixed orifice†PCV valve for routing your pressure relief hose from the valve cover. This valve is included with all custom SDPC LS-Series short blocks and engines. The GM part number for this item is #12572717.

 

Fuel System and Tuning

It is imperative that you make every effort to have your fuel system in proper working order prior to engine start-up. Inspection of the supply lines, return lines, filters, regulators, and proper fuel pressure are the responsibility of the car owner and/or installer. It is extremely critical that you have a PCM calibrated for the correct pressure and injectors before starting the vehicle. Any over rich condition existing for an extended period of time during the initial start-up will cause piston scuffing, ring wear, and severely hinder the ability for the rings to seat properly and may ruin the complete engine! It is the responsibility of the owner and/or installer to calibrate the PCM or the carburetor to prevent internal engine damage.

 

Engine Break-In

Use the correct engine oil with the addition of GM Engine Oil Supplement (EOS)!! We recommend two 45-minute break-in periods allowing ample time between each for a complete cool down of the engine. Each period should consist of varied RPM and load with a limit on the RPM of 4500. Avoid extended duration of constant RPM! After the 90-minute period you should drain the oil and inspect the filter. Replace with a new filter and use one of the recommended oils from the list above or one that you have verified that has the proper amount of ZDDP. If you have purchased an engine with forged pistons it is imperative that you always use oil with sufficient ZDDP for the entire life of the engine! We do not recommend a change to Synthetic oil until a minimum of 5000-miles to insure proper ring seating.

SDPC does not warranty any application with the use of power adders i.e. – turbochargers, superchargers, nitrous. If it is determined that premature ring wear, ring sealing, or piston scuffing, and/or engine failure is the result of improper tuning, incorrect oil, improper installation, and/or the use of power adders, then all repairs, parts, materials, shipping expenses, and labor will be the sole responsibility of the purchaser.

[lbhsbZ]

I've heard never to break in motors on Synthetic...."The rings won't seat" they say. Then I remembered the oil caps on Corvettes and vipers. "Mobile 1 factory fill" If big bad expensive Corvettes and Vipers are broken in at the factory using Mobil One, then its good enough for me.

[QWKDTSN]

Grumpy, I have been running 10w-30 synthetic blend in my engine. For a while my idle was set a little high at 1000 rpm and I always showed a little over 25psi hot oil pressure at idle. I tweaked my rpm back to 800rpm where it should be and I'm now showing about 15psi hot oil pressure at idle. I am using an Autometer gauge so I have no idea how accurate those numbers are but that worries me because I have heard in plenty of places that less than 20psi is damaging and you have personally recommended no less than 25psi at idle to me in the past. Thoughts? Should I go to a more viscous oil?

[HICKL]

the .12 are ok....but why not use a .15-.20, they are common and you may as well take full advantage

KENDALL AND VALVOLINE ARE BOTH EASY TO LOCATE AT MOST MAJOR AUTO STORES

 

I thought the valvoline race was synthetic, that's why I was looking at the others.

[grumpyvette]

ideally you want about 25 psi at idle but Ive seen no damage as long as the idle psi stays at 15 psi or higher, now PRESSURE is a MEASURE of RESISTANCE to flow so if you want to increase that resistance in a larger clearance application , swapping to a thicker/higher viscosity will boost the pressure reading....but it may not be a good idea as the oil flow reaching the parts may be delayed. now the other approach is to install a high volume oil pump, since it pumps abouy 10%-25% more oil (depends on part# used) that will accomplish exactly the same result,(higher readings on the gauge) and faster oil flow, but generally you want to run a deep or wide baffled high capacity oil pan and a windage scrteen when a high volume pump is used.

face facts, larger clearances require more oil volume/flow

[jt1]

The Valvoline race is a synthetic. I like the diesel oil + EOS combo. Easily available, fairly cheap, and is proven to work well.

 

jt