auxilary Posted November 13, 2007 Share Posted November 13, 2007 cliff notes version: april 2007: datsun shop owner does some work on my car. i specify exhaust to be built out of stainless to handle rotary heat. provide with SS bends, clamps, mufflers. Also bad dog rails to be installed. I get the car back. My floorpans have holes melted in them. Wire speed and temp were so high I had 2-3" long stems shooting out of the floors.Exhaust is made out of mild steel. Owner says he is puzzled and wondered why I would ask him to make it out of mild when it's a rotary. I point out that I gave him SS bits, and specifically said stainless. Owner promises to fix issues, and we agree for him to redo just the downpipe in stainless. He works on the car end of august 2007, I get the car back sept 7th. I examine it, it looks ok, pipe is out of stainless, holes in floors [poorly] welded in. I am in process of moving and other things, don't get to start working on the car until recently. We drop the exhaust, and one of hte vband flanges isn't even welded. it's just tacked on; he never really finished it. I examine the downpipe, and it has rust around welds. 304 SS doesn't really rust. I stick a magnet to it, and magnet sticks to welds, but not the piping. He used steel wire instead of stainless. I examine some other things, and the turbo header welding he did (on stainless) is also done with regular steel wire - not stainless (this was mig welded with gas) I went to another shop where the owner was more than understanding, with the pieces in hand to get a second opinion. Exact words were "Wow, we'd never do something like that". The downpipe will basically fall apart after a few heat cycles. Do I: a. take small claims court? b. attempt to get money back from credit card, which will be long drawn out process c. attempt to talk to him and get money back? d. attempt to talk to him and have him fix his mistakes (3rd time, and I'm sure he hates me, despite the fact that I've never raised my voice and at every opportunity attempted to resolve things peacefully, in the upmost professional manner). The other shop owner quoted me about $500-600 for the downpipe work (it has to ALL be redone) including cost of materials. My turbo header most likely will need to be replaced. I need to get new vband rings for the tial wastegate, since they're custom produced, not readily available from any vendor. My stress levels are through the roof, I'm grinding my teeth, and any sort of further action will definitely not improve my wellbeing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tombarace14 Posted November 13, 2007 Share Posted November 13, 2007 Id say go to the owner for the third time and request the work be redone correctly or you recomped your money. If he dosent want to, have a lawyer write a certified letter first and if no further action is taken then go to small claims court. I delt with somthing similar to this with my garage. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Datsun350Z Posted November 13, 2007 Share Posted November 13, 2007 Talk to him one more time on the phone. Record it, and if things don't work out report him to your local better business bureau. Then proceed as above with official documentation from a lawyer, and small claims. Good luck. Maybe he will make good on it, it's quite possible that someone who didn't know the details was assigned the project, and it passed by the owner without being checked. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
auxilary Posted November 13, 2007 Author Share Posted November 13, 2007 Keep in mind I'm only concerned with getting my money back. I obviously don't trust him to try and fix it for the 3rd time Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pop N Wood Posted November 13, 2007 Share Posted November 13, 2007 I don't think ( is an option. Credit card companies only get involved if there is a flat out fraudulant claim. It has been my experience they won't get in the middle of disputes about quality of service. And I am pretty sure you need to do C before you can do A. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SuperKid Posted November 13, 2007 Share Posted November 13, 2007 I say be like the guy in your avatar and fill the guy with lead. Seriously though, talk to the guy and see if you can't get your money back (or atleast most of it). One thing you should definitely not do, is talk bad about the shop to other shops. If another shops asks you about the previous shop, simply say you were not happy with the work and change the subject. I've found that often times other shops will not want to deal with you if you're the type that badmouths others because they'll be afraid they won't be able to please you and you'll badmouth them as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
auxilary Posted November 14, 2007 Author Share Posted November 14, 2007 Hm, talking to the guy isn't a good idea... I don't see him as what you'd consider...stable. More on that later Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rustrocket Posted November 14, 2007 Share Posted November 14, 2007 I'd try going the credit card route. I paid for something on my Chase Visa card, and it never arrived. I provided receipts, explained the situation, and got a refund to my account about 6 or 7 weeks later. It was only for $300 or so, but it was relatively painless. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
capt_furious Posted November 14, 2007 Share Posted November 14, 2007 Holy crap. Dude, you wanna borrow a tommy? Tell me. I can get Guido and Johnny to roll up on him in the '36 and '37 Buicks, too. This is ridiculous. I'd say make him fix it, but from the sound of it, he's on crack and he'll probably dick it up again. At least get some money back and get someone that'll do the job justice. 'Fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice, shame on me...' There is no rule for thrice, at that point, get away from the fool. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
auxilary Posted November 14, 2007 Author Share Posted November 14, 2007 oh, those parties that know which shop and owner that I'm talking about, please don't mention the name and keep it to yourselves thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony D Posted November 14, 2007 Share Posted November 14, 2007 D with threat of A You will need other independent shops to make sworn statements condemning another local shop for small claims... Who doesn't weld Stainless with Stainless wire. Stainless to Mild I can see a neophyte screwing up on and not using like 309...but stainless to stainless. Man! Sad thing is you may have to run the exhaust to a failure point to have some real 'damages' or proof positive that it's defective if the other shop owners won't sign on the dotted line fer ya! Then again, if it's under $1K, do you really want the added stress of getting the satisfaction of a court saying 'your're right'? You STILL have to collect from him, and that will be all on you as well. You can ask him for whatever you can get back on it, and walk away never to deal or think of him again. I have bosses like that. There is a point where beating the dead horse simply isn't fun no matter how much gore splashes onto you, and you simply want to just walk away, have a beer and go to sleep. So to speak... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrFancypants Posted November 14, 2007 Share Posted November 14, 2007 The sad part is, I know first hand that even if you win in small claims court theres a good chance youll never see your money. By then you'll be out a bunch of filing fees and a whole bunch of time and stress. I'd try calling the owner and settle for no less than a refund. If he refuses then dispute with the CC. Go through small claims as a last resort. - Greg - Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
auxilary Posted November 15, 2007 Author Share Posted November 15, 2007 Here's the problem: I spent about $170-200 in stainless parts that are not exactly reusable (tial flanges, vband flanges), and the cost for exhaust work was $750. I have receipts and original agreement I had him sign that he would redo the downpipe in stainless with me providing the materials at no charge. He also welded up an OBX turbo header with same wire, so that's $200 or so it had custom reinforcements tig-welded in as well... i mean, reusable, but modifications will have to be made to reattach the waste gate Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JSM Posted November 15, 2007 Share Posted November 15, 2007 I'd ask for a full refund. If you don't get it, tell him you will picket. Have parts in hand to show customers. There should'nt be any law against picketing his location. I think you could do more damage to him via this route then court. Just my thoughts.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
auxilary Posted November 15, 2007 Author Share Posted November 15, 2007 That's kind of oldschool. Pictures and story + internet is far more devastating. I don't care about picketing and reputation, I just want my money back or have it done right. Having tried it twice, he failed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Datsun350Z Posted November 15, 2007 Share Posted November 15, 2007 Everything isn't necessarily ruined, is it? What about sending it out to get jet-hot coated? I know it's some extra money, but at least you won't be throwing parts away. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
auxilary Posted November 15, 2007 Author Share Posted November 15, 2007 bandaid to a problem. it'll still experience premature failure Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
auxilary Posted November 16, 2007 Author Share Posted November 16, 2007 UPDATE: talked to shop owner just now. he won't give a refund, says I'm unreasonable. Promised that if something on the exhaust fails, he will repair/rebuild it at no charge whenever that failure may occur. I asked him if he's willing to put that in writing and his reply was "no, I won't. I am a handshake kind of a guy, and if I give you my word, I will honor it. I was very irritated signing the initial contract that you had me sign, but I still took care of you." So, he won't refund me partially for materials (that I supplied), he won't rebuild it until it fails, and he gave me his word. I told him that courts do not honor verbal agreements. On the initial contract I had him sign after his first screw up, I wrote in "_______ will reconstruct the downpipe on __________ '240z 13b-turbo rotary conversion, using stainless steel piping and materials" That's about the gist of it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DavyZ Posted November 16, 2007 Share Posted November 16, 2007 Small claims court is going to cost you a whopping $75. True, you may never collect, but you don't know that either. If you have to hire some guys to collect, they can do it and keep a portion for themselves once they make him pay. Eh, who knows, it's not worth your health. I empathize with you. The guy is a real schmuck. Davy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jbk240z Posted November 16, 2007 Share Posted November 16, 2007 Gasoline + matches + his shop..............LOL just kidding! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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