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G.I.jonas

Cosworth engines.

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Just wondering if anyone has put a cosworth motor in their z?

 

I have not heard of one and i cant understand why.Arguably the best name in engines and they can be had for what some people spend on other swaps.

 

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=180213929223&ih=008&category=21654&ssPageName=WDVW&rd=1

 

 

And then theres always this...for the deep pockets.

 

Cosworth_engine.jpg

 

Deeper pockets!

 

CosworthV10.jpg

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A friend of mine has a 450HP Escort Cosworth (which is an Escort-lookalike with a longitudinal engine, permament 4 wheel drive and a shortened Sierra floorpan), and this thing is a ROCKET. The engine was VERY difficult to tune though, and only true Ford specialists know how to do it right. It is not uncommon to see over 600HP made from the good old Cossie turbo engine, so they must be stout. The only problem is that you have to make a full rebuild during every oil change, but who cares about that? :lol:

 

Here's a sample of what a Cossie can do with the right amount of money and careful tuning:

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HmDmnqvZMW0

 

Keep in mind that this car used to be a World Rally Championship works Escort, so it's not just your average Escort tuned to the limit... The WRC cars even had differently cast engine blocks, and everything that is FIA-labeled costs a few times more than it would've without the FIA homologation.

 

By the way: for us LHD S30 owners, the YBx swap is theoretically a great option. In older Sierra Cossie versions, it came with the good ole' Borg Warner T5 transmission, which IIRC is a deriative of the Mustang World Class T5 tranny. And it has the exhaust on the right, which means there's plenty of room for the turbo and no tricks needed to fit the downpipe with the steering column in the way...

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Given the impetus of the Cosworth engines was the WRC [so I believe], I REALLY wish that sport has/had caught on more on this side of the pound. What a great source of turbocharged, AWD vehicles, and the chasis that go along with them provide quality vehicle platforms for more economical, but fun vehicles.

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I drove a Cosworth powered Sierra a few months ago, man was that thing ever fast. It was from the shop my brother used to work at (northamericancosworthspecialists.com), the shop was actually thinking of putting a Cosworth in his 510 but unfortunately things didn't work out.

 

260Zbrakes018.jpg

260Zbrakes021.jpg

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You guys have Cosworths in Canada? Imported or sold there??

 

My brother's ex-shop imports them and sells them as well, they also do tunning, cosworth body kits etc.

 

The Escort RS4 (I believe) is the one I really wanted to drive, but they wouldn't let me touch it.

 

image08.jpg

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I'm a Ford mechanic, and I have friends and family who drives Cossies.

So i get to work on them quite a bit.

And the big thing about the cossie engine is the avalibility of parts and knowledge gained from all its racing history in Europe (and Australia). It isn't nesseceraly the best engine in the world (not saying it isnt good though).

Actually the old redtops from 2WD cossies, the 205 block is more or less, crap. Its an old block from a Pinto motor, like a Sierra 2.0l OHC.

All Cosworth did was x-ray the blocks and pick the best off the production line.

The later 200 block is much better. But still, there is no magic here either.

 

My point being that, if I lived i the states I would never consider a cossie engine over, lets say a 4G63 or a SR20, I'd have no reason to.

Being in europe, people put cossie engines in everything. And I could see the point, but personally I would never put a small Ford engine in a classic Datsun :)

(A Cosworth V8 turbo on the other hand... :D )

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As far as I know, he also drove the car in sprint races and hill climbs... Gatebil in Norway is only one of the few events he attended to with the Escort.

 

Hafsengen's WRC cossie was a totally sick car, it was even street legal(sort of). And he did enter it i one hill climb and won. But it was built for track days and for fun. Then he sold the chassis, kept the engine end drivetrain for his current project.

The WRC chassis is now silver and has a 900hp ex rallycross engine/drivetrain. 2.2l or whatever, and a Trust T88 turbo. A sad victim of turbo lag.

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Thanks for the info Ole, I'm sure everyone interested appreciates it! :) It's a shame that Hafsengen sold the chassis, do you know what he's planning? I was wondering, does the 205 block have the same mounting points as the 200 block? It's not like I'm planning anything... :)

 

As far as engine swaps are concerned, I bet you're right on with the opinion that the other 2 liter turbo fours could do just as well - or even better. But this is HybridZ you see, and everyone wants to be different... I'll stay with my favourite BMW engines though. ;)

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All Cosworth did was x-ray the blocks and pick the best off the production line.

The later 200 block is much better. But still, there is no magic here either.

 

Many companies use old block designs for decades and update the head only, afterall the power is made in the head. The only Pinto block on a Cosworth is no different. Mazda used the same B6 block from about 1981 to 1994ish...and rallyed it extensively in the 323GTX. Toyota the same with the 4AG..etc etc.let's not even talk how long the Small Block Chevy has been used by GM...LOL

 

Yasin

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Many companies use old block designs for decades and update the head only, afterall the power is made in the head. The only Pinto block on a Cosworth is no different. Mazda used the same B6 block from about 1981 to 1994ish...and rallyed it extensively in the 323GTX. Toyota the same with the 4AG..etc etc.let's not even talk how long the Small Block Chevy has been used by GM...LOL

 

Yasin

 

and the RB, showing up first in holdens and R31's.

 

now everyone wants one . LOL

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Thanks for the info Ole, I'm sure everyone interested appreciates it! :) It's a shame that Hafsengen sold the chassis, do you know what he's planning? I was wondering, does the 205 block have the same mounting points as the 200 block? It's not like I'm planning anything... :)

No problem at all :)

About Hafsengen's new build, I know only what I am told. I think it's more or less a secret :P But I'f you have seen those new Ford Fiesta's used in Rallycross division.1, I think that is pretty close.

 

About 205 vs 200 block. They do have the same mounting points. The mounts themselves are different on the 4x4 vs 2wd but mounting points are the same.

 

Many companies use old block designs for decades and update the head only, afterall the power is made in the head. The only Pinto block on a Cosworth is no different. Mazda used the same B6 block from about 1981 to 1994ish...and rallyed it extensively in the 323GTX. Toyota the same with the 4AG..etc etc.let's not even talk how long the Small Block Chevy has been used by GM...LOL

 

Yasin

Yes. I am very aware of that fact. The block being old dosen't really matter. My point was just that sadly they based it on a weak engine block.

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What about using a cosworth head on a USDM block?

 

I saw TWO mazda miatas complete at the junkyard just a few days ago. Seems like it'd be pretty idea to just swap one of those in there, then down the road overhaul the whole thing with a cosworth head/turbo/efi etc.

 

Or do the mazda/ford 4 cylinders here in the USA use different bolt patterns, spacing, or other parts?

 

I know that NEW cosworth engines are expensive, just seems like going this route and then getting some used cosworth parts from overseas might be a viable option instead.

 

EDIT: Oh yea, if you can put over 500hp to the wheels on the miata head then what could a cosworth head do?

 

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I think that the Ford/Mazda 4 cylinder is a completely different engine than the Pinto that we were reffering to earlier. The Pinto block was used in cars like the turbo Mustangs and Thunderbids - that's the well known 2,3 turbo motor. I'm not sure if the head would fit, but if it did, then it would make one hell of a head swap... Anyway, even a used Cossie engine wouldn't be cheap to buy, and the aftermarket for these engines in the US simply does not exist. The SR20 is still growing in popularity, so why bother? Even the US-legal Mitsu 4G63 can be mounted longitudinally with some block and gearbox combinations, so I just don't see the point... Other than the "cool factor" of course.

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I was just stating it as an option if it were possible. Those ford/mazda motors are becoming easy to come by. I agree the SR makes more sense, but IF cosworth used parts were easy enough to come by then it would make sense, but apparently not.

 

I just found out that cosworth sells ported heads for the VQ35DE

 

http://www.cosworth.com/shop_item.php?productid=476

 

Check out the flow graph, insane. So for a ton of money you can have a "cosworth" V6 motor. :D

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"Description

Cosworth VQ35 CNC ported cylinder heads feature dyno tested and flow bench proven ports, engineered for maximum real world power. Each new cylinder head is ported on a 5 axis machine to ensure consistency and perfect port shape every time. Additionally, larger intake (+1mm) and exhaust valves (+1mm) are utilized to help increase flow. Cosworth CNC ported Big Valve cylinder heads come complete with a performance valve job, hi rev (max 10,500rpm) valve springs with titanium retainers and are ready to install. Perfect for big turbo applications or strong normally aspirated engines. Nissan VQ35 heads are priced for the pair. A flow chart for the head is available by downloading the technical document on the left."

 

10,500RPM rev limit!!

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The pinto block and Mazda blocks are very different. So the cossie head wont fit. And I dont think it would make much sense anyway.

A friend compered the cossie head vs a stock Mazda BP head(1.8 16valve) . Flow tested them both, and the stock Mazda head flowed better then the cossie head(with turbocharging in mind).

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I've got a '89 Merkur XR4Ti with the Ford 2.3 Turbo. Take a look around http://www.turboford.net to read about the Volvo head conversion about 3 guys I'm aware of have done successfully. The Volvo 740 head (I think that's right) is the head they use and do some oil galley mods to create the DOHC 2.3L turbo-4 that turbo actually had ready to go for the following year's XR4Ti's and, I think, a continuance of the Mustang SVO. For some sad and funny reasons, Ford scrapped the SVO and the DOHC with it.

 

Of course, a number of guys are making plenty of power with the SOHC so the others don't see it to be worth it other than bling factor... and it is.

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That's surprising considering that the turbo mazda motors out there put out crap for power. They get excited about anything over 250 on a stock motor and I rarely see the same 500+ cases you see with the other turbo 4 motors.

 

I guess most turboed Miata's are just stock motors with a turbokit. And the internals arent made to handle much more. But 250hp is 100+ over stock, and a stock cossie motor wont handle much more then 100-150 over stock either(the redtop cossies wont anyway). And neither will a 4G63 or a SR20.

And dont forget the Miata is a small and very light car. A 300bhp Miata will put up a good fight against alot more powerfull cars, you can take my word for it :)

There are 5-600bhp Miatas out there but they are rare. But that has little to do with the engine i think. Getting traction is a bigger problem then making power :D You dont see that much power in the Protege/323 GTX and GT-R(like my own) either, but thats becouse with that kind of power you would go trough a transmission every wheek (insted of 1 every year like me :D ).

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