Legal matter regarding my Z

[Jesse OBrien]

DISCLAIMER

Forgive me if this comes off as a whining session, but I really need some honest advice. I'm going to keep this as unbiased as I possibly can, please bear with me and try not to post any comments that are one-sided toward me just because I'm a member here and the other parties (most likely) are not. I'm sorry it turned out so long, but if you intend to reply, please take the time to read the whole post and be as impartial as possible.

 

Tuesday

I parked my car on the street on Tuesday, June 2rd, in a legal parking space, with a legal registration and insurance in Vallejo. I went to bed because I had to work in the morning.

 

Wednesday

I woke up to go to work, got ready to leave, and turned the key to start it up to drive to get some coffee, go to the bus stop, and take that to work, and the car did not start. Logically, I wanted to check electrical components first, so I jacked up the passenger's side of the car to drop the starter, removed the alternator, and removed the battery, with the intention of charging the battery and testing the individual components directly after work. I had taken the hood off the day before, as I had just found out that having your hood off while driving is legal, and my hood needed some touch-ups, so I had removed it and it was still removed. I then went to work, and had an average day there, despite the fact that my car was having troubles.

 

When I came home (6:00pm +/- 15 minutes), one of my friends stopped by and asked me where my car was, since he had stopped by around noon to see if I had stayed home for the day (since my car was parked outside when I should have been at work). Now I was home, and my car wasn't. I thought he was joking at first, then went out to see, and found that it was missing. I was floored, and after I put my head on straight, I called the Police Department to report it as stolen. The registration was in the glovebox, but I had the license plate number written down and gave them that. The pleasant lady at the PD said that it had been towed, but could not give a reason why or where it was towed to (the PD had been the ones who called in the tow, she explained). I asked when to call back, and they said I should receive a letter with the details. I reluctantly said that's fine, and hung up.

 

Saturday

Today, I received two letters in the mail:

1. A lien sale warning, stating that my car is going to be sold by a local towing company (I'm not mentioning any names here just yet) unless it was picked up, and that I owed them $35/day for the past 3 days in addition to a $70 lookup/processing fee, and $120 for a tow to their lot.
   
2. A police report(?) that stated that it was towed for being a non-op vehicle.

My first course of action was to call the tow company, who did not pick up their phone. It just continued to ring. After it rang for a bit, I counted another 20 rings just to be sure, and hung up. No answer. I called back a half hour later and got a pleasant lady on the other end! Yay! Unfortunately, she couldn't help with anything, and put me on hold while she called the driver (wtf?). When she came back, she told me he would be calling within the next 15 minutes. So I put off everything else I was planning for the day (no seriously, I had a busy day of errands and bill-paying and an appointment set up) and waited a half hour with no call back.

 

All right, I said. I'll call the tow company again. I got the same pleasant lady on the other end, and she said that something more important had come up for the driver and he would call back later in the day. Umm... what? I explained that that was unreasonable, and that I had other things to do, and not to bother because I will come into the office on Monday.

 

I then walked down to the Police Department (it's not far from here, and I don't mind walking). Apparently the Vallejo PD lobby is closed on the weekends, and they keep a small gray box with a phone in it to talk to the Dispatcher. I picked up the gritty, dirty phone, and talked to the nice dispatcher (she really was quite pleasant). She proved herself to be utterly unhelpful, however, stating that I'd have to come back on Monday to fill out a Vehicle Release form (or something to that effect). Before I left, I asked if there were somewhere I could attain the Vallejo Towing Policy in print, and she said she had never heard of such a thing.

 

Later tonight, I did a bit of googling, and a bit of emailing around, and found the Solano County Towing policy, which apparantly covers Vallejo. It states that (among other things):

The Vallejo Police Department has established a written policy for towing and storage of motor vehicles that also includes motor-driven cycles, motorized bicycles and mopeds. Key provisions state that a reasonable effort will be made to locate a vehicle’s owner to eliminate unnecessary tows, allows an owner to give preference for a specific towing company and for the department to pay for any vehicles erroneously towed or stored. The towing contract with individual companies spells out contract rates, licensing and insurance requirements, forbids “collusion†between owners and mandates professional standards for tow truck drivers.

 

I am now a little curious as to what "a reasonable effort" is. A phone call could have eliminated all this trouble. I have also searched for any publication that explains that a vehicle without a battery (or any non-operable, registered vehicle) should be towed immediately and without notification. My search has thus far been unsuccessful.

 

So, my questions are:

1. Was the officer justified in having my car towed, given the circumstances? I was unaware that my vehicle was illegal to park on the street, and could easily have been relocated to my driveway if I had been notified.
   
2. Should some sort of warning be issued before my car was towed (I know most California towns use bright orange stickers that are stuck to the windshield 12-48 hours before a vehicle is towed)?
   
3. Is the tow company legally allowed to charge me for storage fees on days that I could not pick the car up (through no fault of my own) or days that I was not informed that they had my vehicle?
   
4. Am I overreacting, and should this be considered standard policy? It's entirely possible that I'm completely off my rocker and shouldn't feel violated because my car was towed. The fact remains that I didn't know I was doing anything wrong and feel that I should have been informed (or at least been given a reasonable opportunity to inform myself by having procedures posted publically, say... on the Vallejo website?) before such drastic action was taken.

Again, please don't take my side just because I wrote this up. I feel completely taken advantage of, but that doesn't necessarily mean I'm a victim here. I'm mostly upset that I wasn't contacted before the car was towed (ideally by a warning, or even a ticket) or directly afterward (when the car was towed, leave a note/citation on my door?), and am currently being charged for storage on days when I am not given the ability to get the car out of storage.

[AK-Z]

Idk about your area, but up in alaska it is mandatory that the owner be notified 24 hours before towing, whether that be a sign at parking or a written ticket on the windshield. The APD don't really do anything until someone complains about a car and after the complaint, they sit on it for like 2 or 3 days before doing anything.

 

Was it in a public lot? If its a private lot, then I would talk to the owner, they are usually the ones that responsible to have a car towed off their lot. I've read a article of a guy that had his car towed (not repo'd) on a private lot without the lot owners permission and went to court and won agaist the local PD. The lot owner is the one that has to file the suit though.

 

Might want to look into the policy in your area.

[kiwi303]

I'd say the top three. lodge a dispute with the PD and the towies pronto and get your lawyer onboard to give advice.

 

 

Here (well in Hamilton anyway, don't know about nelson, but similiar probably) the council does the work, not the cops, unless the car is a hazard to other road users. in which case it's towed promptly by whoever is next on the cops list of towies-to-use, if it's not a hazard the council rings, if they can make no contact within 24 hours by phone, a sticker on the windscreen and a letter in the mail, three days later it's a fine and impound/towing fees.

 

 

Towing the car same day, and being unable to provide details promptly as to where it was, is a bad foulup in my view... go for the balls and make them decide not to do it again

[Jesse OBrien]

Idk about your area, but up in alaska it is mandatory that the owner be notified 24 hours before towing, whether that be a sign at parking or a written ticket on the windshield. The APD don't really do anything until someone complains about a car and after the complaint, they sit on it for like 2 or 3 days before doing anything.

 

Was it in a public lot? If its a private lot, then I would talk to the owner, they are usually the ones that responsible to have a car towed off their lot. I've read a article of a guy that had his car towed (not repo'd) on a private lot without the lot owners permission and went to court and won agaist the local PD. The lot owner is the one that has to file the suit though.

 

Might want to look into the policy in your area.

 

It was on a public road, parked in a legal area (not a lot). As far as I know, nobody had complained. If I had heard about any sort of complaint, I'd have moved it into my driveway (if not all the way to the back of my garage). Thanks for the input to both of you. I'm debating whether or not the cost of a lawyer would be justified for this. I'll have to call some law offices on Monday to find out what it's going to come to.

[geezer]

With the starter, alternator, battery and hood removed, the definition of "non-op" vehicle comes solidly into play, I would think, so all that remains is the letter of the law. You should be able to research the local ordanances without retaining a lawyer. Regardless, if you are found to be at fault or your car was towed prematurely you can bet the towing company is protected in the actions they have taken. Their first order of business is to cover their own a$$. When you show up at the tow yard with the intention of picking up your vehicle, all they care about is getting their money and the car is authorized to be released. They don't care about your schedule and when it is convenient for you to pick up your car or who is at fault for it being in their yard. It's simple. You show up during their posted regular hours of operation, pay all related fees, they release your car. Can you imagine how many phone calls they must get from irate people who mistakenly think the tow yard can play judge & jury? They are mearly contracted for services provided, in this case the PD.

You wanted an unbiased opinion. Pay the fine, let it go. It's a bummer, live & learn. An understanding police officer might have reacted differently if a note was left on the vehicle explaining your plight.

[seabee280z]

ok listen up i used to drive a tow truck so here me out . sometime the owner of the company would see a car he would like to have and as a tow truck owner you become friends with alot of cops. so he would make a call get the paper work done up in about 15 minutes and off we were sent to get this car in the hopes that the person could not pay or would not pay and he would then procees for the paper work and wala the car is his. worse case was the person came and paid for it and no lose due to the fact he got storage and tow fees. my advise is this go pay for it on moday cause you are only racking up fees and if you do get a lawer you will get the fees back later and you will still have you car. here in louisiana you can fill for the titles in 3 day from time it is in storage now it takes 3 months to get them. GO GET YOUR CAR AND THEN FIGHT IT.

[woldson]

I believe in Spokane Wa. you can not park you car for no more than 24hrs on public right away. I do believe there is notice given before towing.

[Jesse OBrien]

With the starter, alternator, battery and hood removed, the definition of "non-op" vehicle comes solidly into play, I would think, so all that remains is the letter of the law. You should be able to research the local ordanances without retaining a lawyer. Regardless, if you are found to be at fault or your car was towed prematurely you can bet the towing company is protected in the actions they have taken. Their first order of business is to cover their own a$$. When you show up at the tow yard with the intention of picking up your vehicle, all they care about is getting their money and the car is authorized to be released. They don't care about your schedule and when it is convenient for you to pick up your car or who is at fault for it being in their yard. It's simple. You show up during their posted regular hours of operation, pay all related fees, they release your car. Can you imagine how many phone calls they must get from irate people who mistakenly think the tow yard can play judge & jury? They are mearly contracted for services provided, in this case the PD.

You wanted an unbiased opinion. Pay the fine, let it go. It's a bummer, live & learn. An understanding police officer might have reacted differently if a note was left on the vehicle explaining your plight.

 

There's no disputing that the car was 'non op', but it wasn't registered as 'non op', which I think should still be legal to park on the street (plenty of people get away with it, anyway). My big complaints come from the fact that by the time I could take action, I've already been charged for almost $300 in storage fees, and was given no option to do otherwise, since nobody informed me of where the car was, and I could not get an answer out of the PD (seems awfully suspect to me).

 

I really appreciate the input, and see where you're coming from.

 

ok listen up i used to drive a tow truck so here me out . sometime the owner of the company would see a car he would like to have and as a tow truck owner you become friends with alot of cops. so he would make a call get the paper work done up in about 15 minutes and off we were sent to get this car in the hopes that the person could not pay or would not pay and he would then procees for the paper work and wala the car is his. worse case was the person came and paid for it and no lose due to the fact he got storage and tow fees. my advise is this go pay for it on moday cause you are only racking up fees and if you do get a lawer you will get the fees back later and you will still have you car. here in louisiana you can fill for the titles in 3 day from time it is in storage now it takes 3 months to get them. GO GET YOUR CAR AND THEN FIGHT IT.

 

I'm definitely picking up the car on Monday, and I'm trying pretty hard not to point any fingers at shifty behavior, as I don't know the specifics of the situation. I'm going to assume they were pressed for time or something to that effect.

 

I believe in Spokane Wa. you can not park you car for no more than 24hrs on public right away. I do believe there is notice given before towing.

 

That's one of my biggest complaints. If I don't know I've done something wrong, how am I to fix it? Some sort of notice/warning/citation/ticket would have gone a long way for me.

 

 

Bottom line

I would have appreciated some sort of contact and a chance to move my car before it was towed. I think this is a clear-cut case of overzealous towing (disagree all you like, there were many options open to this Officer, and he chose the most extreme).

 

Disregarding the lack of contact beforehand, wouldn't it make sense to inform someone that their car has been towed? Leaving a note on my door or a message on my voicemail would have allowed me to pick up the car on the same day. I would still be upset, but wouldn't feel as taken advantage as I do now.

 

If not, at least send me a mail notice so that I can act on it immediately, not on Saturday when the PD is closed (and impounded cars cannot be released). Also, I'd really appreciate if the tow company would reply to me, and actually give me some means to pay them and get the matter resolved. Refusing my request to speak to someone who can help me, and wasting my time by not calling me back does not help the situation.

 

On top of this, Vallejo has a shooting almost every week. The crime rates have steadily increased over the past few years and most of the "business district" has closed down (antique shops remain, but ~75% of the buildings are empty). And while I'm offer a rock or an ounce every time I go to/from the bus stop, the PD is still centered on immediately addressing the car that looks like it doesn't run right now. I'm disgusted.

 

Thanks for all the input so far, guys! I can't tell you how much it helps to hear other peoples' takes.

[buZy]

I understand and sorry but I would not waste your time or money on a lawyer. Fight what? In the end city hall will squash you and your old car like bug. I know it's unfair. Your only offensive choice, be more savy about parking and appearing "non-op".

[Jesse OBrien]

I understand and sorry but I would not waste your time or money on a lawyer. Fight what? In the end city hall will squash you and your old car like bug. I know it's unfair. Your only offensive choice, be more savy about parking and appearing "non-op".

 

So you don't believe that we have control over how we are governed?

[Globerunner513]

I have been in this situation. My fuel pump stopped working, among some other things, and at the time my car was at the bottom of a hill in our neighborhood. It was parked on the side of the street which has no houses bordering it, but was still notified that it needed to be moved within 24 hours of when it was parked, otherwise it would be towed. (someone complained). I just pushed it to the other side of the street, and that legally gave me another 24 hours. I ended up getting a tow back across town to our garage.

 

I'm pretty sure they have to make sure that you got the notice, and that it has been more than 24 hours. I would fight this. But don't lose your car either.

[Jesse OBrien]

I have been in this situation. My fuel pump stopped working, among some other things, and at the time my car was at the bottom of a hill in our neighborhood. It was parked on the side of the street which has no houses bordering it, but was still notified that it needed to be moved within 24 hours of when it was parked, otherwise it would be towed. (someone complained). I just pushed it to the other side of the street, and that legally gave me another 24 hours. I ended up getting a tow back across town to our garage.

 

I'm pretty sure they have to make sure that you got the notice, and that it has been more than 24 hours. I would fight this. But don't lose your car either.

 

Whatever course I go with, I have to get my car tomorrow. I'll decide on the legal matters after I have it and i've cooled off a little. I don't want to go into it with the wrong intentions.

[SSflyer]

I think you need to make them explain exactly what 'not operational means'. Is there a specific definition about how long a car has to be in a spot without being moved to be classified as non-op? There has to be a time limit. AND how do they track how long a car has been in a certain spot without being moved? People routinely push dead cars from one spot to another just to forstall getting it towed. I think too that they would be obligated to post a tow warning on the vehicle. Just because a car has the starter out doesn't necessarily mean it's going to stay that way. It sounds to me like a gravy contract for the tow company because they know most people will just pay the fees.

[geezer]

Everyone is in agreement, it is best to get your car as soon as possible. Arguing the point with the towyard or driver is pointless. Next, do your research and learn the laws pertaining to this. This is key. Our opinions don't mean squat, even if it doesn't seem fair to any of us, to not get a notification or warning. I wouldn't want you to incur further expense fighting a lost cause, but if you find out that a time warning or notification was required by law, by all means, seek restitution. It wouldn't be the first time an over zealous police officer overstept his authority. Keep Cool & Good Luck!

[Jesse OBrien]

I just want to take a quick moment to point out that I do not in any way have a problem with Police Officers in general. I do feel that a bad day for an Officer is a bad day for someone else, but without them I wouldn't be caught walking down the street without a gun. I was even considering becoming a volunteer for the PD until my job began to eat up all of my time.

 

I still need to attain a copy of the Vallejo Towing Policy. If it states that everything that was done was legal, it's time to revisit that policy. If it doesn't (or even better, argues against my situation), I think I stand a chance at getting partial or full restitution. I just need to make sure I keep my recipts when I get the car back.

[Stealth-Z]

Vallejo has some interesting parking and towing procedures. The 1976 Fairlady Z I recently acquired was in a Vallejo tow yard. The previous owners neighbors complained about it being an eye sore and said the owner had not moved it in several days. The Vallejo PD was more than happy to have it towed. Most likely some one did complain.

[cygnusx1]

I would pay them and get my car back, but demand a clear explanation from the PD as to why the car was towed. If they can't provide a clear explanation of how your car met their qualification of "towable", I would seek some sort of compensation. You can pay by personal check but write something on the check to the effect that you don't fully agree with the transfer. I think you can write, "Paid under Duress" on the check which may make it easier on you if you ever need to fight to get your money back later. The PD is not always right but you have to respect their decisions anyhow. They certainly should give you an explanation.

 

Non-Op vehicle is a fuzzy line. I think there must be a time limit in that law. Like non-op for 5 days or something like that.

[JSM]

If you've got the money, fight it, otherwise move on. Do you have access to a garage for storage?

[EMWHYR0HEN]

So you don't believe that we have control over how we are governed?

 

 

For small stuff like this.... Hell no.

 

It's hard to beat the system. If you've got the time and money go for it, otherwise save it for someting bigger.

[dr_hunt]

I wouldn't move but the time and effort arguing with a government entity and a towing company will far outweight the money spent to get the car back IMO. Kind of like arguing with someone who has a huge ego and can't be wrong. Better to just beat your head against the wall repeatedly.