Miller econotig torch compatibilty

[jerryb]

Once I finish my current projects I plan to build a Super 7 type open wheel track car with my sons. Frame suspension and all....and I need to start with a decent welding package.

 

I found a super deal on a Econotig...BUT....it was used as a power source for PVD equipment and comes with no torch.

 

Doing a quick ebay search I discovered the price of a torch and cable can get pretty expensive....so much for the deal...lol

 

Anyway......I dont know much about welding equipment so this question may be a bit simple but here it goes..... are all Tig welding cables the same? For example does a Lincoln fit on a Miller? Are there adaptors that allow this? Or am I trapped in picking up a Miller unit.

 

Im looking for less expensive alternatives....if possible.

 

Thanx

[Six_Shooter]

That's a good question.

 

I have an Econotig, and haven't thought about Torch replacement yet, since I got it new and it still looks pretty much new.

 

The welding supply house I deal with down here seems to be pretty good for prices. I'll have to get you the number.

 

Are you planning on welding aluminium? If you are I'd suggest looking at Synchrowave. The Econotig does ok with thicker aluminium, but thin (less than about 1/8") is pretty much out of the question, even with thicker it's kinda tricky. On Mild and stainless steel it works great though.

[jerryb]

Yes I would like to weld Aluminum.....but its not the primary concern. I searched a few welding forums and everyone echos your sentiments on the Synchowave being the better option but the Econotig will come my way for basicaly nothing.

 

Yes...please fire that number my way.

[johnc]

The most expensive part of most machines is the tooling needed to actually use the machine. This shouldn't surprise anyone. The TIG torches themselves are basically the same. The Econotig uses a very common air cooled Weldcraft WP17 torch which has a street price around $65 for a 25' cable and torch.

[grumpyvette]

if your going to do differant things and sometimes get into welding for extended periods a water cooled torch, with a seperate fluid pump, may be a better option, even if it costs a good deal more

[jerryb]

Ok I will look into it...sounds very reasonable. I guess I was looking at a Miller torch kit....?? It was over $250.

 

I dont expect to be welding for long periods so the water cooled tip is probably not required. Torch time will be limited to building the frame and suspension (control arms) so I will probably have lots of time between welds.

 

Now I gotta learn how to tig weld!! Any suggestions?

 

Update...just found one for $80....local. Thanx!!

 

The most expensive part of most machines is the tooling needed to actually use the machine. This shouldn't surprise anyone. The TIG torches themselves are basically the same. The Econotig uses a very common air cooled Weldcraft WP17 torch which has a street price around $65 for a 25' cable and torch.

[roye@hrewheels.com]

I have to agree with grumpyvette 100%.

 

I have a Miller syncrowave 200 tig, after about 5 minuts of welding the torch can burn your hand, after about 20 minuts of welding steel (putting my Frontier back together) you can hardly hold the torch with a heavy glove. I love my machine but I wish I would have spent some money to get the water cooled product. Next time I get into a project that requires a good deal of fab I will most likely by an add on system for it.

 

RE

[johnc]

I welded for 3 years with an air cooled torch. For longer weld times I wore a big, thick glove. For a home hobbyist an air cooled torch is fine. Most folks can't TIG weld for 30 minutes straight.

[jerryb]

I couldnt imagine what I would weld for 30 minutes straight!!! Thats a lot of tubing!

 

 

I welded for 3 years with an air cooled torch. For longer weld times I wore a big, thick glove. For a home hobbyist an air cooled torch is fine. Most folks can't TIG weld for 30 minutes straight.

[roye@hrewheels.com]

I put together some prototype aluminium rim parts for HRE a few years ago, it was an hour and one half of welding. The torch actually got hot enough for the rubber grip to melt in to my glove, there was some lasting damage to the torch and I had to replace it.

Of course this probably falls into the "miss-used" category and would not happen in most hobbyst level projects.

[johnc]

I couldnt imagine what I would weld for 30 minutes straight!!!

 

When I first started BetaMotorsports I did piece rate production TIG welding for SP Tools at my shop. I would weld for two hours at a time then take a ten minute break and no lunch. Did this for ten hours every day, six days a week. When I went home at night my head felt like it was stuffed with cotton and I couldn't focus my eyes on anything further away then 10 feet.

 

I did the math once, at 4 inches per minute welding speed I welded about 330 feet each day - basically a football field of TIG weld bead. Over a 1/3 of a mile each week.

[yo2001]

Air cooled torch does seem to get pretty hot pretty fast but I've not had a problem with using WP17 torch. Anything pass 70amp in long bead gets hot enough that I have to use thick glove though.

 

I do like how flexible the cable is on the WP17.

 

Only have about 2 hours seat time on the syncrowave 200 but it's a great unit. I think it's actually a jump from the older 180SD.

[jerryb]

Again.....I cant imagine. A good friend of mine runs a Tig welding / fabrication shop. At times he welds for hours on end....making precision assemblies. I see it as a tough way to make a living and I respect and admire the skills of people like yourselves.

 

I guess thats why I want to start this project. Things like this dont come natuaraly to me and I view this as a challenge and chance to learn something new.

 

 

When I first started BetaMotorsports I did piece rate production TIG welding for SP Tools at my shop. I would weld for two hours at a time then take a ten minute break and no lunch. Did this for ten hours every day, six days a week. When I went home at night my head felt like it was stuffed with cotton and I couldn't focus my eyes on anything further away then 10 feet.

 

I did the math once, at 4 inches per minute welding speed I welded about 330 feet each day - basically a football field of TIG weld bead. Over a 1/3 of a mile each week.

[roye@hrewheels.com]

Again.....I cant imagine. A good friend of mine runs a Tig welding / fabrication shop. At times he welds for hours on end....making precision assemblies. I see it as a tough way to make a living and I respect and admire the skills of people like yourselves.

 

If you think that is bad, walk onto a ship yard. 8+ hours of FCAW each day makes hours of TIG work look like a walk in the park.

[tannji]

No offense... but get the best deal you can on the torch and consumables for the Econotig, play with it on steel, and develop your technique. Find another person looking to get into TIG, and sell them the package at a tidy profit, and get a better Aluminum welder. I just spent about 15 minutes today on Miller's newest TIG, and I kinda like it.... but I really like it's price; a little over $1600 list, meaning we will probably sell it for about $1400+/-. It is 165 Amps, and is a dumbed down Dynasty. We just had an industry show today at which the welder was shown for the first time in the country. Look for it on shelves in the next 3 weeks or so.

The Econotig is ok to learn on, most especially when you get a steal deal on it... but you lost me at aluminum.

[yo2001]

Always look out for a deal close by. I got mine locally from a guy who used it for couple month. The timer had only 1:27 min on it. (now I have doubled it and some) Paid $1400 and walked away with syncrowave 200.

[jerryb]

I understand that the econotig is not the best all round unit. But it is basically costing me $80 so its hard to turn down. At this point I dont know any better so I will try it out and see what happens.

 

Dont forget that my main objective is to build a steel tube chassis along with a few suspension pieces. If I can learn to lay down a good weld on this material I will be pretty happy.

 

Hey...$80 is better than $1600. For 1600 I can probably build enough parts to build 2....one for each of my kids.

[tannji]

Ya... don't get me wrong, a steal is a steal, and you can learn on it. If I had a significantly better budget I would already be rockin' the PrecisionTig 225 or a Dynasty. As it is I am waiting on electrical to play with a 220 MIG and a cute little 110 DC TIG. Don't "try out" one of the bigger machines until you finish your project though... = )

[Six_Shooter]

Heck at $80, I'll step on your toes, poke you in the eye Stooge's style, and dump some baking powered you, take pictures of it and post them all over OZC and HybridZ, if you don't buy it.

 

Grab it and learn on it, it's a VERY good machine for doing that. I've welded countless engine mounts with mine (those 3400 swap mounts for J-bodies), my exhaust for the Z, along with countless other parts, and all have worked out well. I even welded some ladder bars and part of a frame for a T-bucket (not ours, another one), it's a gret little machine for steel.

[SHO-Z]

I was a certified pipe welder for years welded both carbon steel and stainless. A good DC welder and flex head tig torch will do almost anything you want to do other that aluminum. I perfer the flex head to get into tight places. The ones with the knob for adjustment are the best, the rubber ones tend to work harden and break.