jacob80 Posted January 25, 2010 Share Posted January 25, 2010 Hey guys, Well Im not sure what is going on but I just can't seem to get this damn car running with megasquirt. It runs, yes, and we've had it running fairly decent, but never where we wanted. I'm willing to try new things but I am not willing to blow up a motor in the process. I've read A LOT, and I'm willing to do anything to get this thing right, but I'm just having trouble finding a starting point. Here's my setup L28ET - All stock long block Stock Turbo (wrapped exhaust manifold/heat blanket) Stock Intake Intercooler 240sx throttle body Fidanza flywheel MS1 V3.0 with flyback board My real issue is where to start, and what parameters do I edit first? I'm just at a loss of how the process works. There are so many different options to choose, but it seems like none work out as I want. I've tried loading maps posted in the map-sharing thread but I can't even get the damn thing to start for more than a second or so now. If anyone could point me in the right direction it would be GREATLY appreciated, thanks again guys. -Jacob Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
letitsnow Posted January 25, 2010 Share Posted January 25, 2010 Do you have a wideband? If it fires but doesn't run adjust the after start enrichment and the warmup enrichment. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flexicoker Posted January 25, 2010 Share Posted January 25, 2010 Do you have a wideband? Thats where I would start if you don't. What I did was: Set the entire AFR table to the same value, I chose 13:1. Once it fires up, what happens? does it go rich or lean? Watch the VE table and AFR and adjust accordingly. Once its running for more than a second, Under the ignition options, set 'fixed timing' and a value of 10 degrees or so. Adjust the trigger offset until you see 10 degrees on your pulley. Does that help? or are your problems with other stuff? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jacob80 Posted January 25, 2010 Author Share Posted January 25, 2010 Yeah that is all useful, thank you, and yes I do have an innovate LC-1 wideband that functions great and has a gauge. I have currently copied mobys maps and am going to try those. Should it start even though I'm using his map which I think he's using the stock turbo injectors, or would I have to scale the map since I have 440cc? I'm just wondering how big of an impact these injectors make...thanks guys! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slow_Old_Car Posted January 25, 2010 Share Posted January 25, 2010 have you 110% beyond the shadow of a doubt ensured that your mechanicle timing matches what the MSnS is seeing? (assuming your running SnS and not just squirt). Having that 1 statement equal false will pretty much make everything else your doing pointless. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
letitsnow Posted January 25, 2010 Share Posted January 25, 2010 Change the req_fuel value in the engine constants to match your injectors, use the calculator it has. I think mine was about 13ms. have you 110% beyond the shadow of a doubt ensured that your mechanicle timing matches what the MSnS is seeing? (assuming your running SnS and not just squirt). Do this too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jacob80 Posted January 25, 2010 Author Share Posted January 25, 2010 Just reading in my tuning book and had a thought. What if I set the afr target table to a safe 12.8:1 all across the board and turned on auto correction? Would this help at least getting it to idle? Additionally, once I've got it to idle I could go or a test run and adjust the ve table to bring up or down my afrs to match my target table, correct? Thanks again guys! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alxxpress Posted January 25, 2010 Share Posted January 25, 2010 If you can't get the car to idle at all you probably are not going to get it to run at a spacific A/F. Make sure the timing is calibrated to the ECM. This is one of the first things you must do after you calibrate the TPS. The biggest problem that I have seen with cars that won't run with new EFI systems is low voltage. Do you have a new battery in the car? I am not talking about a two year old battery you had charged for a hour at your auto parts store. New fresh battery please. Good luck, hope your car is kicking butt soon. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jacob80 Posted January 25, 2010 Author Share Posted January 25, 2010 Check my timing after I calibrate the tps?? Wow, I've never heard that. Also, we have been having an electrical issue with starting. Sometimes, you'll turn the key and it will just click, then a pop the hood and use a screwdriver and it starts. God knows what's going on there...we have installed the relay mod for the starter. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mobythevan Posted January 25, 2010 Share Posted January 25, 2010 (edited) I am pretty sure what he meant is when you hook up megasquirt, you start with very basic things like this: 1. Calibrate TPS 2. Calibrate timing between table and engine (timing tab, timing light) 3. Set required fuel by using the calculator for engine size, injector size, target afr 4. Now follow the megasquirt manual on firing the engine and starting to tune cold start, after start, warm up. 5. When the engine is warmed up start working on fuel table adjustments. I think the previous poster just meant that calibrating the TPS and calibrating the timing happen right away before even trying to fire the engine for the first time. It is a large project to tune everything on your car for the first time. It took me about 5 cars before I started getting the hang of it. Now I know the process really well and can go from first firing to tuning the VE table in little time, but every car has different problems so any kind of guide doesn't address every problem. Best advice, follow the mega manual for tuning and think about why they tell you to turn off correction to tune AFRs, turn off accel enrichment to tune AFRs, have a warmed up engine before tuning AFRS, etc. Accell, warm up, ve should all be tuned independently. I really messed up some ve tables early on by tuning with accell enrichment turned on. Just keep at it is all I can say. EDIT: I notice you are 8 hours from me. Maybe load the car on a trailer and plan a weekend at my house. Tuning party! Edited January 25, 2010 by mobythevan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jacob80 Posted January 25, 2010 Author Share Posted January 25, 2010 I am pretty sure what he meant is when you hook up megasquirt, you start with very basic things like this: 1. Calibrate TPS 2. Calibrate timing between table and engine (timing tab, timing light) 3. Set required fuel by using the calculator for engine size, injector size, target afr 4. Now follow the megasquirt manual on firing the engine and starting to tune cold start, after start, warm up. 5. When the engine is warmed up start working on fuel table adjustments. I think the previous poster just meant that calibrating the TPS and calibrating the timing happen right away before even trying to fire the engine for the first time. It is a large project to tune everything on your car for the first time. It took me about 5 cars before I started getting the hang of it. Now I know the process really well and can go from first firing to tuning the VE table in little time, but every car has different problems so any kind of guide doesn't address every problem. Best advice, follow the mega manual for tuning and think about why they tell you to turn off correction to tune AFRs, turn off accel enrichment to tune AFRs, have a warmed up engine before tuning AFRS, etc. Accell, warm up, ve should all be tuned independently. I really messed up some ve tables early on by tuning with accell enrichment turned on. Just keep at it is all I can say. EDIT: I notice you are 8 hours from me. Maybe load the car on a trailer and plan a weekend at my house. Tuning party! Geeze, I would do that in a second if I had the time!! Okay, is there a guide on how to turn off enrichments and run the car on raw VE table values? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jacob80 Posted January 26, 2010 Author Share Posted January 26, 2010 Ok, can you say rich? Honestly, what the heck am I doing wrong here?????? Moby, do you think you could send me a map that I can atleast start this thing with??? Trust me, everything is sound mechanically, its something on my end, tuning wise. I'd like to atleast have this thing idling tonight. Thanks guys. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trippintl0 Posted January 26, 2010 Share Posted January 26, 2010 Use cheap NGK plugs until you get this thing figured out!! And DON'T leave your wideband in there until you get the thing at least idling because the excessive richness will foul out the O2 sensor! It happened to me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slow_Old_Car Posted January 26, 2010 Share Posted January 26, 2010 get copper plugs... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jacob80 Posted January 26, 2010 Author Share Posted January 26, 2010 Use cheap NGK plugs until you get this thing figured out!! And DON'T leave your wideband in there until you get the thing at least idling because the excessive richness will foul out the O2 sensor! It happened to me. Yeah, lets hope I haven't already....what should the wideband read with the key in the on position? Or is this something I need to set in order to set it up? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jacob80 Posted January 26, 2010 Author Share Posted January 26, 2010 Okay, just went out to try and start it and nothing. Just turns over and over and over and over. It barely, just barely acted like it wanted to start but nothing else. I'm not going to give up but at this point...I just don't even know what to do...any help is appreciated, thanks guys. Oh, and if any of you are local, it would be greatly appreciated if you could bring some help my way. Thank you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FlatBlack Posted January 26, 2010 Share Posted January 26, 2010 You need to get a timing light on there and make sure your actual timing is correct. Set the timing to -10 in MegaTune and then check to see where it is sparking on the timing mark. Are you using a ZXT CAS Dizzy? http://forums.hybridz.org/showthread.php?t=151424&page=2 Check out letitsnow's post in there ^ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ktm Posted January 26, 2010 Share Posted January 26, 2010 Hey guys, Well Im not sure what is going on but I just can't seem to get this damn car running with megasquirt. It runs, yes, and we've had it running fairly decent, but never where we wanted. I'm willing to try new things but I am not willing to blow up a motor in the process. I've read A LOT, and I'm willing to do anything to get this thing right, but I'm just having trouble finding a starting point. Here's my setup L28ET - All stock long block Stock Turbo (wrapped exhaust manifold/heat blanket) Stock Intake Intercooler 240sx throttle body Fidanza flywheel MS1 V3.0 with flyback board My real issue is where to start, and what parameters do I edit first? I'm just at a loss of how the process works. There are so many different options to choose, but it seems like none work out as I want. I've tried loading maps posted in the map-sharing thread but I can't even get the damn thing to start for more than a second or so now. If anyone could point me in the right direction it would be GREATLY appreciated, thanks again guys. -Jacob Ok, wait a sec. Am I reading this right? You actually had the car running fine until you loaded some one else's file. Now the car wont' run for more than a second. Guess what, do not load someone else's map. Use their timing, target AFR's and VE tables, yes, their entire file? No. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CamH Posted January 26, 2010 Share Posted January 26, 2010 nthing the "get a timing light on there" comments. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jacob80 Posted January 26, 2010 Author Share Posted January 26, 2010 Oh trust me, I have been using a timing light guys. I've set the crankingadvance to 5 degrees BTDC, and the computer and light agree. As far as the maps, for some reason, it was erased/lost and I didn't think I would have nearly this much trouble. I'll post up a video here soon of me trying to get it to start. If someone could post a map I could try it would probably be very beneficial to me because apparently what I'm doing is not working. Also, I just installed logworks 3 so that I can recalibrate my wideband and see where I am at with that. Thanks for everything guys!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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