Fined for being a gross polluter in a S30?

[Tony D]

A roadside officer can not 'tack you as gross polluter' --- he can send you to a mandatory REFEREE STATION for a check, and the REFEREE can tag you as a 'gross polluter', but a law enforcement officer does not have that power, that resides ONLY with the BAR. Gross polluter does not have ANYTHING to do with a court appearance!

 

Please post the EXACT CVC VIOLATION as listed on your ticket. You are either not interpreting what is being told to you correctly, being misinformed, or simply posting B.S... one of the three.

 

If you are misinterpreting his saying you need to go to a referee station for a smog check before your court date, best get ready to ask for a continuance to do so when you arrive in court.

 

But what you were cited for is CLEARLY written on the ticket. I really want to know what you were REALLY cited for now. Given the re-read of your original post, it sounds like he sent you to the referee (show him your smog certificate) and have another cop sign it off. You make the assumption he told you something you didn't need to do: get a smog certificate. They CAN tell you to do this on ANY US vehicle from 1954 and newer, and any Import from 1966 and newer. Yes you have to go to the smog check (referee) if they tell you to, there is no 'exemption'...

 

Seriously though, post the CVC section you were cited under, it's on your ticket.

Edited April 12, 2010 by Tony D

[Gollum]

thanks for the reply guys.

great information Tony D.

That helps, I was going to argue that my engine wasn't warm yet when he pulled me over, and a 40 year old car tends to smoke before warmup. But now I'm might not want to risk anything, and just pay the fix it after getting a officer to sign it. Didn't know my S30 still can get sent to the ref. I don't have anything crazy, l28et T4 SDS but all the emissions equipment are gone...

 

Whoa whoa whoa, hold on there for one second.

 

As well covered, pre 76' doesn't mean smog exempt, just biannual testing exempt.

 

That means your swap, if you haven't had it signed off by a ref who added a swap bar plate, is illegal.

 

In order to make it legal you'd need to convert it back to 100% stock ECU control, including timing system. You'll also have to have 100% functional smog equipment.

 

Consider yourself fortunate you got an office to sign off on it. Do your best to avoid being sent to a referee. He'll know it's a swap in a heartbeat. If it comes to that, then I'd recommend having a spare motor to throw in for testing purposes.

 

Oh, and if your T4 doesn't look stock you can bet good money the ref won't pass that for a swap legalization. You need 100% stock air and fuel control. That means larger injectors aren't passable. Modified throttle bodies aren't passable. Even a modified downpipe can be considered non-passable. If the engine never had an intercooler, then adding one can cause you to not be passed. It needs to be as stock as possible to make the ref happy.

[thewaiverproject]

A roadside officer can not 'tack you as gross polluter' --- he can send you to a mandatory REFEREE STATION for a check, and the REFEREE can tag you as a 'gross polluter', but a law enforcement officer does not have that power, that resides ONLY with the BAR. Gross polluter does not have ANYTHING to do with a court appearance!

 

Please post the EXACT CVC VIOLATION as listed on your ticket. You are either not interpreting what is being told to you correctly, being misinformed, or simply posting B.S... one of the three.

 

If you are misinterpreting his saying you need to go to a referee station for a smog check before your court date, best get ready to ask for a continuance to do so when you arrive in court.

 

But what you were cited for is CLEARLY written on the ticket. I really want to know what you were REALLY cited for now. Given the re-read of your original post, it sounds like he sent you to the referee (show him your smog certificate) and have another cop sign it off. You make the assumption he told you something you didn't need to do: get a smog certificate. They CAN tell you to do this on ANY US vehicle from 1954 and newer, and any Import from 1966 and newer. Yes you have to go to the smog check (referee) if they tell you to, there is no 'exemption'...

 

Seriously though, post the CVC section you were cited under, it's on your ticket.

 

its 27156(a)

So i went to court and showed the judge that I had it corrected, and she said " oh so it says correctable on the ticket" then she said ok its just $25 for hte fix it ticket.

After reading your reply, this is what I think went down. A series of lucky encounters with misinformed officials.

Officer gave me the ticket telling me i had to get a certificate and show it to another officer to get it signed off. I told him that it was smog exempt because AT THE TIME I thought all pre 75 cars were- which was false. However, that officer also did not know that only pre-56 cars were exempt ( I'm sure most of them dont go around memorizing every cvc) So he told me to just have an officer sign it off after i fix it. Which i did- and that officer didn't realize that I actually had to get a certificate as well.

Then I found out I had a mandatory court date, probably because under that CVC I had to show the judge that i went to BAR or she would send me there, and showed the judge that the officer gave me a fix it ticket and I had another sign it off. I told her that he just told me to get someone to sign it off.

She either thought that it was the right process, or she knew that both officers made a mistake, and that they should've sent me to BAR. However maybe because the officers made a mistake, she decided to let me off with a fix-it ticket since I did fix the smoking.

[badjuju]

Washington, drive a '73. I will never, ever get pulled over for pollution. If, for some reason, I did, I'd probably be able to talk my way out of it, I'm 12-0 on pull overs-tickets. Don't know why, but they pull my little z over for everything, and never seem to care about the initial issue.

 

I would totally flip out in your position though. Unless the officer is there to confirm he said what he said, you pretty much have to pay the fine?

[Tony D]

Your ignorance just got you screwed!

 

27156(a)Is operation of a gross polluter. Matter of fact it's obvious nobody here has done ANY homework so lets look at the CVC (which is what I was asking for BEFORE you went to court!)

 

Gross Polluter: Air Pollution Control Device

27156. (a) No person shall operate or leave standing upon a highway a motor vehicle that is a gross polluter, as defined in Section 39032.5 of the Health and Safety Code.

 

This is what you were cited for? It's not a VALID TICKET! He SHOULD have cited you under (, and sent you to the referee. That is why the judge acted so suprised. You just paid a $25 fine for a fix it ticket which was INVALID. In fact, if the referee had looked at your car, and found you have removed required emissions devices, it's proof of (d) & (f) below! As I was inquiring, section (g) delineates the correction procedure.

 

( No person shall operate or leave standing upon a highway a motor vehicle that is required to be equipped with a motor vehicle pollution control device under Part 5 (commencing with Section 43000) of Division 26 of the Health and Safety Code or any other certified motor vehicle pollution control device required by any other state law or any rule or regulation adopted pursuant to that law, or required to be equipped with a motor vehicle pollution control device pursuant to the National Emission Standards Act (42 U.S.C. 7521 to 7550, inclusive) and the standards and regulations adopted pursuant to that federal act, unless the motor vehicle is equipped with the required motor vehicle pollution control device that is correctly installed and in operating condition. No person shall disconnect, modify, or alter any such required device.

 

© No person shall install, sell, offer for sale, or advertise any device, apparatus, or mechanism intended for use with, or as a part of, a required motor vehicle pollution control device or system that alters or modifies the original design or performance of the motor vehicle pollution control device or system.

 

(d) If the court finds that a person has willfully violated this section, the court shall impose the maximum fine that may be imposed in the case, and no part of the fine may be suspended.

 

(e) "Willfully," as used in this section, has the same meaning as the meaning of that word prescribed in Section 7 of the Penal Code.

 

(f) No person shall operate a vehicle after notice by a traffic officer that the vehicle is not equipped with the required certified motor vehicle pollution control device correctly installed in operating condition, except as may be necessary to return the vehicle to the residence or place of business of the owner or driver or to a garage, until the vehicle has been properly equipped with such a device.

 

(g) The notice to appear issued or complaint filed for a violation of this section shall require that the person to whom the notice to appear is issued or against whom the complaint is filed produce proof of correction pursuant to Section 40150 or proof of exemption pursuant to Section 4000.1 or 4000.2

 

(h) This section shall not apply to an alteration, modification, or modifying device, apparatus, or mechanism found by resolution of the State Air Resources Board to do either of the following:

 

(1) Not to reduce the effectiveness of a required motor vehicle pollution control device.

 

(2) To result in emissions from the modified or altered vehicle that are at levels that comply with existing state or federal standards for that model-year of the vehicle being modified or converted.

 

(i) Aftermarket and performance parts with valid State Air Resources Board Executive Orders may be sold and installed concurrent with a motorcycle’s transfer to an ultimate purchaser.

 

(j) This section applies to motor vehicles of the United States or its agencies, to the extent authorized by federal law.

 

Amended Ch. 27, Stats. 1994. Effective March 30, 1994.

Amended Sec. 1, Ch. 325, Stats. 2007. Effective January 1, 2008.

 

Additionally, read closely the section on fines for 'corrections':

 

Proof of Correction of Violation: Transaction Fee

40611. (a) Upon proof of correction of an alleged violation of Section 12500 or 12951, or any violation cited pursuant to Section 40610, or upon submission of evidence of financial responsibility pursuant to subdivision (e) of Section 16028, the clerk shall collect a twenty-five-dollar ($25) transaction fee for each violation. The fees shall be deposited by the clerk in accordance with Section 68084 of the Government Code.

 

( (1) For each citation, ten dollars ($10) shall be allocated monthly as follows:

 

(A) Thirty-three percent shall be transferred to the local governmental entity in whose jurisdiction the citation was issued for deposit in the general fund of the entity.

 

( Thirty-four percent shall be transferred to the State Treasury for deposit in the State Penalty Fund established by Section 1464 of the Penal Code.

 

© Thirty-three percent shall be deposited in the county general fund.

 

(2) The remainder of the fees collected on each citation shall be deposited in the Immediate and Critical Needs Account of the State Court Facilities Construction Fund, established in Section 70371.5 of the Government Code.

 

© No fee shall be imposed pursuant to this section if the violation notice is processed only by the issuing agency and no record of the action is transmitted to the court.

 

Somewhere in the back of the pulp edition of the CVC there is a list of violations. If what you were cited on your ticket does not correspond to this list, you can get it tossed. Likely 27156( is on there, and (a) is not... Too bad for you you didn't respond earlier.

 

And to clarify, you WERE NOT TICKETED AS A GROSS POLLUTER, you were ticketed under the gross polluter section of the CVC, but (a) ONLY applies to the vehicles stated in that section --- i.e. those identified by section 39032.5, which REQUIRED A TEST AND FAILURE. Not a summary judgement by a roadside official with his eyes. He SHOULD have tagged you under (, and that, is a hard lesson to learn. You could have skated on the $25 Ticket. If you had a friend with a Smog Check and were running Collector Car Insurance, your 73 would only be required to pass a sniffer test, and if you passed and weren't a gross polluter, you could have used that as evidence to prove you were not in (a) as well, and punctuated that with the 'I should not pay any fine whatsoever'....

 

Technical, yes? Welcome to how they get you. Read the verbiage in the related sections, there is a LOT of 'If the investigating officer DECIDES TO TAKE ACTION.' Nothing COMMANDS him to if it does not immediately impact health and safety! Total discretion.

[Tony D]

omigod, the smiley function is taking all the ( b ) sections and turning them in the

 

This was not my intent.

 

Oh, and on this:

"She either thought that it was the right process, or she knew that both officers made a mistake, and that they should've sent me to BAR. However maybe because the officers made a mistake, she decided to let me off with a fix-it ticket since I did fix the smoking."

 

She KNEW both officers were wrong. She CHOSE to hit you with the $25 ticket figuring since you didn't read the CVC, and didn't realize their mistake, you would probably pay the $25 fine, and think you got a deal.

 

Your appraisal about having two ignorant cops is probably right. Thats why YOU should start reading the CVC while you take a dump. You start going 'HOLY CRAP!' and then when the Buena Park PD gives you a crap ticket, you can ram it up their hineys and actually have the judge scold the cops for their ignorance!

Edited April 20, 2010 by Tony D

[(goldfish)]

And now I know how to make copyright signs. The amazing things you learn from Tony

[thewaiverproject]

yea, I should start reading up on all CVC's that I get next time.

Guess I lost 25 dollars, but that's a lesson learned. Thankfully none of the police officers knew that they had to send me to BAR. Time to make friends with someone who works at a SMOG test center.

[Mayolives]

QUOTE:"Time to make friends with someone who works at a SMOG test center."

This is the smartest thing you can do. Two sayings come to my mind after reading through this thread. The first, "I fought the law and the law won", and second, "the more you stir shi# the more it stinks". Make an effort to reduce the smoke and, with hat in hand, present you case to the court and make it right. It's the only lasting solution!