pparaska

quote: Originally posted by John Adkins: Thanks for the replies. You guys have brought up good points about chassis structural integrity and rust. Seems to me one of the keys to building a budget but quality and safe V8 is to start with a rust free body... Yep. Mike Knell (JTR manual author) says this several times through out the manual.

SuperDan: I love the idea of the thread per dollar/power range, and the tech articles that could result. I'd say that like any committee written guideline, it will take a long time to wring out - but it will be worth it. Mikelly: Thanks for the new nic-name for my car: "The Snowball" . I love it. Yes, my car started out as a simple V8 conversion with some rust replacement, sturctural improvement. The rust was everywhere once I was done with the structural mods, and it became a body restoration (don't ask how much that cost me). And now everything is being re-engineered (well not as much as SpencZ's car, but all systems are being changed to improve performance and update them. I really agree with Mike on the structural and brakes/suspension issues. These cars are not the stiffest/strongest (there is a difference) things out there without rust, and with rust they are quite fragile with 300 lbft of torque or more added by the V8. Then you go drive it hard with the V8 and you are asking more of the suspension and brakes (and unibody). This sets up a disaster waiting to happen if the car is rusted bad enough. And the rust can hide from you in structural areas you may not realize (ends of rocker boxes that you can't see, hidden rust in the frame rails under the hood, etc.) The upshot is that we ought to say what level of body stiffening/strengthening is needed for the level of power being added. Mike has a good point about power added. If you're just putting a stock 350 in, it is still a significant increase in the stresses the car will see, and some form of structual and brake/suspension work is still going to be needed. The thing is you quickly get on the slippery slope when doing these things and you see that for a little more money and effort in the structural/brakes/suspension areas, you can really upgrade them and have an acceptable margin of saftey for adding more power than just a stock 300 hp V8 would add. ------------------ Pete Paraska - 73 540Z - Marathon Z Project - pparaska@tidalwave.net">pparaska@tidalwave.net -

The four row radiators are not the easiest to get to work, since they are hard to get alot of air through. Ok for the L6, but the V8 needs more. I'd try an aluminum rad, either out of the 86 Camaro like JTR recommends or a Griffin. Sounds lik you've done all the important stuff. Pete "the other Pete" Paraska

I'm sorry I can't help with the diagram, but this brings up another mod I'm doing. The stock wiring harness is about 1 inch from the block hugger headers on my car. I've seen the melting harness bit before. Hey, since nothing has to go back the way is used to, this is what I am working on right now: As JTR recommends, I'm splitting the engine wires from the lights/horn wires in the harness. The engine wires (oil gauge, temp gauge, fna switch, alt wires, A/C clutch, electric choke, ignition) are all going on top of the engine in some of that shiny heat reflective cloth stuff that DEI sells, and will enter the engine compartment where the choke cables used to (hah - reuse!) The lights and horn wires are going into that duct that runs along the top of the pass fender for "flow-through" ventilation. The bundle of wires is about 1/2" in diameter and will enter where the flapper valve is in the interior, and exit out the plastic tube at the radiator support. There is nothing sharp in that duct, and it's pretty easy to fish the harness through there. I am going to have to add a foot or so to the 8 or so wires in that harness, but that's no biggie. Talk about stealth wiring. And I won't have to worry about the heat getting to the harness. The only thing that will run alon the pass fender is the A/C hoses. Now I wished I had removed those remaining plastic coated wire holder thingies along the inner fender before it was all painted - I won't need them anymore.

I don't know where it went, Dick, but I'll tell you what I did. I have the urethane M-bar bushings. Like Mike, I left the large flat washer that goes between the body and the urethane bushing out. I also cut about 0.3" of the large diameter part of the top bushing off, leaving about 0.2" of this large diameter portion to act as isolation between the M-bar and the body. This effectively raises the rear of the diff about 0.45", which was enough to change the rear driveshaft u-joint angle enough to be the same as the front angle on my car, as well as lowering the angle into the desired max 3 degree range. This does about the same thing as removeing the stock upper rubber/steel washer, shy by 0.2". JTR doesn't cover the urethane, just removing the stock washer. BTW, you also have to cut off the same length from the inner sleeve on the urethane kit as you remove from the top bushing. Hence, I cut off a matching 0.3" from the inner sleeve on my kit. This is to retain the compression of the bushings when you tighten it together. It seems I had to ad some washers to the bottom of the setup since the threads on that stud protruding from the body weren't long enough once you took that length out of the sleeve and bushing. You could use the washer you removed from the top also - I just used a stack of (7/16"?) washers. ------------------ Pete Paraska - 73 540Z - Marathon Z Project - pparaska@tidalwave.net">pparaska@tidalwave.net -

I've also wanted one for a long time - since I first got the V8 Z bug over 20 years ago after seeing the HOTROD article on the red ScarabZ. I then learned from Z buddies that the V8 conversion (the only known way then was the Scarab position of the drivetrain) made the car plow. So I came to the conclusion that an AL block would solve that. Too bad I couldn't think outside of the engine placement box and see that a set-back engine would solve the nose-heavy problem. I still think a light AL V8 would be cool, but hey, an iron Ford SB V8 would be lighter too. Oh well, I guess practicality will keep that old fashioned iron block SBC in my car! Heck, I ought to upgrade those old iron 462 Heads to AL first!

John, I was actually referring to a new crossmember for the stock engine pad mounts. I should have been more clear. I've heard of people adding another crossmember 4 inches or so aft of the stock Z engine crossmember so that the could have it directly below the engine mounts on the pads.

Jim Biondo did all that research for me, and I ended up buying his wheels and tires (he went to 5 lug wheels, C3 Vette stub axles, 300ZX front hubs, Integral SSR wheels). Jim had the wheels I now have on his stock rear fendered early 260Z (same as my 73) with 2-1/2" coil overs. He had these wheels custom made to fit the widest 17 inch combo in there. (The wheel maker was WRD, which is out of businesss now.) The rear wheels are 17x9s with 149mm backspacing. The tires are 255/45/17 Michelin Pilot SX MXX3s. Note that tires from other manufacturers of the same size can be larger, enough to not fit, since Jim really maxed out this combo. In fact, it's maxed out such that you mount the coilover sleeve up high on the strut and have to use short (8" with the 240Z strut isolator) springs that have to be at least 275 lb/in to stay out of coil stackup for a stock weight car hitting dips. I also had to trim the fender lip a bit (you can't tell from the outside of the car unless you look up under there.) BTW, the fronts are 17x8.5s with 235/45-17s. I don't think going to 18s would buy you much, but maybe a 265 could fit on maybe 18x9.5 wheels. HTH, ------------------ Pete Paraska - 73 540Z - Marathon Z Project - pparaska@tidalwave.net">pparaska@tidalwave.net -

John, Drax, What intercooler are you going to use? The guys on Zcar.com (James Thagard, etc.) swear by the Isuzu NPR Truck intercooler. It's huge! I know my Eclipse GSX's intercooler is way small. 20 or 30 seconds of 15psi boost and it's quite warm. Oh well, I'll save that money for the Z .

John, I guess that the mount pads of the Chevy V6 are the same distance back from the front of the block as the V8, so the bellhousing mounting surface is a whole cylinder closer to the front of the engine, like they cut off two cylinders from the back of the V8. Got it - thanks. Sound like a good reason to add another crossmember to mount the engine to. Cheers, Pete

John, FYI the JTR kit is the one that installs the V8 in the set back position, so that the engine/bellhousing mounting surface is just an inch or so ahead of the firewall. The old Scarab and Nordskog kits installed the engine so that the bellhousing/engine mounting surface was 4-5 inches forward of the firewall. ------------------ Pete Paraska - 73 540Z - Marathon Z Project - pparaska@tidalwave.net">pparaska@tidalwave.net -

I think Porsche, Ferarri use a hydraulic system to actuate the clutch and shifter linkage. I would absolutely love to have a good manual like the T-56 activated by this kind of system. You could set it up to be fully automatic for drag racing or sitting in traffic, and full manual with paddles for spirited road course/street driving.

Mike, I'm blushing. Thanks for the compliment! The link to see my subframe connectors is http://www.tidalwave.net/~pparaska/structuralmods.htm Cheers, Pete

I have repro 1/4s on my car. They are at least as thick as the stock stuff and the shop that put them on said they fit fairly well. I say go for it. I got them from Mill supply. I used the 280Z ones to get rid of the indents for the 240Z bumper.

Yes, ther is a sliding joint at the outer end of the 280ZXT CV shaft. COuld it be put at the inboard end of the shaft? Don't know. I'd start by calling Mardi at Raxles http://www.raxles.com . Then maby call the guys at: http://drivetrain.com/index.html Also, maybe pickup a copy of a road and custom mag and look at the advertisers. Keep us posted! Sounds interesting! ------------------ Pete Paraska - 73 540Z - Marathon Z Project - pparaska@tidalwave.net">pparaska@tidalwave.net -

Just so you guys don't think they're gone, go looking for them in the new forums they would be related too (Fuel Deliver, Body & Paint), or an older forum they really pertained to. Sorry to be so $%!l about, it just trying to put the bits in the correct bins . Cheers, Pete ------------------ Pete Paraska - 73 540Z - Marathon Z Project - pparaska@tidalwave.net">pparaska@tidalwave.net -

Dude, ask away. I have all the 73 240Z wiring schematics THAT I deciphered from the harnesses. I know what every damn wire on the car connects to and I have figured out how each circuit works. Not bragging, I just spent an inordinate amount of time on this so the thing would no longer be a mystery as I modify things. The headlight circuit is a TRIP! The wipers aren't too bad. A relay under the glovebox with a white connector, and the wiper switch and fuses. Let me know what isn't working. It sounds like you may be missing a hot wire from/to the fuse box. There are the two large white plastic six position connectors to it and two other single wires that hook to the harness. Check that. I can get you detailed info on how this hooks up if you want. Best of Luck, Pete [This message has been edited by pparaska (edited April 25, 2000).]

Aren't the stall rpm numbers for converters really dependent on the weight of the vehicle? In other words, if the weight of you car is lower (like 2700 lbs) than the weight of the big 'Merican muscle car that it was designed for (or the stall speed is advertised for) then the effective stall speed in your lighter car will be higher?

Mike, I was going to use the stock fuel pump wiring, but after talking to Jim Biondo and hearing about his problems with high speed power loss, I'm convinced I'll wire it separately, using a direct type connection (fused of course) from the relocated battery, using JTR's method of an oil pressure safety switch and a key "on" powered circuit, in parallel with a "start" powered circuit to run a relay back near the pump. The power for the fuel pump will go through the contacts on the relay from the rear mount battery, with a good sized groung back to the battery. That stock wiring is long, and I think, 16 gage at best. FYI, here is a table of resistances per length (ohms/meter) for different AWG gage wires: 14 gage: 0.0083 ohms/meter 12 gage: 0.0052 10 gage: 0.0033 8 gage: 0.0021 6 gage: 0.0013 4 gage: 0.0008 2 gage: 0.00051 1 gage: 0.00041 0 gage: 0.00032 (I think this is 1/0 gage) 00 gage: 0.00026 (2/0?) 000 gage: 0.00020 (3/0?) 0000 gage:0.00016 (4/0?) V=IR So, for a 1 meter total circuit length with 14 gage, and an assumed 30 amp load (mostly the pump, a bit of the wire resistance), you get a 0.25 volt drop. That's a pretty short length for a circuit. For 3 meters, it would be 3 times the voltage drop (roughly), or .75 volts. Not alot, but what if the pump output decreases greatly for that amount of voltage drop to it? Maybe rewire with #10 gage just to be safe? Oh yeah, Jim talked about his switch possibly having some kind of internal vibration issue and the current carrying capacity going down because of it. He got this info on the advice of some race car builder who had seen the cheaper switches do just that. He hasn't had the car out yet to see if th switch fix did anything for him yet. I think you might be barking up the right tree on the pump voltage issue. How much current does it draw when the car is idling and the pressure is going down? Regards, Pete

Anybody have any good rear bar options for me? The car is a early 73 240Z that did not come with the frame mounted sway bar mounts, but I couldn't use those anyway even if I had them because of my exhaust. I also have 280ZX Turbo CV halfshafts, and I hear they cause interference with the excellent Suspension Techniques bar. I hope this isn't going to be another custom thing. I have a SBC with Iron heads but everything else is light weight, and it's in the JTR setback position. FYI, I have a 1-1/8" and a 7/8" front bar to chose from, and a 3.7 LSD diff. I was thinking about using the 7/8" bar without a rear bar, or try to find a rear bar (3/4"?) to go with the 1-1/8" front. For wheels and tires, I have (Front) 17x8.5s with 235/45-17s and (Rear)17x9s with 255/45-17 Michelin Pilot SX MXX3 tires. I have coilovers and presently set up to use 225 lb/in front and 300 lb/in rear. I am thinking about shortening the stock isolator in the rear to use a 9 inch spring so that I can lower the rear rate to something like 225 or 250. I'm also probably going to go with progressive springs instead, but I'm not sure that they will work in the short length I need. Thanks for any leads, ------------------ Pete Paraska - 73 540Z - Marathon Z Project - pparaska@tidalwave.net">pparaska@tidalwave.net -

Jim Biondo is running an LSD R200 with the now NLA (no longer available) 3.15:1 gears. He had Jason at Jim Cook Racing bild it for him. Safety wired and all that. (I safety wired my own, on my stock 3.7:1 LSD out of an 88 300ZXT. Got the drilled bolts from Courtesy Nissan.) I think Myron meant low numerical, high speed when he said highest gear. Only those low end torque challenged motors need the high numerical, low speed gears - Yuck. I have 3.7:1 since that's what the LSD diff had in it when I got it. Changing the R&P was out of the question for me - I don't have the skills or tools, and it's way expensive to buy and have new R&P in for a few hundred less rpm at cruise, top end. ------------------ Pete Paraska - 73 540Z - Marathon Z Project - pparaska@tidalwave.net">pparaska@tidalwave.net -

Mike, hang in there bud. My guess is you;ll have a revelation soon as to what's up. I know how it is when these problems keep biting you. Actually, I've been considering installing a big circuit breaker in line with the battery to prevent a melt down if the big pos cable gets shorted somewhere between the relocated battery and the starter. Any ideas? I'm going through the wiring phase of my project now. I'm taking Mike Knells advice and separating the lights/horn from the engine wires. I traced every wire in the engine and dash harness. A lot of work. Hopefully, it will help me stay out of trouble too. Best of Luck, Pete ------------------ Pete Paraska - 73 540Z - Marathon Z Project - pparaska@tidalwave.net">pparaska@tidalwave.net -

I'd say this is a very germane topic, since one of histories leading "big motor in a small car" heros, Carroll Shelby is on the Board of Directors. I say this engine will see some use, unless the big automakers pull the usual "Not Invented Here" moves. Let's see. 40 lbs, 150 hp. Would that scale to 160 lbs, 600 hp? I want one! Talk about the ultimate Hybrid! I'm sure the purists would have a coronary! ------------------ Pete Paraska - 73 540Z - Marathon Z Project - pparaska@tidalwave.net">pparaska@tidalwave.net -

I first read about raising the diff from the stuff Terry Oxandale wrote, that's on the IZCC site. Check out: http://www.zhome.com/rnt/FordPower/HalfShaft.html and: http://www.zhome.com/rnt/FordPower/AlDiffUpright.html He was having trouble with blowing u-joints in the halfshafts of his lowered, V8 Z and determined that lowering the car moved the hubs up relative to the diff, causing excessive halfshaft u-joint angles, especially when the car squatted under hard acceleration. He raised the diff to alleviate that problem. So that's one reason to raise the differential - to alleviate the halfshaft angularity on a lowered, powerful Z. I did it for that reason, but then went to CV shafts, so it is less critical. The other reason is because of the JTR setup. I think that for most people's swap that follow the JTR design (1/2" spacers between the frame rails and the engine crossmember, and the JTR trans crossmember and GM trans mount), that the angle of the crank/trans output shaft is too shallow (doesn't point upward enough going from rear to front) and too low in the car, relative to the pinion centerline of the diff with the stock R200 mounting. The diff pinion angle is more nose up than the tranny output shaft centerlie angle, with JTR mounting technique, creating largely different driveshaft angles. Then there is the issue of the centerlines of the tranny output shaft and the pinion being too far apart vertically. That causes large u-joint angles front and rear. Not good. Lowering the engine with those 1/2" spacer above the engine crossmember wasn't needed in all the JTR Z's I've seen for bellhousing clearance at the top of the tunnel anyway. So I say try taking them out, and try raising the rear of the trans to raise the tranny centerline, but not causing it to be even more shallow. The diff in it's stock mounting is fairly nose up, and you want to mimic the pinion angle. If you raise the rear of the diff, the pinion angle relative to the ground is more shallow, more closely matching the tranny output shaft angle with the JTR install methods. Now my car has the Tremec, which has a different mounting pad to output shaft distance than the GM transmissions, so I had to do even more to make things work. But since so many others have had the driveline vibration and even JTR now recommends raising the rear of the diff, I think I am correct about the angles being too large and not equal on the driveshaft. Check out my page, as there is some info there on what the angle issues are in the V8Z, and what are the possibilities of fixing them. I will briefly discuss them below. First, get the angle finder from Jegs. P/N 247-5020. $23.99. Measure the u-joint angles. I used the starter mounting area of the block to measure the angle of the tranny/engine relative to the ground. You can also use the water pump mount pads, or the freeze plug opening machined surface right next to them. I had a hard time finding a good surface on the tranny. On the diff, I made sure the dirt and paint build up on the bosses that are verticle, behind the bosses for the front mount. It's a small area, so using the angle finder on it is tricky. I check that they are perpendicular to the input flange, when I had my driveshaft out. On the driveshaft, it's easy to lay the triangular groove of the angle finder against the bottom of the tube. This ought to be very close to parallel with the centerline of the driveshaft, or you are in trouble with that part. Anyway, you can check by rotating the driveshaft with it installed and check several places as it is turned, with the angle finder hanging down. From those 3 angles, you subtract or add the angles, (subtracting 90 degrees where needed) to find the relative angles between the engine and the driveshaft, and the driveshaft and the diff. They should be within a degree of each other, and be less that 4 degrees, 3 would be better. Let me know if all that wasn't clear. Regards, Pete ------------------ Pete Paraska - 73 540Z - Marathon Z Project - pparaska@tidalwave.net">pparaska@tidalwave.net -

John, Jim seems to remember the price of $1500 outright for the reworked T-5. He does not replace all the gears, as I had thought. Jim told me today that he grinds off the 1st gear from the input and counter shaft and takes 3rd gear sets from a T-5 and machines and welds them into place in the 1st gear postions of those shafts. He uses all the other Ford upgrades except going to the Ford input shaft bearing. Instead he uses a thrust roller bearing, a caged ball bearing and a thrust washer. That seems to work better than converting the GM input shaft to the Ford design. Anyway, I think I have all of this right, but Jim says the guy is very nice, so if you're interested, give him a call: Craig Liberty of Liberty Gears, (313-278-4040), in the Detroit Michigan area, I think.