mainboyd Posted October 24, 2015 Author Share Posted October 24, 2015 Well that would be because the motor is not exactly at TDC. Either way its facing the opposite direction. I'll take the distributor apart and see whats going on in there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NewZed Posted October 24, 2015 Share Posted October 24, 2015 Nah, you missed my point, which is actually your point. Don't get defensive, I'm on your side now. The rotor should point directly to the depressed side of the half-moon Yours doesn't. It's not even 180 off, it's 160 off. Nothing to do with TDC, as you said. Why haven't you taken the rotor off yet? That will tell you what you need to know. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mainboyd Posted October 25, 2015 Author Share Posted October 25, 2015 (edited) hahaha I'm sorry if I am coming off as being defensive I really didn't mean to. I haven't had time to look into anything yet. All day today I have been out and about doing some daughter and father time, the Zoo and Civil War reenactment. So I'll look into it tonight after 11pm ish when my family is all sleeping and I finally get some time alone. I am not sure what I am looking for when taking the distributor apart because I don't have one to compare to or know how one should look like but I"ll take some pics and post them up here. Oh and I have taken the actual rotor off hoping that there was a tapped hole on both sides of the shaft so I can just turn the rotor completely 180 and call it a day. Edited October 25, 2015 by mainboyd Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mainboyd Posted October 25, 2015 Author Share Posted October 25, 2015 (edited) I don't know what I am looking at... On the first picture I am pointing out what seems like something that would allow that top peace to go on one way which is on the direct opposite side of the tapped hole. Can anyone confirm that theirs is also that same way? Should I try to unscrew the phillips screw in the shaft? Edited October 25, 2015 by mainboyd Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NewZed Posted October 25, 2015 Share Posted October 25, 2015 So everything is now narrowed down to the bottom of your distributor shaft and the top, since the oil pump shaft is correct. Focus on the screw hole on the top and the half moon on the bottom. Those are what oriented the rotor to where the engineers intended it to be. The rotor will spin around to wherever without that screw. If the rotor screw is in, then the screw hole seems to be off. I tried to mark where things should be but might have "screwed" up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cgsheen Posted October 25, 2015 Share Posted October 25, 2015 The fitting that the screws goes through clamps the optical disc in place. It, and the shaft it fits over are "keyed" so that it only fits in one spot and is always in the proper orientation for the rotor. Can't be installed wrong... IF the rotor is "out of whack" (engineering term...), AND the distributor is where the fault is, THEN the roll pin in the bottom fitting is missing or sheared off. The fitting at the bottom - the one that fits over the top of the oil pump spindle - slides on the end of the shaft and is held in place (and properly oriented) by a roll pin. You can't put it on 180 degrees out-of-phase and secure it with the roll pin. The roll pin hole is offset on the shaft so, it too, only goes on one way... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mainboyd Posted October 25, 2015 Author Share Posted October 25, 2015 Cgsheen, I was looking at that when I took it apart and the roll pin is still there and looks like there is nothing wrong with it. I even tried to see if maybe the roll pin sheared, causing it to spin freely, but no. Does anyone know what that "1" is referring to on the cover plate under the rotor? Is that where the rotor should start at? maybe indicating spark #1? Well I am almost certain that the previous owner did something to the distributor if everyone else does not look like mine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NewZed Posted October 26, 2015 Share Posted October 26, 2015 Curious, since all we have out here are pictures from various angles. Is the rotor electrode 180 degrees off from the half-moon on the bottom of the shaft? Or is it some odd angle? And is it the correct rotor, with only one hole? You haven't really confirmed that the rotor is incorrectly oriented on the distributor, looking at only the distributor (forget about the drive quill in the engine). Could be that there are other rotors that will fit your distributor. Or the PO just drilled another hole to reclock the rotor. In the same vein, you could drill a new hole if you wanted to. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony D Posted October 26, 2015 Share Posted October 26, 2015 This has been covered in the archives. Directions have been given, and ignored. And that is why. You can't help people who don't want to listen. Good Luck. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mainboyd Posted October 26, 2015 Author Share Posted October 26, 2015 NewZed, The part of the rotor that sticks out is on the same side of the machined down half moon (see pic for clarification). And yes it is the correct rotor with just one hole for the screw. Tony D, hmmm I have been searching for a while and never seen a post that had the same problem and figured out what the cause was. If it has been covered before then please would you be able to provide a simple link to what you believe has been covered, if its true? I think I might just go to autozone and see how theirs looks compared to mine. They show that they have one in stock. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cgsheen Posted October 26, 2015 Share Posted October 26, 2015 I posted a reply yesterday morning but I guess it didn't take... Look closely at the pictures in the original post. Pic #3. Compare the orientation of the oil pump spindle to the FSM diagram in post #19. Ya, pretty much backwards... Oil pump spindle orientation is usually the answer to "Why is the rotor facing the wrong direction". This is a simple "It was running fine before I ______ ". If it was running fine and nothing was done to the distributor, the distributor shouldn't be the problem. In the future, look at what you did do for your answer... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NewZed Posted October 26, 2015 Share Posted October 26, 2015 I think I misdirected in Post #19. Because I misinterpreted the picture in the FSM. Had my half-moons backward. I re-oriented the pictures to make it easy but still mistook the direction of the half-moon depression in the FSM drawing. I said it was right, when it was wrong. In Post #13 the OP says he started this adventure because he couldn't set his timing. So, in sum, it seems like he reset everything 180 off. A worthy attempt, just didn't hit the mark. Probably just needed a one tooth move, to get the CAS within the adjustment range. Resetting everything, while on the compression stroke and realizing that the half-moon depression in the hole faces backward should get it done. johnc was right. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mainboyd Posted October 26, 2015 Author Share Posted October 26, 2015 So basically I was misinterpreting the picture in the manual? The half moon part that I thought was machined down was actually the other side? So is what I am pointing out in the two pics below correct? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NewZed Posted October 27, 2015 Share Posted October 27, 2015 If you mean that the two pictures are oppositely oriented, then you are correct. Your red arrows are pointing at the same thing. At a glance, the drawing right side half moon looks "bigger" , which would mean closer, therefore higher. But close examination shows that Nissan drew the edges of the raised half and tried to shade in the face. Not a great picture, really, and no words describing it, like they do in the 280Z instructions. But, in the end, it's orientation of the rotor that matters anyway. You would have been better off if you'd never seen that picture. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mainboyd Posted October 27, 2015 Author Share Posted October 27, 2015 Awesome! Thanks everyone!!! I'll set it up right now and see whats up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony D Posted October 27, 2015 Share Posted October 27, 2015 (edited) How about this: The raised part is not half the existing diameter. It's less than that. The drawing shows the raised part facing the front of the car, with the flat facing the rear of the car. The smaller drive tang is shown same as the offset cut in the 280Z and Earlier Manuals. They offset it so it was obvious which was the raised (smaller) part and which was the oil pump drive spindle (larger) side. Look at the photo shown, and the spines which if it was a straight diametrical cut would be more covered than it is. John Coffey had it dead on the first time. Additionally, if anybody read the FSM on a turbo car, there is a DOT on the oil pump and the oil pump quill shaft that you align to put the shaft into the oil pump and the assembly in the front cover. If you do that, you will NEVER be 180 out. Never. Ever. UNLESS.... You read the archives and realized a dirty secret about the oil pump drive gear on the distributor drive spindle. And in that discussion, these dynamics were extensively covered. Edited October 27, 2015 by Tony D Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mainboyd Posted October 27, 2015 Author Share Posted October 27, 2015 Yes now I remember the whole dot on the oil pump and the shaft. I think where I messed up was when I took it apart and was then just relying on setting the top end of the shaft. I don't remember but I bet when I tried to fix the timing, by turning it one tooth, the shaft probably dropped and I then tried to push it back in place when underneath, causing it to be placed 180 off (maybe and a good possibility). Basically what I needed to do was not just follow one part of the instructions but the whole thing from start to finish on setting the distributor. That would of helped clear things up about the whole end of the shaft deal. Thanks Tony D for pointing out those key points about "The raised part is not half the existing diameter." I never realized that when seeing it in person and in the book. Good to know. Thanks NewZed for not giving up on my foolish thinking and sorry to lead you into thinking there was something wrong with the distributor when it was just my human error. I thought that I would be able to get away by just making sure the top part of the shaft was correct. Anyways, the car is running again. Thanks again everyone! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NewZed Posted October 27, 2015 Share Posted October 27, 2015 But is the timing mark in the proper range now? Tony D's hints may still be in play. I learned something about the turbo engines. Win-win. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony D Posted October 27, 2015 Share Posted October 27, 2015 Hint: The dirty secret does not only apply to turbo engines! "Hardened 3mm Pin" ring anybody's bell yet? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mainboyd Posted October 28, 2015 Author Share Posted October 28, 2015 When I got it running last night the timing mark was where it was before I screwed it up, which was past the 30 mark (using timing gun). Now if it's that far off and I want to move it towards the zero mark which way would I turn the shaft? Clockwise? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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