fl327 Posted May 13, 2004 Share Posted May 13, 2004 The more I think about it, the more im thinking that an sr20 is maybe not a better choice in terms of outright power and glory, but you can theoretically log a ton more miles on them due to the fact that parts from the sr20de that came in us cars will work on the sr20det, and thats a plus for me not only do I build my cars quick, I also drive my cars an average of 88.6 miles a day while enjoying spontaneous and sometimes ridiculous shows of power acceleration cornering and stereo, and I like having noahs ark of spare parts around at all times because I am a greedy and irrational parts nazi and I dont care who knows. I bet the rb anything will kick some L28 butt, since it was inspired by the L series and given nissans history of overbuilding their products (cmon now, 8 inch ring gear in a light car that put 120hp to the wheels stock) im sure of it. With the rb engines comes with the power and the glory of having something truly special and unique under the hood of the car, that coincidentally enough, is based on the original engine of the car and (for the US guys) EXOTIC. Taking on the RB project isnt a cheap venture and you cant get parts from the junkyard, that eliminates me from the equation entirely. I would sooner do the 2jz swap before the RB just because of parts availability, I do break parts and put miles on my car. I will keep my L motor and my measly 24/7/365 300hp capabilities. Poor me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnc Posted May 13, 2004 Share Posted May 13, 2004 The L28 should easily support 800HP on the non-crossflow head Electramotive never hit those numbers with their race engines. They could do it with their qualifying engines but it was only good for a few laps. One of the guys I race with occaisionally (Tom Smith) was an engineer at Electramotive in the early 1980s. Regarding the RB vs. L28 debate - I've got a NA L28 that I'll run against any RB equipped Z at Buttonwillow or Willow Springs. FYI... Sport Compact Car ran an event called something like "Time Attack" a month or two ago at Buttonwillow. The best time was done by a completely tricked out Skyline which ran a one lap high 54.x with the a couple more 56s. Then it blew up. My 240Z running the same config at Buttonwillow ran a 55.2, 55.2, 55.3. I think the RB and the SR have reputations that far exceed their actual performance. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest vegeta Posted May 14, 2004 Share Posted May 14, 2004 did i say something wrong? sorry if i did. can somebody please inform me? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest porschephile Posted May 14, 2004 Share Posted May 14, 2004 I think the RB and the SR have reputations that far exceed their actual performance. I don't see any L series motors making 1300+hp, revving to 13k rpm or anything of that sort. The RB and SR aren't Gods gift to engines as some might think, however, the RB is one of the best motors to come out of Japan and is very robust. Don't get me wrong, I love Datsun L6's. I mean, my 93k L24 ran better than any of the other Nissans I've ever owned, and that was after sitting for 3yrs! Definitely one damn solid engine but, the rb26 has Datsun L6's beat. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest RobZZeD Posted May 14, 2004 Share Posted May 14, 2004 did i say something wrong? sorry if i did. can somebody please inform me? The L28 has a cast iron block (not Ally) just like the rb26 Both engines have an Ally head Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mack Posted May 14, 2004 Share Posted May 14, 2004 Also, keep in mind that we dont really know what lurks over in japan. there could be and probably is a few 1000hp+ L31 ETT or god only knows what hiding in some japanese garages. I seem to recall that a 3.5L L has been spotted. sleeved cylinder liners and a custom crankshaft. remember, the L series was the small block of japan before all of this newfangled DOHC stuff came out. it had a good run up into the late 80's/early 90's. It would be very interesting if we could go over to japan and see some of the crazy Z cars over there. interesting note, if the RB26 has larger headbolts, but the same spacing, it sounds like an LD28 block. but then again, the LD28 block is also taller, requiring longer connecting rods. with the larger headbolts(not near as prone to stretching) and a set of longer, more robust rods(better rod/stroke ratio) and a set of decent pistons, I wonder what the limits of the LD28 block are? McAdam Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnc Posted May 14, 2004 Share Posted May 14, 2004 I don't see any L series motors making 1300+hp, revving to 13k rpm or anything of that sort. Also, keep in mind that we dont really know what lurks over in japan. there could be and probably is a few 1000hp+ L31 ETT or god only knows what hiding in some japanese garages. I don't care about mythical engines. I look at what I race against and what I see on racetracks here on the west coast and there aren't any fast RB, SR, 2J, or V8 Zs. There's one fast Skyline but it keeps blowing up. Amir's SR 260Z may be the first fast engine swapped Z I'll see on the track around here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest vegeta Posted May 14, 2004 Share Posted May 14, 2004 the l28 has an iron block. man, i don't know why i thought it was alum. could of sworn it was. i haven't pulled the engine out of my 280 yet. its so covered in grime it could have been made out of cardboard for all i knew. he he. sorry about the mix-up. later Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest porschephile Posted May 15, 2004 Share Posted May 15, 2004 All I'm saying is don't just pass the RB off as "just another engine" or an inferior product. It has tons of potential, but is pretty expensive when you consider what could be done with an l6 for a much smaller amount of money. I guess I've been poisoned against SOHC after having my vg30e for so many years (absolutely no top end!). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(goldfish) Posted May 15, 2004 Author Share Posted May 15, 2004 The rb26 internals are much more durable for making larger amounts of power than an l28et. From what I understand, after about 350-400hp, you really need to use better bearings, head gasket, etc in an l28et. You can normally take stock rb26's to 500+ without opening them up. A metal head gasket is a good idea to do of course, however the internals are good for 600+ hp. There are many people who have pushed past 600hp with stock internals, however how long they last is anyone's guess. Although, Sean Morris as well as some other people have a number of cars pushing past the 600 mark that have lasted a long time so who knows. Either way, it isn't just the 26's head but the whole engine itself is built stronger and more durable. Yes, I guess I knew that, but I was thinking more of power potential. After new pistons,rods,ect. the L28 just doesn't seem to come close to the RB26. It seemed to me, that there must be a very important desgin change to allow that. 700hp sounds about the limit for the L28 and the RB26's limit is over 1200hp, thats a huge 500hp difference. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest porschephile Posted May 15, 2004 Share Posted May 15, 2004 Well, I don't know exact specs for every single thing on the L28 or rb26. However, I believe everything about the rb26 is just built a little stronger. By that, I mean things like block thickness, durability of the main bearing cap, etc etc. On top of that, the head flows a lot better than any l6. The stock rb26 can handle 8k rpm, though with stock cams the power drops off before that, but mild cams can give nice gains. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RB26power Posted May 15, 2004 Share Posted May 15, 2004 I don't see any L series motors making 1300+hp, revving to 13k rpm or anything of that sort. Also, keep in mind that we dont really know what lurks over in japan. there could be and probably is a few 1000hp+ L31 ETT or god only knows what hiding in some japanese garages. I don't care about mythical engines. I look at what I race against and what I see on racetracks here on the west coast and there aren't any fast RB, SR, 2J, or V8 Zs. There's one fast Skyline but it keeps blowing up. Amir's SR 260Z may be the first fast engine swapped Z I'll see on the track around here. I'd bet those RB,SR etc powered Z's your refering to, that are nothing compared to yours, most likely don't have the money/ know-how/ driver that your Z does Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stony Posted May 18, 2004 Share Posted May 18, 2004 IF they cant build an rb26 to last 3 laps on a track they plain and simply dont know what they are doing. My Z is setup for drag but before i started the backhalve it was not far from being a pretty decent track car. the way it sits right now with stock turbos @ 15 PSI puts down 392RWHP and with the right suspension tuning i bet it would have ripped up the track. It has 51 front 49 rear balance and weighed 2700LBS and that could be improved on by moving the engine back and lowering it a little. Just my 2 cents Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest porschephile Posted May 18, 2004 Share Posted May 18, 2004 Excellent point Stony! I've heard far too many people say things regarding the Rb (mostly in regards to SX swaps) and how much it "screws up handling" and "oh it must only be a drag car and definitely not for road track use because of how bad the handling will be". That's all a bunch of bs. If you set the suspension, brakes, brake balance, alignment, etc up properly then the rb will be one potent road track car in a light Z. True, it won't handle quite as good as the same basic car with a lighter engine, however it's not as drastic as everyone makes out. I think the powerband, redline, amount of power, etc capable from the rb26 more than makes up for the increase in weight. I believe many of the problems of most of the "swap" cars, when used on road tracks, has more to do with supporting mods rather than the particular engine itself. Also, many people seem to not pay attention to little details when it comes to track duty, and that is a definite cause of many of these problems. It's not like driving fast for a very short period of time on the street. Your drivetrain/powertrain is under a lot more stress, heat, pressure, etc. Many people just do not think of these things. For extended track use, I'd want LOTS of supporting/safety mods like an external oil cooler, external tranny cooler (possibly a diff cooler as well), good radiator/cooling fan setup, I'd use only the best fluids (redline, etc), and tons of other stuff. I will be doing much of this to my Z, because I am aiming towards lots of road track use (it will still be a street car though). Hopefully I can get mine setup properly and show the true potential of the rb26 in such a light chassis. It is going to take me a couple of years before I reach that point though! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Afshin Posted May 18, 2004 Share Posted May 18, 2004 From my perpsective there is no question that the RB is a superior engine to the L series, by any measure. The difference in power output is also a fact. However, there is a point of diminishing returns with increased horsepower. In other words is a 800hp car really faster than a 500hp car on a track ? As John or many many enthusiates with 110hp miatas keep proving more horsepower does not always mean more real performance. Why doesn't Ferrari make a 900Hp production car, it's not that we can and they can't, it's that it does not improve performance outside of drag racing with realy fat sticky tires. So unless the sole purpose is for drag racing, one may be able to say that while the RB engine is clearly superior, in the end, it probably can't outperforme the L series on road performance. Since I already know I can get my butt whipped by some miatas with a third the HP I have I don't qualify to offer a L vs RB challenge, but until some Rb's can consitently beat John C on the track instead of the dyno, I will hold to my arguement Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnc Posted May 18, 2004 Share Posted May 18, 2004 Ya know... (a little self serving post here) If someone wanted to, they could buy my car as a roller (no engine) and pretty much bolt in an RB26. The Quaife sequential trans has an L6 bolt pattern bellhousing. That would be apretty easy way to shut me up... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JMortensen Posted May 18, 2004 Share Posted May 18, 2004 If someone put $8000 struts on the Skyline and took it to EMI... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stony Posted May 19, 2004 Share Posted May 19, 2004 john how much do you want for the roller? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnc Posted May 19, 2004 Share Posted May 19, 2004 $18K. You can look at my for sale page (http://www.betamotorsports.com/products/rod4sale.html) and the buyer gets everything except the engine, EMS, intake, exhaust, flywheel and clutch. I might have another use for the engine. edit: I added the flywheel and clutch to the stuff I'm keeping. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest porschephile Posted May 19, 2004 Share Posted May 19, 2004 I'm impressed John! That is one nice setup you have. Just curious but, did you have a custom bellhousing made for that Quaife dog box? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.