Quick questions about bleeding the brakes...

[Guest bastaad525]

First question - is it possible to bleed the fronts w/o lifting the car and removing the wheels? I'm nowhere near my car right now so can't check myself But I'm thinking if I turn the steering wheel all the way to one side I should be able to get to the bleed valves pretty easily. Anyone ever tried this?

 

how about the rears? At all possible to bleed the rears w/o removing the tires if I just lift it on a normal jack/jackstands?

 

And lastly, about the method of bleeding... I dont know if this makes much difference. I've always thought/been taught that when bleeding brakes or clutch, you have the assistant pump the pedal like five times then hold it down on the fifth, THEN you open the bleed valve, hold it open for a few seconds, then close the bleed valve while assistant is still holding down the pedal, then repeat.

 

The Haynes manual gives a slightly different instruction, which is to open the valve and have the assistant pump the pedal repeatedly with the valve open.

 

 

Which is better, do they both work or should I only do one??

[Pop N Wood]

I think you can get to a Z's bleed valve by just turning the wheels.

 

The advantage of a two person bleed operation is you can close the bleed valve to raise the pedal thus preventing air from being sucked back into the caliper. It is a nice way to do it but not necessary. I don't have many friends so I bleed brake by myself. Put a length of clear plastic tubing over the end of the bleed valve and place the other end in a jar of old brake fluid. Loosen the bleed valve then finger turn it closed until you just start hitting resistance. You can then pump away at the brake pedal until nothing but clean fluid come out of the tube.

 

On the occasions where I do have help, I will flush the system as described above, then the last few pumps close down the bleed valve to let up the pedal.

[Cody 82 ZXT]

I don't have many friends so I bleed brake by myself. Put a length of clear plastic tubing over the end of the bleed valve and place the other end in a jar of old brake fluid. Loosen the bleed valve then finger turn it closed until you just start hitting resistance. You can then pump away at the brake pedal until nothing but clean fluid come out of the tube.

 

On the occasions where I do have help' date=' I will flush the system as described above, then the last few pumps close down the bleed valve to let up the pedal.[/quote']

 

 

I do almost the exact some thing when I do mine. One thing to add is that I always will start the motor to make sure the pedal is nice and firm while the engine is running. This may be obvious but, I wanted to add it just in case.

[DaleMX]

I use the hand held vacuum pump. Works great for a 1 man bleed. I also have used the speed bleeders on the rear. For what it's worth the drivers side rear is the longest run and should be bleed first, then the passenger side. It looks backwards but if you look at the lines you will realize that the drivers side is by far the longest run.

[Guest bastaad525]

you guys missed my main question though

 

 

I DO have an assistant (my wife). So that part is covered. What I'm wondering is the exact method I should use.

 

- method a -

With bleed valve closed, have her pump the brake pedal several times (I always say five times), then on the last pump, hold the pedal down. With her holding the pedal, I open the bleed valve for a few seconds, then close it, and she lets off the pedal. Repeat.

 

- method b - as presribed by the haynes manual. Open the bleed valve FIRST, THEN have my wife pump the brakes several times while the bleed valve is open, and on the last pump hold the pedal down and close the bleed.

 

Is there any difference to the function of either of these methods?? Does it matter which I use?

[skipzoomie]

Method "b". You should never pump the brake petal with the bleeder valves open. A piece of clear tubing placed over the valve is a good idea for two reasons. If it is long enough you can loop it up and then down to a receptical. The upward loop will visually tell you when all of the air in the system has been purged. The other reason is that it averts the mess that brake fluid on the floor and all over various parts of the car will make.

[jt1]

Remember to always close the bleeder valve before the pedal bottoms out, so fluid is still flowing out as the bleeder is closed. This prevents any air from being sucked back into the caliper.

 

John

[Pop N Wood]

Was trying to say it doesn't matter. The whole idea is to keep air from being sucked back into the caliper on the backstroke. Doesn't matter how you do it. Closing the bleed valve at the bottom of the pedal stroke, using a tube immersed in fluid, using speed bleeders (basically check valves) or using a vacuum pump will all do the same thing. The only real "trick" is partially shutting the bleed valve with the tube method. Otherwise air can leak in through the threads.

 

As far as pumping the pedal with the valves closed, that is a new one on me. Guess it might stir up the mud, but not sure what the advantage of that is.

[JMortensen]

Was trying to say it doesn't matter. The whole idea is to keep air from being sucked back into the caliper on the backstroke. Doesn't matter how you do it.

Agreed. Doesn't matter as long as you're not sucking air back in. I prefer the open and pump it method just because it takes quite a bit less time to bleed.

[tube80z]

As far as pumping the pedal with the valves closed' date=' that is a new one on me. Guess it might stir up the mud, but not sure what the advantage of that is.[/quote']

 

Actually, I'm guessing it is quite old. My dad learned this from the Army and always argued with me about using the tube immersed in fluid method.

 

My preferred method these days is speedbleeders with their nifty bleed bag. And with all the bleeders on my wilwood calipers it really helps.

 

Cary

[Guest bastaad525]

Yeah I do attach a rubber tube to the valve and immerse it in a bottle of fluid, both for cleanliness and to keep air from going back into the system. I will be carefull next time to open the valve only as much as necessary to allow fluid to start coming out and hopefully not let any air back in thru the threads. I think I'm gonna get some of those speedbleeders myself.

 

 

I dont remember where I learned the 'pump the pedal five times than hold it and open the valve' method... that's always how I've bled the clutch pedal (up til now I have NEVER bled the brakes before!) and it's worked fine for me.

[fastzcars]

You know I had a set of "Earl's Speed bleeders" . They some how plugged up and the small check valve stuck closed. I couldn't get ANY fluid past them, so I replaced them with regular bleeders and bought a " MOtive Products power bleeder" . It's a plastic cannister that you fill w/ new brake fluid and mount an adapter to the top of the master cylinder .You pump air into the canister and that forces the new fluid into the top of the MC. Once the adapter is mounted on the MC it takes like 5 mintues for each wheel to completely flush out w/ fresh fluid. It actually takes longer to clean out the Power bleeder than to use it. It's a one man job. I also used the hand held vacuum pump version, but I ran into the problem when you opened the bleeder.air would be drawn through the threads of the opened bleeder and you couldn't tell when all the air was actually out the the system. Here's a link. http://www.motiveproducts.com , http://www.p-car.com/diy/bleeder/ .

[cygnusx1]

Putting a few good strong legs into the fluid before starting the bleed process helps any bubbles that may be "stuck" to free up and get into the flow stream so they will come out with the old fluid. I learned that when I was on a pit crew for a BMW Firehawk Team.