dsommer Posted November 17, 2005 Share Posted November 17, 2005 Not that I would do this but can somebody explain: Why this would not work. Would it be dangerous? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
280Zone Posted November 17, 2005 Share Posted November 17, 2005 I was going to post NOOO!!! Don't do it. But now I see you want a logical reason. So I'll try this. With washers your wheel is no only in contact with the surface of the last washer on the stack (very little surface area even if multiplied by 4). Visually think of this. If you want to be 20 feet tall would you be more stable standing on 14 foot stilts or standing on a house? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vintage-TechZ Posted November 17, 2005 Share Posted November 17, 2005 Not that I would do this but can somebody explain: Why this would not work. Would it be dangerous? Maybe for fenderwell/wheel mock-up ONLY Dave. There's just way too much of a chance of things wiggling free when the surface tension isn't linear across the face of things . Dangerous is all I see there my friend.Don't do it or I'll visit you with a mean look on my ugly mug.lol. Use the washers to get a decent spacer needs measurement and I'll see what we can work up on the mill and lathe if there's no pre-made spacers that will work. I would think we could find some widths thicker than you need and we could save some time and simply trim them down to your specs ?? Vinny Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mario_82_ZXT Posted November 17, 2005 Share Posted November 17, 2005 Z wheels are hub centric for one, I think..... Mario Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JMortensen Posted November 17, 2005 Share Posted November 17, 2005 Wheel spacers usually aren't hub centric. Mine aren't and I've never had a problem. The problem is there isn't much surface area for the wheel to sit on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dsommer Posted November 17, 2005 Author Share Posted November 17, 2005 Like I said I would NOT do this but when I have a question I go to the source of knowledge. Armed with this information I can now explain to the Z31 owner here in town why he should REMOVE the washers from his set up. He's running a Z32 wheel on a Z31 with washers. There ya go guys, you didn't really think I was going to do this did you? VINCE! Remember twins on the way and I value my life David Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zhadman Posted November 17, 2005 Share Posted November 17, 2005 I used washers or mock-up purposes only (like Vinny said), but one thing to keep in mind: Washer thicknesses are rarely consistent and likely will not allow the wheel mounting face to remain parallel with the face of the hub/stub axle. I would err on the side of caution and say "Don't do it". *Edit* We posted at the same time. Disregard! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bjhines Posted November 17, 2005 Share Posted November 17, 2005 Early Z-car Wheels mount to the hubs via LUG-centric pattern....Think about it...there is no hub to center on in the rear...unless you remove the brake drum... It does not take a whole lot of thought on this matter to arrive at this Lug centric conclusion... About spacers.....There is an added risk to using ANY kind of wheel spacer.... The risk has more to do with bending and shear loads on the wheel studs than it does with the strength of the spacers... There is only one slip(shear) plane on a conventional hub mounted wheels...It is the interface between the wheel and the hub....The minimal amount of shear placed on this joint bears on the wheel studs in a very narrow cross section... When you add a spacer... you now have 2 slip planes that will bear on the studs at 2 different cross sections along its length...this can overlaod the wheel stud and cause it to snap under heavy load or shock....over the course of years of careful use it will eventually fail due to fatigue. With high quality factory spacers used on some cars... the spacers are machined to fit both the hub and the wheel in a hubcentric fashion..and they use 2 different sets of mounting holes so that each stud has only one shear plane bearing on it..... Even high quality spacers do not provide as much strength as a wheel mounted directly to the hub...The mounting surface of the wheels is significantly thicker and stronger than most spacers with 2 stud patterns drilled into them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnc Posted November 17, 2005 Share Posted November 17, 2005 Spacers are used all the time when road racing a 240Z. I used spacers varying in thickness from 1/8" to 1/2" to adjust the handling on the ROD for different tracks. Its a cheap and effective tuning tool. And, as stated above, the 240Z hubs are lug centric Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vintage-TechZ Posted November 17, 2005 Share Posted November 17, 2005 Like I said I would NOT do this but when I have a question I go to the source of knowledge. Armed with this information I can now explain to the Z31 owner here in town why he should REMOVE the washers from his set up. He's running a Z32 wheel on a Z31 with washers. There ya go guys' date=' you didn't really think I was going to do this did you? VINCE! Remember twins on the way and I value my life David[/quote'] Whew !!.............I thought so,lol. ...............Vinny Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillZ260 Posted November 17, 2005 Share Posted November 17, 2005 Ok, now I have a question, what's the difference between Hub and Lug Centric??? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JMortensen Posted November 17, 2005 Share Posted November 17, 2005 Lug centric means the wheel centers on the lug studs. Hub centric means that there is a cone shaped part of the hub that centers the wheel. As was pointed out already, there is no hub in the rear of a Z for the wheel to center on. So Z's are hub centric in front and lug centric in back from the factory. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vintage-TechZ Posted November 17, 2005 Share Posted November 17, 2005 Ok, now I have a question, what's the difference between Hub and Lug Centric??? Simply the way the wheels stay squared in the center mounting. Hub centric...........rests on the raised lip circle on the hub. Lug ......slips on center by way of the tight lug stud holes of the wheels. Six of one /half a dozen of another so to speak....... Vinny Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnc Posted November 17, 2005 Share Posted November 17, 2005 Originally, they are not even hub centric in front. I have a set of stock steel 14" wheels and they do not center on the hub. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rudypoochris Posted November 17, 2005 Share Posted November 17, 2005 Originally, they are not even hub centric in front. I have a set of stock steel 14" wheels and they do not center on the hub. Same. Hoenstly is doesn't seem like it matters too much between the two, or am I missing something? If the lugs are straight then it should automatically be centered around the hub and lugs and way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JMortensen Posted November 17, 2005 Share Posted November 17, 2005 No it doesn't really matter. You will occasionally come across a real anal engineer type who will tell you that your wheels are going to fall off if you don't have a hubcentric mount. Having worked on a Porsche race car that did 160+ and had 1" lugcentric wheel spacers on it with 315/35/18s in back and never seen a failure, I know where I stand on this one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnc Posted November 17, 2005 Share Posted November 17, 2005 All hub centric does is add a little more precision in matching the center of the wheel with the center of the hub. Its a way to reduce vibration. It does not add any strength to the wheel/hub/lug mounting system although from many thousands of Internet discussions, you face near certain death with lug centric wheels. EDIT: As Jon said above... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clint78z Posted November 17, 2005 Share Posted November 17, 2005 Good you clear things up like that JohnC. Spacers are perfectly fine as long as you don't go too far in or out from the factory, this can cause wheel bearing wear (most are quite durable). The reason for not using washers is the old formula Pressure=Force/Area The force is applied by tightening the wheel nuts, this is constant. If you use a tiny area like washers as opposed to full spacer the pressure applied on the washer and wheel at the washer will be sky high. The result will most likely be that the washers will dig into the aluminum and mess things up. Think of it like standing on a platform, then trying to stand on a single nail. Area distributes the load. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dsommer Posted November 17, 2005 Author Share Posted November 17, 2005 Damn you guys are GOOD!!!! I think my questions has effectivly been beaten to death. Thanks to all for your input. David doesn't run/won't run/wasn't going to run washers Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
280Zone Posted November 17, 2005 Share Posted November 17, 2005 One more wack! Don't do it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.