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AdrianZ

BMW or toyota motor

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Well here's where I'm at right now.

I found a BMW v12 with (a bad fue pump, so the guy says) so only one side works currently. he's willing to sell the motor, ecu, 4speeed auto for $900. I can mate a t56 to this motor but it's some fab work I could not do for a little while. the pros are poping my hood and having a v12 :burnout:and in time maybe having a twin turbo v12 but the con of buying 12 pistons and rods come up not to mention machine work to a v12.

 

my other option is a 4.0 or 4.3 Lexus V8 (price verys quite a lot) there are more tranny opetions for this and i think i could find a 5speed that bolts right up or buy a bell housing for 200-300 and mate a v160 to it (toyota 6 speed) the pros os this motor is that it's aluminum ( I believe) and superchargers for it can be found easy enough.

 

any ideas, suggestions, comments, rants?

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I agree with Dayz. It all depends on what you plan on doing with it. Both of those motors would push that car along very well. If It were me and I had to choose from the 2, I would go with the V12 just for the wow factor.

 

It also depends on how much fab work you are willing to do. I would imagine that there would be less involved in swapping the V8. I think there is a thread or 2 pertaining to the the V12 swap. Maybe one of those guys can shed some light on what all is involved.

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my inbox is near full from talking to chelle. He has the ferrari replica with the v12, dry sump, and T56 tranny.

I guess it comes down to the hard or harder way

the wow factor and (oh my god you are an uber fab man Adrian) of the v12

or the not as hard but still difficult way of the V8, which being a supra owner I have some experience with these motors (they have the same head layout and i know where to get parts for them)

I think the initial cost of the v8 will be a little more (unless i find the v12 with a 850 6speed). where as down the road a rebuild on the v12 will he hella expensive.

 

 

well I think I'll go with the v12. at least that's my mind set right now. things might change right before i buy a motor. you never know

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While I do not want to sound negative, skeptical or paranoid, unless someone was selling a BMW V12, ECU and 4-spd auto for $900 because it is "hot" or to get their next fix, I would be skeptical. I do not know much about the BMW fuel system either, but do think a bad fuel pump can cause one bank not to work unless each bank has an indepenent fuel pump.

 

Make certain the "WOW" is not "WOW, it is gonna cost how much to make it work?"

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seem to remember bmw v12 motors are completly computer controlled -

throttle by wire. the lil actuator motors tend to have problems aftwer awhile.

a custom intake-throttleboddies and megasquirt setup would be reccamended.

Parts would be expensive, tintake and exhuast manifold gasgkets prone to leaking I also seem to recall.

The size is about 5.0 to 5.6 liter. 2 valves per cylinder.

Easily get more bang fer buck with an chevy ls1 build.

The 12 cylinders are very smooth running however.

oil pump n pickup need to be relocated and or new frame connector made.

 

 

http://www.bmwworld.com/engines/12cyl.htm

http://www.e38.org/

 

 

was looking at buying a bmw 850 for a commute cruiser till I found out they

are made for midgets only. (nobody over 5'7" :( I am 6'4")

prolly a good thing since they take a few grand a year to maintain.

 

/babble

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While I do not want to sound negative' date=' skeptical or paranoid, unless someone was selling a BMW V12, ECU and 4-spd auto for $900 because it is "hot" or to get their next fix, I would be skeptical. I do not know much about the BMW fuel system either, but do think a bad fuel pump can cause one bank not to work unless each bank has an indepenent fuel pump.

 

Make certain the "WOW" is not "WOW, it is gonna cost how much to make it work?"[/quote']

the v12 hasa fuel pump for each bank, a distributor for each bank, and a computer for each bank, than another comuters conencting both together

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seem to remember bmw v12 motors are completly computer controlled -

throttle by wire. the lil actuator motors tend to have problems aftwer awhile.

a custom intake-throttleboddies and megasquirt setup would be reccamended.

Parts would be expensive' date=' tintake and exhuast manifold gasgkets prone to leaking I also seem to recall.

The size is about 5.0 to 5.6 liter. 2 valves per cylinder.

Easily get more bang fer buck with an chevy ls1 build.

The 12 cylinders are very smooth running however.

oil pump n pickup need to be relocated and or new frame connector made.

 

 

http://www.bmwworld.com/engines/12cyl.htm

http://www.e38.org/

 

 

was looking at buying a bmw 850 for a commute cruiser till I found out they

are made for midgets only. (nobody over 5'7" :( I am 6'4")

prolly a good thing since they take a few grand a year to maintain.

 

/babble

I feel ya man I'm 6'7"

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seem to remember bmw v12 motors are completly computer controlled -

throttle by wire. the lil actuator motors tend to have problems aftwer awhile.

a custom intake-throttleboddies and megasquirt setup would be reccamended.

 

The mechanical throttles from an 3 series 6cyl. bolt on directly to the intakes + the left and right side intakes are exactly the same with a cap on the opposit end of the throttle mounting plate, this engine is two 2.5 L6 thate shares the same crank, bmw treats both banks as separate 6cyl. engines.

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Guest turdbo

1uzfe for the win..its cheaper...less problems and people have more experience with it...its just my opinion...im a practical guy..and this seems pretty practical to me :burnout:

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I've been looking at tinkering with the BMW v12 for a while now and I have a few things that I should point out. One the engine is ALL aluminum, it doesn't even have steel sleeves! The cylinder bores are hardened and the rings ride on that. When I get around to buying one, I'm boring out the cyls and having steel sleeves put in. I much rather the rings wear out before the walls do. This will make for a longer lasting engine. Also, try going down to the local BMW dealer and getting a rebuild kit, or gasket set, or bearings. I went down and asked for spits and giggles and well, I didn't get very far. I hope your local dealer is more receptive than mine ...maybe if I go down there in a suit next time. Either way, a rebuild is going to cost big bucks. The flip side of doing all that would be to just get a low miles engine and running with it until it dies, disposable engine. It would probably be much cheaper that way. I dont know much about the toy engine so your on your own there.

 

btw, the newer v12s have the ability to go to a much larger displacement, I dont remember how much exactly but 7.0L rings a bell. Also they all have DOHC heads, which *might* bolt onto the older engines. The bmw v12 has massive amounts of potential its just that parts are so friggin expensive, if the parts were available then this engine would be a force in the performance world. Just look at what McClaren has done with it, the F1 uses the very same engine, and they are getting near 1,000hp N/A!

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Well, since I'm a Tech a BMW, if you ever need an rebuild kit, I get it at cost so, you could save a few bucks.

 

7.0L rings a bell.
That I'll have to check.

 

Also they all have DOHC heads, which *might* bolt onto the older engines.

 

The only thing though, is that these heads are equipped with vannos and Mr vannos does'nt like to be downshifted, thats why he does'nt live in any M houses.

 

We've had quit a few engines that lifted the whole vannos, valvetronic,cams, rocker.. assembly after a hard downshift (usually accidental) and THIS, costs really big bucks.

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Well' date=' since I'm a Tech a BMW, if you ever need an rebuild kit, I get it at cost so, you could save a few bucks.

 

That I'll have to check.

 

 

 

The only thing though, is that these heads are equipped with vannos and Mr vannos does'nt like to be downshifted, thats why he does'nt live in any M houses.

 

We've had quit a few engines that lifted the whole vannos, valvetronic,cams, rocker.. assembly after a hard downshift (usually accidental) and THIS, costs really big bucks.[/quote']

so i can't downshift? and i thought I saw v12s that were 5.4 liters.

I dunno the v12 is a wow factor indeed. but the toyota is tried and true.

I'd still love to build up a v12 but I'm not sure my economy is there.

 

yet it would be nice to pull up on a supra buddy and say. you got a i6? really? So do I.... Two of them!

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so i can't downshift?
Yes if you don't use the newer heads with the vanos, as it's the vanos itself that don't like downshfts,

if you use the heads that comes with the engine you'll be just fine.

 

I'd still love to build up a v12 but I'm not sure my economy is there.

 

This is entirerly true, even if you buy the engine for only 500$ you can bet it's only the tip of the iceberg.

 

For an manual tranny that fits, I know that there are some manual tranny that were issued in totaly naked versions of the 750 in saudit arabia so, they do exist.

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Hi, just reread my reply up there, don't know why but, I mistakenly said vanos instead odf valvetronic witch is varable lift. I think I was working on a faulty vanos system a the time and was probably thinking about 2 thing a the same time as ususal. Sorry for the wrong info.

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