Rota RB/RB-R, 4x114.3, 17", Z-Offset Wheels

[texis30O]

I thought that these were going to fit without using a flare............

[BobbyZ]

I thought that these were going to fit without using a flare............

 

First post says they will most likely (100%) require fender rolling or flares

[Gollum]

umm... yea, you'd be lucky to fit any rim this wide without any flare.

 

My shots prove the offset is about as pefect as it gets though. No spaces needed to keep from rubbing, and as long as you only used about 2 inches of suspention travel I guess you could get away without using a flare...

[rudypoochris]

Heres the news:

 

1. For the people wanting the RB style just like the prototypes (3" lips front and rear), they are ready to go into production right away. Simply email the representative (Kim Bong) at KIMCOSMIC@JUNO.COM. Let him know your on the HybridZ group buy and want the RB style. Please do specify if you want 17x9.5" all around, or 17x9" front and 17x9.5" rear. These wheels SHOULD clear the socket for stock lug nuts. If they do not, Rota recommends running "tuner" lug nuts as that is their standard. Sorry guys, there wasn't much I could do about the bolt holes - at the same time though, it shouldn't be an issue for most (unless you have larger lug nuts like me). As for production time, "in as soon as a month" was the time estimate I was given. That being said, expect 3-7 weeks.

 

2. The RB-R will go into production and will feature the deep dish style. The bolt holes will accommodate 30mm diameter sockets and there will be at a minimum 1.25" of brake clearance from the hub mounting surface. I am writing a document tonight that basically lays out the specifications for these wheel as crystal clear as possible. I will ask the manufacturer to remove as much weight as they deem safe as well. Manufacturing time will be known to me sometime tomorrow or the day after.

 

3. This is the bad news. Unfortunately the RB deep dish style will not be an option on this group buy. The representative believes it to be simply too large an investment/risk to make another 2 molds (that will have put us at 8 total, so I can understand where he is coming from). I naturally inquired as to what it would take to have an RB deep dish made and the answer is another 25 sets. That is about the worst news possible. I am terribly sorry for those of you who had their eyes set on the RB deep dish. Hopefully if all goes well and a decent number of these wheels are sold (so the representative gains a bit more confidence) I can help coordinate a future buy on the RB deep dish. Once again - terribly sorry guys.

 

We have a mix of good and bad news here. All in all though it is great that production can start right away on one of the two styles. Stay tuned for the RB-R.

 

As for 9.5" on all fours being an option. It most certainly is! Please though tell the representative if that is what you want (and likewise for the 9" front and 9.5" rear setups). I do believe the 9.5" -19 will fit on the front fine in respect to the T/C rod, perch, and frame rails. The only real possible issue I see is interference with the air dam, but that still may be unlikely.

[rudypoochris]

On brake clearances - the JSK Wilwood setup protrudes ~.5" to .75" from the face of the wheel mounting surface. Stock brakes do not protrude at all. Other brake setups I am unsure of. Thus I have specified a minimum of 1.25" to provide a safety margin and flexibility. I decided 1.25" was a satisfactory compromise between brake clearance and wheel dish.

 

EDIT: The specifications for the wheel buy have been sent!

[rudypoochris]

Maybe send a Pic of the watanabes you want to "copy" or is that against rules?

 

Brilliant suggestion. I will include it.

 

I am terribly sorry about the outcome of the deep dish RB's. I know you really had your heart set on them. Hopefully if all goes well, and these RB-R's take off, we (HybridZ) will have more buying power with the representative. I think inevitably what will happen is that the RB-R deep dish will sell much more than the RB standard dish which might lend us the upper hand in getting the RB deep dish. That is all in the future though. Once again - I apologize. I am really hoping these RB-R's come out great and that you receive sets of wheels you enjoy.

[rudypoochris]

This is awesome as I really like the way these rb's look. But I'm having a hard time finding a picture of these rb-r's, maybe you can post a picture. Also are center caps included?

 

Center caps ARE included. The Rota RB-R is basically the same as the RB, but the spokes are flatter. I will search for a picture that shows the difference well. It is quite difficult to notice the difference on the more common 15" and 16" sizes.

 

EDIT: Post #23 details the difference quite well. Unfortunately the poster got the two wheels mixed up. The RB - which we just received (the prototypes that are now going to production) are the ones with more curvature to the spokes. The RB-R's are the ones with the "flatter" looking spokes. They both look great imho, but if we are going to pick up more dish we might as well go the distance on the Watanabe R-Type duplication and get the correct spoke design.

http://forums.hybridz.org/showthread.php?t=123531&page=2

[panachedk]

okay, so this has been a lot of reading, if i missed it im sorry, whats the final price with the -13 and -19? is it the 950 shipped?

[rudypoochris]

okay, so this has been a lot of reading, if i missed it im sorry, whats the final price with the -13 and -19? is it the 950 shipped?

 

No sir, $750. No extra cost - in fact back in December I was told same price or $25 less per set. Realistically though, prices tend to go up and not down.

 

I can't seem to find out how to delete that poll.

[rudypoochris]

Is it safe to say that the RB's (the ones available now) will have the greatest chance of fitting brakes, but the RB-R's will likely weigh slightly less?

 

Mark

 

Yes. I have specified 1.25" behind the spoke to the face of the wheel mounting surface. You should be able to check that distance using a tape measure on your own car. The RB-R will hopefully be lighter and of a deeper dish. I will let you all know if the specifications are do able as soon as the rep. gets back to me (I don't see why they wouldn't, but one never knows).

 

So say we signed up originally for this group buy, but want to wait for the RB-R's. Is that going to upset Rota as they invested money in the tooling of these RB's? I'm just worried that Rota won't do the RB-R's if they don't sell 25 sets of the RB's like this group buy promised to do for them..

 

Justin

 

It should not upset Rota. At least that is how I understand it. That is why Rota is unwilling to do another 4 molds (RB deep and RB-R deep front and rear) but they are willing to do another 2 (RB-R front and rear) if it makes us happy.

 

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I just called the representative. He has let me know that the design specifications have been forwarded to manufacturing. They should let us know in the next day or two approximately how long it will take and if there are any necessary clarifications and edits. The final specifications which were sent to the rep. who forwarded them to manufacturing is below:

 

http://www.autolounge.net/Rota RBR.doc

[rudypoochris]

Personally I'm primarily interested in the straighter spoke profile. I think the dish is sufficient for my taste as is.

 

What is the lead time on the RB-R profile with the current lip?

 

Regards,

Justin

 

A run of the RB-R straight spoke profile with 3" lip is not planned unfortunately. Only the deep lip RB-R will be making it to production (besides the RB's of course). That being said, I have no clue how deep the lip will actually be... it might not be much deeper at all due to the brake clearance specification and since the spokes no longer bend which was providing more lip. At the rear it should be significantly deeper though as I requested offset to be changed by moving the center section inwards and outwards rather than merely adding material to the back of the mounting surface.

[rudypoochris]

I'm part of the original 25 persons who joined the group buy. Just to clarify, if I am happy with the current molds (Standard RB with 3" lip, 17" X 9" -13 offset and 17" X 9.5" -19 offset) can go ahead and email Kim with my order?

 

Julius

 

Yes sir. Go ahead, also make sure to specify if you want the 17x9" front or 17x9.5" all around.

[rudypoochris]

is it possible to order a smaller size then that given for the front

 

I would imagine so. Contact the representative with this question. There should be a 17x8.5" +4 IIRC. You will probably need to run a spacer for that wheel.

[rudypoochris]

On the clearance versus dish size I doubt you will get much, to be honest. I personally think that the specifications for brake clearance can be a bit ambiguous. 1.25" from the plane of the mounting surface... how far out (radially)? All the way to the body of the wheel? Can you sheck the existing samples to see how they play out? By telling them that they must have 1.25" all the way out PLUS you want straight spokes PLUS you want a big dish.... sounds like the motorsports trifecta; cost, speed and reliability. I would love to be able to attain this, but I am not sure you will get much.

 

RS-Watanabe R-Types feature ~.75" of clearance at I do not know what distance from center. I have specified 1.25" at 7.5" from axis of rotation. This will give us a bit of a safety margin at the expense of some dish. We will not have the same amount of dish as the Watanabe's... but we will have more than the prototypes AND the rears will have more dish than the fronts (ie. staggered), which is a significant difference compared to the way is is now.

 

I am glad you are happy - I just can't wait until these wheels come in.

[rudypoochris]

For those of you thinking about tires... This is what I have done:

 

Fronts 255/40/17 BFG KD from tirerack.com currently on close out. Cost me $384 shipped for the pair:

 

http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tires.jsp?tireMake=BFGoodrich&tireModel=g-Force+T%2FA+KD&partnum=54YR7GFTAKDL&partnum=54YR7GFTAKDR&vehicleSearch=false&index=0&fromCompare1=yes&place=0&leftTire=54YR7GFTAKDL&rightTire=54YR7GFTAKDR

 

Rears 275/40/17 BFG KD from ebay.com cost me $301 shipped for the pair - corresponded with seller, these tires were manufactured in 2007 and have no miles on them, BFG sticker still on tread... waiting for these to arrive now:

 

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/275-40-ZR-17-2-BFGOODRICH-G-FORCE-T-A-KD-TIRE-C-O_W0QQitemZ350041669101QQihZ022QQcategoryZ66475QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

 

Total was $685 to my door for a set of tires that usually cost ~$1100 shipped. Just food for thought. These tires pull ~.99g in tirerack.com survey on a BMW 325i.

 

Just some food for thought and a tip based on too many hours reading tire reviews and tests.

 

EDIT: BFG KD rear link updated. The seller has 35 pairs of these, brand new.

[rudypoochris]

The time estimate on the RB-R molds is approximately 2 months. The rep. believes ~3 months until we can receive those wheels. That is a long wait, so I do understand that it is indeed frustrating. At the same time though there is the RB option for those of you wanting something now.

 

Sorry about the semi-bad news (time wise), but essentially we are getting two wheel styles with two different sizes (front and rear) all for the price of one. The representative has really helped us out in this respect. The choice is up to you guys, wait it out for the RB-R or order the RB. Either of the two should be a fantastic wheel. The RB style has really grown on me a lot as well. I would be quite content running it myself, but I think I will go for the RB-R since I am not time constrained and I like the staggered look and the possibility of a lower weight.

 

For those of you wishing to order the RB-R, I would highly advise waiting to contact the representative until we are farther along with the molds and closer to production. I would hate for there to be some kind of confusion in where someone got the wrong wheel (RB instead of RB-R for instance). Stuff like that should not happen, but in reality it can. Just a thought.

[Gollum]

We'll be taking more pics this saturday on my stock suspension 280Z, so people can get a better idea of what the car will look like with a full set.

 

I'll let chris correct me if I'm wrong, but there should be PLENTY of room for the stock brakes

 

And it seems as though you won't need to run coil overs, at least in the front. I have no doubt the 9 inch rim would fit in the rear just fine, we'll see about the 9.5 in the rear on saturday.

 

I think it'd be sweet to see these things run on a completely stock suspension, allowing pretty much anyone who wants to run some small flares to run these rims.

[rudypoochris]

I will get the rear fitment done with Gollum on the 29th. It should not be an issue. The wheels definitely clear with coil overs. As this is a Watanabe duplicate offset I doubt it will cause problems, but one never knows.

 

As far as the S12W brakes and these wheels... You may need to do some grinding to get it to work. Reason being that the S12W is sooo close to the mounting surface, despite not protruding much. At the same time it might be completely fine. That is something I cannot test since I no longer have S12W's... they DID interfere with my 16x8 +10 Rota Grids, but I only needed minimal grinding on the caliper or a 5mm or so spacer.

 

------

 

After much consideration and numbers crunching, I have changed the brake specification from 1.25" clear at 7.5" from rotation to .875" clear for the up and coming Rota RB-R. Reason being that I was alerted dish/lip would barely increase if otherwise. For people who do end up having interference at this new dimension, I will provide spacers free of charge. For reference Wilwood's front and rear stick out ~.5". Watanabe R-Types have ~.75" clearance. This should be a safe dimensions, but I just thought I would let you guys know.

 

In either configuration I suspect (after owning a set) that S12W's will be an issue. I will provide spacers if that makes them fit, but there is a possibility no spacer under 10mm will work. I will do all that I can to help you guys modify your setups to fit if necessary.

 

Additionally the rep. has let me know that for the Rota RB they will be drilling the socket bores to 30mm so larger lug nuts and odd shapes are no longer an issue.

[rudypoochris]

Ah, that's not good. I have brand new S12+8's. So these may not fit? Or just the fat, vented S12W's?

 

Not sure in all honesty. If you don't mind measuring the protrusion I could tell you right now.

 

Measure the distance it protrudes from the mounting surface and then measure the distance from axis of rotation the protrusion is at.

 

I will know much more after inspecting my Rota Grids and comparing them to these if there is an issue.

[rudypoochris]

ive heard that running spacers isnt a good idea....and i would have to get different/longer studs right?

 

Depends on the thickness. I think we are actually probably okay on intereference with S12W's thinking back on where it was touching. Like I said, I will measure my Rota Grid's. If there was a spacer it wouldn't be more than 5mm anyway, but still. No spacer is better than any spacer (naturally). I don't believe it is an issue.

 

I just hope that we could fit these with s12s cause i dont trust the stock brakes at 100+mph on the street or slower than that having to stop quickly...

 

I hope so too. I hear stock brakes are pretty good. For the price it made more sense for me to go with JSK's Wilwood kit, piecing it together myself. I think it is quite superior to the Toyota S12W stuff it replaced. Then again I have never actually driven my car so...

 

But then again if i had to add a spacer and longer studs for the brakes then that should take the lowering out of the question....

 

I am not sure this statement makes sense. Please clarify. How would longer studs and spacers effect lowering? Lowering will eventually effect clearance for the tire anyway. Also, if there is a spacer, which there probably won't be... it would not be so thick that longer studs would be needed.

 

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I have been in contact back and forth with the representative and the factory trying to make sure they understand the specifications (in particular the lip/dish and offset adjustments with out adding material to the back side) and are willing to make the wheel as proposed. I will keep you all posted.