How to connect wires?

[Lazeum]

The way wires are connected under the hood in my 240z needs to be improved.

So far, there's some plastic caps with internal thread which clamp wires togother. It works but for how long? It looks awkward + I am sure there're better solutions. I need your ideas

 

This is how my setup looks currently it's messy and not very organised.

 

 

What do you suggest?

- I can solder them (I've heard that wires should never be soldered in car)

- Buy some regular clamps for 2 wires but I can attach 2 wires at the same clamp.

- Other solution?

 

If you have some pictures, please show me

[JSM]

Who says you shouldn't solder wires in a car? How can that hurt?

 

Go to wal-mart and get their cheap connectors package in the automotive section. Butt splices:

[Six_Shooter]

Wire to wire connections should ONLY be soldered in a car.

 

I work with automotive electrical for a living, and all of my wire to wire connections are soldered.

 

I've seen people use other forms of connection and all fail but soldering.

 

I NEVER use but connectors, while they work, they provide a high(er) resistance path for a wire to wire connection than twisting and soldering does.

 

Get rid of that Marette, ASAP, those are one of the worst types of connections to use in a car, only one worse is twisting alone, without insulating (I've seen that too). Marettes are meant to be used in a house, not a car that moves, and goes through heat cycles much more often than a house does.

[jerryb]

I agree...solder is the way to go. If you need connectors buy Weathertight. (I thinks thats the correct name). They are as good as the OEM connectors.

[Lazeum]

It's good to know that wires should be soldered. I'm pretty sure I've read different stories somewhere on the net. I'm going to look for them.

 

Regarding the connectors (Weathertight), I'm also going to look for them. I had no luck with Google (in 5 minutes) to find any info yet.

 

Then the Marette, That's an ugly solution I need to fix for sure... I don't like it neither (it bought the car with it)

 

Thanks guys for your inputs

[jerryb]

ebay has them

 

http://search.ebay.com/search/search.dll?from=R40&_trksid=m37&satitle=weathertight&category0=

[jerryb]

Try weather pack .......another name. This supplier sells kits and individual conncectors,,,,,,

 

http://search.stores.ebay.com/MJM-National-Inc_weather-pack_W0QQfciZ6QQfclZ4QQfsnZMJMQ20NationalQ20IncQQfsooZ2QQfsopZ3QQsaselZ3624523QQsofpZ0

[Lazeum]

ebay has them

 

Awesome, thanks a lot

 

I've seen this link

http://www.weatherpack.com/weatherpackfaqs.html

 

Napa might carry them, I'll give a shot tonight

[Six_Shooter]

MSD also has those connectors, but looks to be cheaper per unit to buy those kits.

 

I think I just might have to invest in one of those.

[jerryb]

When I bought them I picked up individual components. Seperate pins. plugs and all....it was way cheaper. Dont forget to pick up one of those tools that releases the pins. I miswired one headlight and having that tool made correcting my screw up a breeze

[ktm]

Think before you solder! Make sure that if you are connecting subharnesses or wires that are soldered to a device that you join them using connectors and not butt splices or solder. You want to be able to remove the subharnesses/devices without having to cut the wires.

[hughdogz]

Now I have to throw in my $0.02 (even though I'm still an amature).

 

I've used probably 20-30 weatherpacks so far. To crimp these correctly, you need a special crimping tool and the removal tool like Jerryb mentioned is really handy. Also, the terminals and seals come in 18-20ga, 14-16, 10-12, etc. Be careful what you order because the terminals cannot be re-used. As KTM said, use these in places where you might need to disconnect a sub-harness.

 

As far as juction resistance goes, I don't think there is much difference between soldered versus crimped, as long as they are both good quality. Not sure if this is true, but I heard they don't allow soldered joints on aircrafts. I believe what it really comes down to is how strong the connection is (and how well it is sealed to protect against corrosion). You want try to avoid 90 degree soldered junctions. If you do solder, double wall shrink tubing is really good. It will stiffen the wires and the junction keep movement to a minimum.

 

Uninsulated butt connectors used with double wall shrink tubing has much better strain relief than insulated butt connectors. Ring terminal connections are less prone to vibration and less likely to get pulled out than push-on spade terminals. I'm also guessing that with a butt connector, you can crimp a really good compressive stress in the terminals and it would have a little less resistance than between pushed-on terminals.

 

Other great tools are those screwdriver-looking continuity testers and 12V testers.

 

Hope this helped...

 

[Edit: There is also "friction tape" that is much better than regular electrical tape. It doesn't have adhesive, you stretch it on and it holds and is even semi-reuseable.]

[Lazeum]

Thank all for your advices.

I'm going to order some connectors, I would like to be able to disconnect anything if needed.

The friction tape is a good tip I did not know about it.

 

I'm going to clean the mess under my hood soon

[bjhines]

I too use low voltage connectors for a living.

 

I solder most of the connections I use.. but there are times where solder can hurt you. Solder is important for low voltage signal paths(~1mV)... But it is not required for reliable operation of higher voltage connections(>5V). Solder is a superior conductor as long as it is used correctly.

 

Solder issues include:

Burning the insulation on the wires. This hardens the ends and can result in premature failure under strain.

Excess flux can wick into the wires. This also hardens the wire, weakening it.

Excess solder can wick into the wires also leading to early failure under strain.

Excess solder can foul pins and sockets on connectors, making it impossible to properly connect them.

Improper flux can cause corrosion of the wires over time. Stay away from the plumbing hardware supplies.

Soldering wires that are being used with binding posts and/or clamping type connectors(Phoenix connectors) is not reccommended. These connectors need flexible(multistrand) wires to properly bind them. Single strand(or tinned ends) will not work in these connectors.

 

Where you do use crimp type connections they must be sealed from moisture. But this really applies to most any connector even if the pins and sockets are soldered, the connection between them can still be fouled.

 

There are several types of common connectors. I can't get into them all, But most require special crimping tools and pin removal tools.

 

 

Weatherpack:

I have some issues with the GM Weatherpack connectors. The very idea that GM can make useful electrical components is beyond me. GM makes consistantly unreliable electrical components. Who ever thought that GM weather-pack connectors were worth using on ANYTHING except electrical-gremlin prone GM vehicles.

 

but seriously...

The connector bodies allow a lot of dislocation of the pins and sockets in the housing. They can jam and get deformed VERY easily.

The material the pins and sockets are made of is very thin. The pins can easily be deformed. The sockets are not stiff enough to provide a positive connection to the pin. Besides, the pins would just crush down if the sockets had any more grip on them.

 

This one is screwed up from the SPAL PWM fan controller I just purchased. The middle pin has been crushed at the SPAL factory. Keep in mind that they sell pins to use up to 10gauge wire. I'll be damned if that little sheet foil pin is good for high current.

 

 

 

 

 

On to the GOOD stuff.

 

I prefer the AMP connectors. They are all ROUND connectors. They have durable pins and sockets made from heavier guage brass. The connector bodies fit the pins and sockets well so there is little chance of jammed pins. The pins fit tightly into the sockets, ensuring a good connection.

 

 

 

These connectors also have sealed versions. They are expensive. They do require a special crimping tool unless you are soldering the pins and sockets. I used solder for all of mine. They will accept wires up to 14G, so they are not suitable for high current applications. Keep in mind that their pins and sockets a FAR superior to the GM Weatherpack connectors. Yet they do not allow room for more than 14guage wire. Go figure....

[Careless]

hey bjhines, the amp connectors come in a lot more sizes and pin configurations... some with 10g and 14 + 16g mixed too. even a certain distance from the others to prevent any combating frequencies from altering signals, even though they're built well enough that it doesn't require it much (but they do it incase, lol why not! the room is there sometimes).

 

do you have a source that you buy from that only sells one?

[bjhines]

Yes... Only one type locally available in many sizes.

I have ordered the metal-bodied versions before, and I have seen the specialty pin configurations in the catalog. As I recall, I had to order the various pins individually. The connectors I use come bagged with everything I need to assemble them. I have a couple of different crimpers and pin removal tools. But that also becomes a problem. More pin sizes requires more tools

 

I segregate the high current wires from the rest of the bundle. It never presents a problem using the locally available connectors. Most of the wires I bundle are 16g or smaller.

[Careless]

yep, i plan on doing the same with all the wiring in my car.. it will add a couple of pounds, but I think it will be worth the peace of mind.

 

the pins are bloody expensive though.

 

 

ABOUT SOLDERING:

 

a lot of electrical technicians will tell you that cars are to be butt-crimped rather than soldered in terms of wiring, due to the fact that copper wire crystalizes with the tin/lead mix in solder during it's heat cycle.

 

HOWEVER, that's only because most people don't know how to solder properly. When you clip some length off of a wire, use that clipping to *tin* the wire and test for flexibility using two pairs of needle nose pliers. While tinning the wire, use caution in the heat of the iron, and if it's REALLY hot (40W or higher) then do an on-off application with the tip of the iron to minimize crystallization.

 

crystallization of the copper/lead/tin will lead to poor vibration resistance, and will start to develop cracks and break sooner or later.

 

It's best to use a variable heat range iron.

Also, don't use plumbing flux, most of it is corrosive and would end up eating the insulation completely over a number of years.

[bjhines]

Neato.. I didn't realize there was a crystallization issue with the soldered connections. It makes sense. I have seen a great many soldered connections fail under strain. This is much less likely to occur with crimped connections. I think the key is to properly encase and support soldered connections.

[Six_Shooter]

I use a single heat soldering gun (well it's a dual heat range, but only ever use the highest setting), and have never experianced a failure or solder connection failure or breakage problem with the thousands of connections I've made, you lose count after so many.

 

I do agree that many people don't flow the solder properly, but it's not usually a problem with a single heat setting being used, but that it wasn't hot enough to get the solder to flow out.

 

I use Weller solder guns, model 8200 to be exact. I have used these guns for years, I usually go through one a year. I have tried a couple others, but these ones seem to work best for the automotive electrical that is most commonly done. There are times when I need to break out the propane torch to solder the terminal lugs to the 4AWG+ wire, but that's pretty rare.

 

I also agree that using plumbing solder is the worst idea, I've had to repair many installations where someone previous has attempte dto solder with plumbing solder.

[bjhines]

I invested in Weller Irons. I can pick them up locally and parts are readily available. They range from 5W to 25W. The big iron is for stained glass work and is old as hell(judging by the braided wire jacket). It may be 200W, I dunno, I got it at a tool/yard sale. I use the Panavice brand vices and clamps. I also have a "HandyHands" mini vice with alligator clip arms. I Dont use torches at all. I do have a "Dragon" mini torch, but it is out of fuel and never comes out of the box anyway.

 

 

 

I tend to make my own lugs to suit the various-sized, heavy-guage terminals.

 

 

A large guage wire mostly prepped for soldering. I crimp the ends with large aircraft cable crimpers.

 

 

Completed termination, there are many steps to this kind of work.

 

 

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