bjhines Posted July 31, 2008 Share Posted July 31, 2008 I figured some people might like to see what I came up with for my oil system. I was just going to leave it alone, screw a filter on the block, and be done with it. I tend to jump in the deep end with most things, this got a little crazy for a Time-Trials track car. This is still in mock up stage. I still need to remove everything and flush out every hose and seal many of the NPT fittings. I have applied most of the thermal insulation but there are still some short end covers waiting for final assembly. The hoses and fittings are all AN-10 stainless braid from Summit Racing. I have not actually measured the amount of oil the system will hold, but here are some guesses. The engine has a 6 quart pan The full-size filter holds 1 quart The Accusump holds 3 quarts The oil cooler might hold 1/2 quart The thermal bypass housing holds 1/3 quart The hoses, tee and fittings might hold another 1 quart. maybe more though... I figure there are at least 12 quarts of oil in this system. That is 3 GALLONS!!!! I very seriously doubt I will be able to change more than 8-10 quarts by discharging the accusump, draining the pan, and changing the filter. I decided to use an Accusump from Canton Racing Products. They offer several sizes. I used the 3 quart model. I used the Canton band-clamp mounts and bolted them to the passenger side rocker rail. Since I remotely mounted the Accusump cylinder on the passenger floor, I decided to move the Air/Precharge pressure gauge to a visible location near the center cluster. Manual valves are typical for racing applications but I wanted something a little more high tech. I chose their electric EPC valve with the 30 PSI switch. I have a dash mounted toggle switch to disable the unit, otherwise it operates without driver control. There are several warning indicator lights for the accusump as well as 2 different beepers. The Electric EPC system works like this... The Ignition circuit feeds power to the dash mounted switch. There is a multi-color LED above the dash switch. This is routed to the EPC valve mounted on the Accusump end cap. 1. The light is green when the unit is enabled and full. 2. The light turns bright blue and a LOW-tone beeper sounds whenever the unit operates. ie. pressure drops below 30 PSI. 3. The light turns red and a louder HIGH-tone beeper sounds when the oil pressure in the engine block drops below 7 PSI. There is also a very bright light in the Tachometer housing for the LOW pressure warning below 7 PSI. The Accusump is plumbed into the oil inlet port to the block, close to the engine oil inlet. There is also a check valve to force flow towards the engine inlet. The hose on the left runs to the Accusump. The hose on the right is from the cooler/filter returning oil to the block. The bottom hose runs directly to the engine block adaptor. That covers the Accusump hookups... next the cooler and remote filter. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bjhines Posted July 31, 2008 Author Share Posted July 31, 2008 Now for the Oil cooler and associated parts. The oil cooler I decided to use is the B+M Hi-Tech cooler with a 9.5" fan http://store.summitracing.com/partdetail.asp?autofilter=1&part=BMM%2D70297&N=700+4294924500+400004+4294854215+115&autoview=sku The cooler has 1/2" NPT ports and is a stacked plate design with 14 rows. I decided the fan was needed because of the stalled air-flow in the front clip of the car. Otherwise I would need more ducting for the oil cooler. The Fan must be mounted behind the cooler(non reversable), and the cooler must be mounted so that it will purge air. In addition, the cooler has a thermal switch mounted in the inlet header. The switch must be on the inlet side to get hot enough to activate at the preset 175 degrees. I also insulated the switch and the entire inlet header to make sure that the switch will activate when it is supposed to. Here is a pic of the cooler mount. It is rubber isolated and it is spaced away from the radiator. The oil system begins with the Block adaptor. This is the engine block, spin-on adaptor I used with 1/2" NPT ports. http://www.pegasusautoracing.com/productselection.asp?Product=1230 I needed to use a street elbow from the hardware store so the oil hoses would not interfere with each other. The brass street elbow has a nice radiused passage that I cleaned up with some porting tools and a die grinder. It is clocked just enough to allow the adaptor to be removed without changing the angle on the elbow. The engine oulet hose runs forward and up to the inlet side of the remote oil filter. This is mounted at an angle to allow easy removal of the spin on filter. It is very close to the frame rail. The filter outlet hose runs forward through the front clip to the "hot" side of the thermal bypass housing. This is a Mocal unit with Male AN-10 ports and a very high flow capacity. http://www.pegasusautoracing.com/productselection.asp?Product=1226 It is located next to the Oil cooler in the front clip of the car. It is mounted at a slight angle to allow the hoses to relax to the minimum bend radius with the short runs. The mount is also somewhat flexible and allows the housing to rotate freely a few degrees. The oil is returned to the engine via a long hose that runs to the firewall, though a check valve, and to a Tee. The Tee allows oil to flow to the engine or to/from the Accusump. You might have noticed a fair amount of insulation on the various hoses and wires. I have also covered the braided steel hoses with Nylon braid to prevent them from sawing everything in the car to pieces. ... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bjhines Posted July 31, 2008 Author Share Posted July 31, 2008 Next, Gauges and senders. I have a few pics of the various senders I used. Temperature sender in the oil pan. Oil pressure sender and low pressure warning switch. I used a steel short nipple(for strength) with a brass tee, and a 1/8" NPT hose. The sender-can is held in a conduit clamp. I lined the clamp with rubber and used a jam nut to hold proper tension and angle. The sender seems to find ground through the high pressure hose braid. If I have any trouble with ground I will simply remove the rubber on the clamp. This is the water temp sender on the intake. The thermostat housing contains the SPAL fan-controller sender. The dash gauge should read actual engine temps and the SPAL fan controller will get open thermostat temps. ... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A. G. Olphart Posted July 31, 2008 Share Posted July 31, 2008 ... Manual valves are typical for racing applications but I wanted something a little more high tech. I chose their electric EPC valve with the 30 PSI switch. I have a dash mounted toggle switch to disable the unit, otherwise it operates without driver control. There are several warning indicator lights for the accusump as well as 2 different beepers. The Electric EPC system works like this... The Ignition circuit feeds power to the dash mounted switch. There is a multi-color LED above the dash switch. This is routed to the EPC valve mounted on the Accusump end cap. 1. The light is green when the unit is enabled and full. 2. The light turns bright blue and a LOW-tone beeper sounds whenever the unit operates. ie. pressure drops below 30 PSI. 3. The light turns red and a louder HIGH-tone beeper sounds when the oil pressure in the engine block drops below 7 PSI. There is also a very bright light in the Tachometer housing for the LOW pressure warning below 7 PSI. The Accusump is plumbed into the oil inlet port to the block, close to the engine oil inlet. There is also a check valve to force flow towards the engine inlet. The hose on the left runs to the Accusump. The hose on the right is from the cooler/filter returning oil to the block. The bottom hose runs directly to the engine block adaptor. That covers the Accusump hookups... next the cooler and remote filter. BJ, thanks for showing your install! I've been considering an electric valve, but even after a call to Canton (thick skull here) don't understand why the EPC valve is such a hot ticket. Yes, the accumulator holds max pressure until the discharge set point is reached (rather than just following engine oil pressure up and down), but I don't see how the accusump will fill any more quickly with EPC than with a bare valve, as the valve is in series with the EPC. The valves seem to be the same; any idea why/how they could fill more quickly (suitable for racing) with the EPC? <> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Careless Posted July 31, 2008 Share Posted July 31, 2008 all that and a fram filter :-/ why not a stainless cartridge tru-filter with a magnafilter attached to it or something? awesome setup though. do you think temps will increase greatly due to radiator blockage? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mayolives Posted July 31, 2008 Share Posted July 31, 2008 John, All your work looks very nice. Tic..Tock...........Let's get that thing together soon. We need another zzzzzzzzmonster in the paddock. Any chance you will have ut ready for the THSCC event at CMP? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bjhines Posted July 31, 2008 Author Share Posted July 31, 2008 It should be operable for the CMP event. I hope. The Fram filter is for mockup. I will run a WIX or Purolator or Mobile1 with 3 gallons of HD Rotella oil. The Electric EPC valve and switch combo has some hysteresis built in. there is a 30PSI activation pressure and a higher closure pressure. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikelly Posted July 31, 2008 Share Posted July 31, 2008 John, I like this write up... Reminds me I need t doublecheck my electronic valve to see what pressure it was set at when I bought it... I want to say it was much lower than 30PSI... Careless I'll run a cheap filter on mine for breakin... I have the Canton canister type filter for when I'm running the car at regular oil change intervals (Every other track weekend), but why waste a $30 insert on a 30 minute run in session? Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jt1 Posted July 31, 2008 Share Posted July 31, 2008 Looks nice John! I hope you get it to the track soon, I'm looking forward to seeing it. John Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grumpyvette Posted July 31, 2008 Share Posted July 31, 2008 LOOKs NICE! I got a chuckle about the FRAM filter, I started to say something about "what the #$%%^^ was he thinking???" but read further and see its just a space saving test mule...... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bjhines Posted July 31, 2008 Author Share Posted July 31, 2008 Thanks guys!!! Grumpy and crew... I really wanted to get a few things sorted out about the oil system pertaining to the early 1964 SBC blocks. This block had a canister filter and it has an internal bypass. First tech subject: It is my understanding that the internal bypass starts opening at 7-10 PSI. This effectively short-circuits the entire filter boss and sends oil from the pump directly to the cam gallery. Is this correct? Are all SBC engines internally bypassed this way? Does the oil pump have a bypass for overpressure as well? Technically this means that there are 3 bypasses in a typical SBC set up: 1 inside the oil pump to relieve pressure 1 inside the newer spin on filters(was this inside the canister as well?) 1 inside the block above the filter boss/mounting pad. Do I have this right???? The other item on the list for discussion is the actual pressure in the external oil cooler lines. If I have this right then the entire system will see at least as much pressure as the gauge reads. The only difference being the pumping loss and pressure drop across the filter, hoses, and cooler. This means that the external components will see MORE pressure than the gauge reads. This is limited by the internal block bypass that opens when the differential pressure across the filter boss exceeds 7-10 PSI. To sum up: The gauge is actually reading the pressure at the end of the entire system, minus the pumping losses in the external components and hoses. There is no way to actually see if the internal bypass is opening. We just have to use the largest, highest flowing external components possible to minimize pumping losses through the external components. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pparaska Posted July 31, 2008 Share Posted July 31, 2008 Technically this means that there are 3 bypasses in a typical SBC set up: 1 inside the oil pump to relieve pressure 1 inside the newer spin on filters(was this inside the canister as well?) 1 inside the block above the filter boss/mounting pad. Do I have this right???? I have never heard of the last one. My understanding is that there is no internal bypass in the block - unless you forget to put the cup plug in the passage that is under the rear main cap - then it will bypass all the time! I know it's there though - I checked several times! John, that's a beautiful install. The engineering, layout and execution are incredible. Get ready to be wanting more power though - that's why I have the 400 and you have the 327 now! LoL! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bjhines Posted July 31, 2008 Author Share Posted July 31, 2008 OK.. I just got off the phone with a tech at Canton RP. The EPC valve is a ONE-WAY valve that opens to allow discharge(2-way) only when the pressure drops below the set pressure on the switch. In operation the EPC valve will ALWAYS allow oil to flow INTO the Accusump. This means that the accusump air/precharge guage will register the highest oil pressure attained during normal operation of the engine. The EPC valve will only allow the oil to discharge into the engine when the oil pressure drops below the switch set pressure. Whe the oil pressure comes back above the switch set pressure the EPC valve closes and will only allow flow INTO the accusump. The idea behind this is that the Accusump will discharge MORE oil into the engine than a typical Manual or basic electric valve. The accusump will fill up to the highest attained oil pressure and hold that pressure until it is really needed. The manual valve will allow constant fluctuation in charge pressure instead of pumping up to the highest attained pressure and holding it until needed. The basic electric valve is more resitrictive than the EPC valve. They only intended the basic electric valve to be used as a PRE-OILER. For racing applications you must use either the EPC valve or the high-flowing Manual valve. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DavyZ Posted August 1, 2008 Share Posted August 1, 2008 You must be a sick, all-consumed, car-crazy individual to do something so overkill. I like you! Very sano set up and great explanation on what was done and why. Thanks for posting the details! Davy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bjhines Posted August 1, 2008 Author Share Posted August 1, 2008 Thanks DavyZ and Pete. It means a lot!!! Grumpy posted this on Chevytalk last month. I found this searching the interweb and look who posted the most detailed information. http://www.chevytalk.org/fusionbb/showtopic.php?tid/192284/ This is the internal filter bypass I am talking about. This may just be a general idea that is misleading. I swear I read something... This picture is of a later model SBC with a spin on style filter. The later model bypass is shown in the closeup pic below. You can see the rolled/crimped edges of the spin-on filter and the typical bypass valve on the left. Maybe Im crazy and I don't have any desire to tear this 327 down and check it all out. I don't have access to another early block. It is all a wash anyway because one way or the other there is still a filter bypass in the filter-boss. ... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pparaska Posted August 1, 2008 Share Posted August 1, 2008 I've never seen that first drawing. It suspect it's for the original blocks from the first few years in the 1950s when there was actually no oil filter pad! I don't think it's indicative of what is in the later blocks, even the 327! If you didn't use the filter adapter bolted into the 327 block to mount your remote adapter to, you won't have the bypass that is shown in that drawing - that bypass is in the "adapter" that bolts into the block's filter pad area with 2 5/16" bolts. I'm betting you don't have that part in there and the part you show with the braided lines coming out of it doesn't have a bypass either. In other words, unless you have a bypass in any of the parts you show in the photos, you don't have a bypass. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jt1 Posted August 1, 2008 Share Posted August 1, 2008 Since Chevy went to the spin on filter, they use the pump bypass and the one in the filter adapter that bolts to the block, shown in the last picture. I don't know how the canister filter blocks bypassed, if at all. I think there's an old 283 block laying behind the hogpen, if I get a chance I'll look at it and see if it's different. jt Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bjhines Posted August 1, 2008 Author Share Posted August 1, 2008 Hehehe... So I stand a good chance of seeing if the filter can withstand 100+PSI without blowing apart! Maybe I should get a billet filter housing. I will check it out when I pull it back apart to clean everything. The entire system can be easily disassembled. I would like a filter-boss bypass, but It is my understanding that a metered hole would actually bypass less oil than a bypass valve in some cases. I am considering finding a good place to drill a 0.250" hole to allow a constant metered bypass with no spring loaded valve at all. I could do that in the aluminum adaptor plate without touching the block at all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jt1 Posted August 1, 2008 Share Posted August 1, 2008 Nah, it won't blow the filter off, unless something goes really wrong. The filter bypass only functions when the filter gets stopped up and creates a pressure rise sufficent to open the bypass valve. About the only way you blow the filter off is turn too many rpm with cold oil. Always get the oil warmed up before you wing it. John Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A. G. Olphart Posted August 1, 2008 Share Posted August 1, 2008 Hehehe... So I stand a good chance of seeing if the filter can withstand 100+PSI without blowing apart! Maybe I should get a billet filter housing. I will check it out when I pull it back apart to clean everything. The entire system can be easily disassembled. I would like a filter-boss bypass, but It is my understanding that a metered hole would actually bypass less oil than a bypass valve in some cases. I am considering finding a good place to drill a 0.250" hole to allow a constant metered bypass with no spring loaded valve at all. I could do that in the aluminum adaptor plate without touching the block at all. I don't have the engineering background to verify my gut feelings, but a quarter inch hole sounds like an awfully large part of the low RPM flow of hot/thin oil from the fixed displacement pump. <> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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