Diomedes Posted May 29, 2009 Share Posted May 29, 2009 You know what? I thought I had a good grasp on suspension designs before I started looking at the other posts there, now I realize how far behind I really am. I love it though, I have so much more reading to do...I wish I had the money to buy this book http://www.amazon.com/Race-Car-Vehicle-Dynamics-R146/dp/1560915269/ref=pd_sim_b_6 RCVD has a very mathematical approach. Tech tips and carroll smith's books are more in line with this thread's discussion. Start with those. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheNick Posted May 29, 2009 Share Posted May 29, 2009 http://www.amazon.com/Introduction-Race-Car-Engineering-Book/dp/0973432004 Better than any of the Smith books or the RCVD book. Shows actual application of the math and comes with suspension design software and load transfer worksheets. While you are at it check out Paul Haney's - The Racing and High Performance Tire - written by a journalist and not an engineer - very easy read - can be done in one sitting and the info is very easy to remember. My personal favorite book because it relates directly to the club racer who doesn't have the means to do all the testing in the world, or they have to work within a certain set of rules that doesn't allow mounting point relocation Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators BRAAP Posted May 29, 2009 Administrators Share Posted May 29, 2009 It looks damn cool.Im going to make one out of wood and mount it in my car Don't forget to mount a rear wing on your four cylinder FWD with the large exhaust tip, because that looks cool too. Authentic faux performance is where its at baby! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AkumaNoZeta Posted May 29, 2009 Share Posted May 29, 2009 I've already read Chassis Engineering by Herb Adams and Race And Rally Car Source Book by Allan Staniforth and I ordered Competition Car Suspensions by Allan Staniforth before this thread came about (but its on back order sadly). And The Nick, did you read this book and use the software? Is it worth the $90-$120? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JMortensen Posted May 29, 2009 Share Posted May 29, 2009 I've already read Chassis Engineering by Herb Adams and Race And Rally Car Source Book by Allan Staniforth and I ordered Competition Car Suspensions by Allan Staniforth before this thread came about (but its on back order sadly). And The Nick, did you read this book and use the software? Is it worth the $90-$120? Competition Car Suspensions is a good one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheNick Posted May 29, 2009 Share Posted May 29, 2009 The software is a sample version of Bill Mitchell's WinGeo - you don't get the opportunity to actually model suspension from scratch but it does show you how the use the software. The excel sheets that it comes with are very useful - they are ugly as hell - but there are step by step instructions in the book. If you want 75% of the material and have a quick reference manual - pick up the Haney book instead. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AkumaNoZeta Posted May 29, 2009 Share Posted May 29, 2009 I downloaded the OptimumK V1.1 Demo from OptimumG.com and currently learning how to use that. Is WinGeo about the same or better than this program? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheNick Posted May 29, 2009 Share Posted May 29, 2009 I've played with the OptimumG stuff - the user interface is much friendlier - both can get you the same answers - it is just a tad bit more work to get it out of WinGeo http://www.mitchellsoftware.com/prod01.htm Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tube80z Posted May 29, 2009 Share Posted May 29, 2009 I've played with the OptimumG stuff - the user interface is much friendlier - both can get you the same answers - it is just a tad bit more work to get it out of WinGeo http://www.mitchellsoftware.com/prod01.htm Maybe winGEO changed how they handle the roll axis but that was one of the many things that got optimumK started. I remember Claude Rouelle talking about how winGEO calculates roll and how it was incorrect so they decided to build their own software. Both would be hard to justify for casual use when susprog3D gets you very close results for about $120. I just hope Rowley does the extra volumes he talks about in his first book. I really like the real world examples in his work compared to the more academic approach in RCVD. Neither are an easy read in my opinion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
260DET Posted May 29, 2009 Share Posted May 29, 2009 So who is going to design a similar suspension for the Z, that is the question. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tube80z Posted May 29, 2009 Share Posted May 29, 2009 So who is going to design a similar suspension for the Z, that is the question. I hear Ron and Paul have a wicked set of Legos. Maybe they will build the first Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators BRAAP Posted May 29, 2009 Administrators Share Posted May 29, 2009 I hear Ron and Paul have a wicked set of Legos. Maybe they will build the first My Lego are only used for building/mocking up V-8 engines, (dual plane crank in this instance) and traditional double A-arm systems that would be functional first and foremost, non of that ricers montra, bling-bling look-how cool my suspension "appears" crap! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AkumaNoZeta Posted June 1, 2009 Share Posted June 1, 2009 On the spring-to-spring to chassis thing that Tube80Z metioned, I've been thinking about it and I don't see that really helping because the force from cornering goes through the control arms to the chassis. The only way I can see that idea working is on bumps and even then it would be marginal at best, depending how you mount the springs of course. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tube80z Posted June 1, 2009 Share Posted June 1, 2009 On the spring-to-spring to chassis thing that Tube80Z metioned, I've been thinking about it and I don't see that really helping because the force from cornering goes through the control arms to the chassis. The only way I can see that idea working is on bumps and even then it would be marginal at best, depending how you mount the springs of course. So to paraphrase, you're saying the torsional stiffness means nothing to handling. Are you sure about that? Cary Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AkumaNoZeta Posted June 1, 2009 Share Posted June 1, 2009 That's not what I'm saying, I just don't think that changing the spring location by using a cantilever design won't really help with limiting the chassis as a 5th spring like you mentioned. Just my opinion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
heavy85 Posted June 2, 2009 Share Posted June 2, 2009 Looks like an in-car tube bender. Start with a straight tube, add spring/shock, add paint, install, hit a big bump and presto you now have a bent tube. Cameron Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
karl Posted June 2, 2009 Share Posted June 2, 2009 I have designed but not yet implemented a similar setup for my Triumph TR6. The reason is for packaging. It's almost impossible to install coilovers in the rear with any kind of reasonable suspension travel as there is no room. So sometimes it is out of necessity and not the need for bling. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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