Mayolives Posted June 24, 2010 Share Posted June 24, 2010 I wasn't sure where to post this but I found it very interesting in terms of how important little aero device changes are and what a bid difference a change can make to the performance of a track car. The F1 one cars are light years more advance that our cars but I can still relate. They have just announce new regulations for adjustable rear wings and I have copied that information from a recent article taken from Racer Magazine. Formula 1 is set to introduce an adjustable rear wing system to aid overtaking next year as part of the rules overhaul that will bring the end of double diffusers and F-ducts. McLaren engineering director Paddy Lowe explained that the system proposed by the Formula One Teams' Association (FOTA), which was adopted today by the FIA's World Motorsport Council, enables the rear wings to be adjusted to reduce drag – in the style currently controlled by F-ducts, set to be banned next year – when drivers are closely following a car in front. The device would increase the straight-line speed of the car behind by approximately 9mph to help passing maneuvers, but could not be used on the opening laps of a race. The car in front would not be able to deploy the system in defense, but would be able to retaliate using the wing once it was following the rival car. "The flap will be adjustable by the driver," Lowe explained. "He can run it however he likes in qualifying, so what we'll actually do is make the flap so it has very low drag, and in qualifying that will allow you to get a better lap time by using it wherever you can. "In the race, you can't use it for the first two laps at all, but after that if you're within a second of the car in front then you will be able to deploy it. So that will be very interesting. That's a FOTA initiative to improve the show and I think it's very exciting." In an additional bid to increase passes for position, the teams have also agreed to end their voluntary ban on the use of Kinetic Energy Recovery Systems (KERS) in 2011 and to return the power boost-generating devices to their cars after a one-year absence Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JMortensen Posted June 24, 2010 Share Posted June 24, 2010 F1 rules are just mind-boggling in their lameness. You can't use the thing that makes you faster in the first laps of the race, and you can't use it if you're in front? LAME. IMO they need to take a much different tack if they want more competitive racing. They need to open up the rules. Found this idea on another forum, but I like it a lot. Instead of having engines that are built to a formula and then sealed, they should have open regs regarding engine construction. No limits on displacement, or pistons or even that the engine has to have pistons. Instead they should substitute a fuel metering rule. So many liters per hour, and that's it. Let the engineers do something useful instead of spending thousands of hours trying to whittle .25 seconds off of a lap by tweaking the car to fit a tight ruleset. If the cars get too fast, cut the fuel flow. If they did this I expect that you might see more of the F1 technology passed down to street cars. I can't point to many things we've gotten from F1 lately aside from carbon fiber brakes, and they're only on hypercars. If a team could make a really efficient engine that makes a lot of power, I think that a toned down variant would be instantly marketable to the public, where a 2.4L V8 that spins 19,000 rpm really isn't. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
burninator Posted July 6, 2010 Share Posted July 6, 2010 This rule really does seem lame. I liked the KERS systems because I can see how it would open things up with the strategy and ability to pass. I also think the KERS tech might trickle down into consumer cars. With this adjustable wing rule since you can't deploy it when your in front, I can see how it could make the cars leapfrog back and forth so it's just the car that passes last that wins. Or strategicaly the car following the leader would wait until the last possible straight of the race to deploy it and pass and the lead car would be helpless to avoid being overtaken. Seems unfair and silly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zmanco Posted July 6, 2010 Share Posted July 6, 2010 Jon, I'm with your approach. I'd go a little further for F1 since it positions itself as the leader in technology, and give each car a budget of X amount of energy to be used for the race. Make sure it's enough so that this doesn't become a fuel economy race, but not so much that it encourages waste. Then let the teams determine how best to use it. Some might use it all in the form of gasoline, some diesel, some hydrogen, and I'd expect some would use some hybrid combination. Plus, I would expect some form of KERS would become quite common. I think there would be some very creative approaches, albeit there would likely be some big discrepancies between the teams in the beginning as some would really struggle with this type of new approach. But if F1 wants to remain relevant as the world becomes more and more concerned with how it uses energy, this would leave them well-positioned. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JMortensen Posted July 7, 2010 Share Posted July 7, 2010 This rule really does seem lame. I liked the KERS systems because I can see how it would open things up with the strategy and ability to pass. I also think the KERS tech might trickle down into consumer cars. With this adjustable wing rule since you can't deploy it when your in front, I can see how it could make the cars leapfrog back and forth so it's just the car that passes last that wins. Or strategicaly the car following the leader would wait until the last possible straight of the race to deploy it and pass and the lead car would be helpless to avoid being overtaken. Seems unfair and silly. The KERS system they allowed wasn't advanced enough to require any innovation. It could only be used for a couple seconds a lap. Again, let them make the BEST damn KERS system possible and then you'll get some innovation. Toyota had a much more developed KERS system on their Supra used in JCTC. From: http://www.totalf1.com/full_story/view/270408/Toyota_KERS_development_update/ Toyota is a world leader in hybrid technology and we are the market leader in hybrid vehicle sales, with over a million sales of the hybrid Prius, a fact we are very proud of. KERS development will inevitably increase our understanding of hybrid systems but, at this stage, we do not expect it to provide any major breakthroughs for road car development. In terms of racing, Toyota has already won the Tokachi 24--Hour race with a hybrid vehicle which uses more advanced technology than the KERS system in Formula 1. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnc Posted July 7, 2010 Share Posted July 7, 2010 FOA and FIA have pretty much lost their mind regarding F1. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators RTz Posted July 8, 2010 Administrators Share Posted July 8, 2010 Speechless. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
260DET Posted July 9, 2010 Share Posted July 9, 2010 Oh dear, how are they going to police that, crazy. A problem has arisen from the no refuel rule where cars are carrying the bare minimum of fuel in order to get an all important good start. Then they have to be very careful with using power later on which produces boring non-racing. I always like the Indy 'push to pass' idea, no rules but you have x seconds of use anytime, your call. Good thinking. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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