janaka Posted January 22, 2011 Share Posted January 22, 2011 Hey all I'm looking to add a little negative camber to the back end this spring when I get the car re-aligned in hopes that it *may* help clear my tire from rubbing that last little bit. Anyway I don't forsee wanting to do the weld-in camber plates since its not a race car, I had read a little about camber bushings on here but it only really mentions front ones where I'm looking at the rear, is it safe to assume that I'll only get a degree or so max out of the rear camber bushings like it says about the front camber bushings (in one of the stickies)? Thoughts? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators RTz Posted January 22, 2011 Administrators Share Posted January 22, 2011 Years ago MSA use to sell offset Delrin/aluminum bushings for the rear. I don't know if they still do or not. I wouldn't expect that method to help your rubbing problem though... it adds track width. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
janaka Posted January 22, 2011 Author Share Posted January 22, 2011 That is where I saw them online.... http://www.thezstore.com/page/TZS/PROD/23-4171 Offset control arm bushings allow suspension adjustments not possible with stock components. This kit should be considered mandatory with wider wheels and tires. Machined from high-grade aluminum and delrin. Sold as a pair. Your car must be aligned after installation of these components. For adjustment, use the camber wrench (23-4174) shown in Related Items below. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cygnusx1 Posted January 22, 2011 Share Posted January 22, 2011 (edited) I run those aluminum/delrin eccentric bushings, front and rear, with stock shock towers and suspension. I am lowered 1" via springs and I measure between -1.3 and -1.6 degrees of camber all around. This is on my 280Z with the bushings maxed out.. I like the change they made to the car. Feels a bit tighter or stable, and turns in better...could be a phantom effect though as I have no numbers to back it up. I switched from Poly to these. I always run zero toe up front and have the rears set with BOTH bushings maxed out and don't know the rear toe number. It should be factory spec, or at least where it was before the bushings. Edited January 22, 2011 by cygnusx1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snailed Posted January 22, 2011 Share Posted January 22, 2011 Use those bushings to move the arm IN. If tire clearance is your only goal, that will help but you will end up with more positive camber which will only get even more postive under compression. Good for drag racing...not as good for taking corners. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kj280z Posted January 22, 2011 Share Posted January 22, 2011 You can also notch the bolt holes in the strut tower... I have not had stock insulators in my Z for many years so I'm not sure how much you'd gain but between doing that and the poly bushings it may be a good starting point Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jhm Posted January 23, 2011 Share Posted January 23, 2011 "I run those aluminum/delrin eccentric bushings, front and rear, with stock shock towers and suspension. I am lowered 1" via springs and I measure between -1.3 and -1.6 degrees of camber all around. This is on my 280Z with the bushings maxed out.. I like the change they made to the car. Feels a bit tighter or stable, and turns in better...could be a phantom effect though as I have no numbers to back it up. I switched from Poly to these. I always run zero toe up front and have the rears set with BOTH bushings maxed out and don't know the rear toe number. It should be factory spec, or at least where it was before the bushings." Dave- So you really noticed a difference with those bushings? I've been thinking about getting them, but have read mixed reviews on them. Maybe I'll give 'em a try....the best price I could find was $50 for a pair, from Wolf Creek Racing ("http://www.wolfcreekracing.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=24:suspension-a-brake-parts&catid=18:suspension-a-brake-parts&Itemid=33"). I've already gained a fair amount of neg camber in the rear just by lowering, so I'll probably start out by trying the bushings in the front. Appreciate any thoughts, suggestions or additional advice you may have. Did you need that special wrench they sell to adjust the bushings, or were you able to get by with standard wrenches? Thx much! r/John Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cygnusx1 Posted January 23, 2011 Share Posted January 23, 2011 "I run those aluminum/delrin eccentric bushings, front and rear, with stock shock towers and suspension. I am lowered 1" via springs and I measure between -1.3 and -1.6 degrees of camber all around. This is on my 280Z with the bushings maxed out.. I like the change they made to the car. Feels a bit tighter or stable, and turns in better...could be a phantom effect though as I have no numbers to back it up. I switched from Poly to these. I always run zero toe up front and have the rears set with BOTH bushings maxed out and don't know the rear toe number. It should be factory spec, or at least where it was before the bushings." Dave- So you really noticed a difference with those bushings? I've been thinking about getting them, but have read mixed reviews on them. Maybe I'll give 'em a try....the best price I could find was $50 for a pair, from Wolf Creek Racing ("http://www.wolfcreekracing.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=24:suspension-a-brake-parts&catid=18:suspension-a-brake-parts&Itemid=33"). I've already gained a fair amount of neg camber in the rear just by lowering, so I'll probably start out by trying the bushings in the front. Appreciate any thoughts, suggestions or additional advice you may have. Did you need that special wrench they sell to adjust the bushings, or were you able to get by with standard wrenches? Thx much! r/John Like I said, I like them and I like the way the car "bites" in the corners. I can't say anything negative about them but I can't confirm anything positive except that I like the way the car feels with the bushings. I did the same thing; fronts about a year before I did the rears. That wrench is useful and useless. You need it to turn the bushings, but you need to get it cherry red with a torch, and drop it in oil to harden it. It's way too soft to be useful as-is. Mark the bushing with a file befor you install them and use that as a reference for adjusting them. Of course follow up with an alignment. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jhm Posted January 23, 2011 Share Posted January 23, 2011 Good info, good advice...thx! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JMortensen Posted January 23, 2011 Share Posted January 23, 2011 The big problem with them in the front is that they limit the way the suspension moves. As the TC rod swings the caster changes, and the control arm moves back and forth a little bit. The camber bushings try to prevent that movement, so the stress goes somewhere. I think the most likely thing that happens is the crossmember itself flexes back and forth every time the suspension moves. Not good. Even poly I think is better in this spot, rubber is better because it allows that motion to occur more easily, but really a rod end LCA is the best because it will move freely without distorting. In the rear you don't have that problem, so they work better IMO in the back. The problem though is that the inner and outer bushings are different diameters. I can't recall the sizes right now, but lets say you could move the pivot center 3/8" out with the smaller one, and 3/4" out with the larger one. That means in terms of camber you're limited to 3/8" of outward motion, then you can use the larger one to adjust toe. Better than nothing, but not as good as you might think just glancing at them. The real solution is roll the fenders or flare the car or run a narrower wheel, adding negative camber to the Z, which already has too much neg camber in the rear (as compared to the front anyway) is a bad way to get a wheel to fit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cygnusx1 Posted January 23, 2011 Share Posted January 23, 2011 (edited) Oh yeah surely not the optimal solution but when your car is fully fabbed already, painted, and as a change of plans, you want to add a little negative camber, this is the easy thing to do. You could do the LCA pivot relocation which is probably better up front and cheaper in parts cost. Neither of these will give you extra tire to fender lip clearance for sure. If anything, it could make it worse. For fender clearance I would investigate slotting the towers first, if you don't want to mess with bodywork and wheel changes. I did not find that my car had much negative camber, if any, in the rear or front, in its stock configuration Jon. But then again the specs are strangely wide and I didn't like the way the car felt stock anyhow. But that is a topic well covered elsewhere. Edited January 23, 2011 by cygnusx1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RebekahsZ Posted February 7, 2011 Share Posted February 7, 2011 Go to Betamotorsport.com and look at pictures for the EMI camber plates. They push the top of the tire IN, which is what I think you are trying to do. I have these and they are 100% bolt in and are great-require NO cutting, NO slotting. I have had the eccentric bushings that you refer to. Couple of problems with them: 1) noisy, 2) I was always worried about them rotating and misaligning. The EMI camber plate is easy to install, but it has limitations too. 1) it assumes that you have 2.25 inch coils (or perhaps they are 2.5 inch - I can't remember) and 2) it may require getting different shocks. I have tokikos and 2.25 inch springs. If you have stock springs, the eccentric bushings may be the best you can do, but they really don't give you that much camber. A coil-over kit is the best investment you will make to your z-car. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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