Slow_Old_Car

EBay pulled the listing cause of the word "not" in the title... so it's been relisted, altered, and on jmortensen's advice i changed things up. It's now $750 without a reserve, 5 day listing (this means it ends Friday at 10:20pm central standard time), may the best man win. http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=200221956379

Yea i thought thats what i'd read somewhere... Perhaps one of the other mega fast 2JZ-Z's then... i had a question about your trans setup, sending you a PM.

Part of the description i wrote was geared toward you... But then i recalled you going to the techtoytuning thing which means you should be R230 now right?

Just a mental safegaurd for me really. I wouldn't let it go for less than that. But i also have no clue what the market is on somthing this rare, so i took the hit on the reserve so that the lower starting bid will act as a litmus to show me how much interest there is in the part. I honestly wouldn't be suprised if bidding goes over $1000 within 24 hours since i threw what the reserve was out in the open. Helps kinda weed out the folks who think they'll snipe in at $800 or somthing, doesn't waste my time or theres. We'll see though, thank you for your input.

I've thrown it on ebay, we'll see what happens i suppose... http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=200221632024

That is odd, i wasn't boosting 14.2psi on the mild steel pipe car (both cars reading 10psi on there mechanicle gauges). I was getting improper AFR readings on the megasquirt too on the mild steel piped car (not jiving with the AEM UEGO wideband even though it was selected in the config files). Perhaps i need to reflash it's firmware. The difference in boost registers between the two cars shouldn't be there. The aluminum has the standard 2.5 bar map sensor that DIY supplies stock. Then mild steel car has the map daddy 4 bar upgrade on it. I'll have to go double check the config files to make sure they are not jacked up.

Alright, got more solid readings last night. Todays setup... Car 1: P90/F54, 2mm HKS, Holset HY35w, Mild 2.5" piping, 12"x24"x3" treadstone FMIC, full 3" exhaust, AZ car radiator w/ 160 thermo, SPAL 3200cfm fan, 10psi via tial wastegate. 3.54 rear end gearing on a 26.1" tall tire. Z32 trans. Car 2: P90/F54, 2mm HKS, Holset HY35w, 6061 Aluminum 2.5" piping, 12"x24"x3" treadstone FMIC, full 3" exhaust, Griffin radiator w/ 160 thermo, Zirgo 3500cfm fan, 10psi via tial wastegate. 3.36 rear end gearing on a 24.9" tall tire. 280z trans. Unknown aftermarket camshaft. The parameters: Ambient Temp at testing: 65 degrees Humidity: 50% Time of day, early evening, 6-7pm CST Gear of comparison: 3rd gear Car 1 w/ mild steel IC piping: Beginning of the run IAT: 103 degrees in 3rd gear @ 2600rpm End of the run IAT: 115 degrees in 3rd gear @ 6000rpm Beginning of the run CLT: 171 degrees in 3rd gear @ 2600rpm End of the run CLT: 182 degrees in 3rd gear @ 6000rpm Car 2 w/ aluminum IC piping: Beginning of the run IAT: 86 degrees in 3rd gear @ 3500rpm End of the run IAT: 104 degrees in 3rd gear @ 6500rpm Beginning of the run CLT: 162 degrees in 3rd gear @ 3500rpm End of the run CLT: 166 degrees in 3rd gear @ 6500rpm Conclusion: Starting IAT difference: 17 degrees difference Ending IAT difference: 11 degrees difference Starting CLT difference: 9 degrees difference Ending CLT difference: 16 degrees difference Starting IAT gains from aluminum: 17% Ending IAT gains from aluminum: 10% Starting CLT gains from aluminum: 5% Ending CLT gains from aluminum: 9% Feel free to double check the math as i'm no math major. I tried to generate as much useful stats as i could, but i'm guessing someone better w/ numbers will find a did the math wrong possibly. I'm not really suprised the 6061 piping performed better. I don't think anyone is really. However what i did find interesting is what happens after you shut the throttle. I will have to go back and look at both cars deccel enrichment settings, but the car with mild steel piping has it's IAT readings shoot up when the throttle closes, where as the 6061 piped car has its IAT readings go down. Now this could be the steel pipes being heat soaked and dumping it all into the engine which now has no fresh supply of cooler air so the charge temps go way up, this could be because the deccel enrichment settings are completely different, etc... not really sure. Any additional input is welcome. Aluminum Piping: Mild Steel Piping:

I'll keep that in mind. My research indicated the same, i wasn't into Z's when you could still go buy ring and pinion setups at the dealership, so i long thought the 3.36 was the mecca of perfect turbo gearing options. But this thing... man... it could really help a turbo car stretch it's legs. We'll see what happens though, i'm in need of cash so i'll probally end up w/ it on ebay. But i also thing i'd put a reserve on it that would have me not wanting to kick my own ass when it's over with, as i'm fairly certain this will be the only one of these i ever see in my life.

I was fairly suprised, did the reading and found it was a factory aftermarket nissan/nismo only option, then the LSD is there and in good shape. I read up on it and i'm not really sure what to put it up for, mega rare ring and pinion setup already equipped with LSD. Anyway, just looking for input from others before i decide what to do. I'd thought about building a car for the Texas mile where i imagine this diff would be pretty cool. Then again some guy w/ a V8 and a beefy trans could really fly with this too...

Well, aluminum appears to far out perform mild steel piping.... Todays setup... Car 1: P90/F54, 2mm HKS, Holset HY35w, Mild 2.5" piping, 12"x24"x3" treadstone FMIC, full 3" exhaust, AZ car radiator w/ 160 thermo, SPAL 3200cfm fan, 10psi via tial wastegate. 3.54 rear end gearing on a 26.1" tall tire. Z32 trans. Car 2: P90/F54, 2mm HKS, Holset HY35w, 6061 Aluminum 2.5" piping, 12"x24"x3" treadstone FMIC, full 3" exhaust, Griffin radiator w/ 160 thermo, Zirgo 3500cfm fan, 10psi via tial wastegate. 3.36 rear end gearing on a 24.9" tall tire. 280z trans. Unknown aftermarket camshaft. The parameters: Ambient Temp at testing: 75 degrees Humidity: 40% Time of day, mid afternoon, 1-2pm CST Gear of comparison: 4th gear, so both are 1:1 ratio Car 1 w/ mild steel IC piping: Beginning of the run IAT: 116 degrees in 2nd gear @ 3200rpm End of the run IAT: 133 degrees in 4th gear @ 5600rpm Beginning of the run CLT: 177 degrees in 2nd gear @ 3200rpm End of the run CLT: 191 degrees in 4th gear @ 5600rpm Car 2 w/ aluminum IC piping: Beginning of the run IAT: 99 degrees in 4th gear @ 2400rpm End of the run IAT: 121 degrees in 4th gear @ 6300rpm Beginning of the run CLT: 175 degrees in 4th gear @ 2400rpm End of the run CLT: 179 degrees in 4th gear @ 6300rpm Conclusion: We are not satisfied with the results, we feel they are skewwed as a result of Car 1 doing 2nd, 3rd, and 4th consecutively, and Car 2 did solely a 4th gear pull. Additionally with the rear end gears being different, testing in 1:1 on 4th gear still is somewhat skewwed. However with the difference in tire sizes on each car the speeds don't seem to change more than 1mph in either direction so the loads should be fairly similiar making it a potentially mute point. Lastly the camshaft is proving to be a big mystery on car 2, no cam card, no model number, nothing. It makes registered boost at 2000rpm and makes a full 10psi by 3000rpm as opposed to car one which registers at 3000rpm and makes the full 10psi by 3500rpm. The odd part is that Car 2 while having 11.8:1 AFR's on acceleration it diesels pretty bad out of the exhaust... still working on that one. Is it possible to remap the cam with a standard cam dial in kit or would that be a machine shop gig? We'll be going back out tonight and doing 4th gear only pulls again to even the table. But so far aluminum kicks some ass it would seem in the standard cold side behind the radiator style of routing. Any additional insite is welcomed.

with what ambient air temp though?

I can help establish the difference in mild steel and aluminum piping, as i have two different sets of piping, same routing, one in .060 mild, one in .060 6061 aluminum. I'll grab some logs when i have both cars in my care and see if a percentage difference can be established. In the mean time i would definately like to see the IAT cruise and WOT values for the altered aluminum path to satisfy my own curiosity.

DO NOT run that spark map, plug in these values and it should get you started. Get your wideband hooked up, and go out driving with a laptop, feel your way into the boost and see where the AFR's are at, if you can manage a clean 2nd, 3rd, or 4th gear pull to your redline without the AFR's crossing 11.5:1 under boost then your doing good. Use the MSnS's ability to datalog, record the pulls you do, then pull over and look them over in megalogviewer to make changes, alot safer than trying to adjust maps in megasquirt while driving.

makes sense, never seen it done before this though.

going to make any kind of a screamer pipe so that it's not going to atmosphere right around all those lines? what was up w/ trimming a vacuum hose and then seeing a boost increase?

Post up screens of your timing maps (assuming your running spark as well), in the mean time, rescale your maps to somthing like this, and turn off AFR targeting for right now until you have your maps roughed in closer, it will keep the software from making huge changes to a bad map. I did this map on the following assumptions: 1. that you stick to the boost you said you would, the map is scaled for up to 24psi of boost, but it will be up to you to limit it to the boost you stated, i just left you room to grow. 2. that your motor is 100% stock down to the injectors, i used my own base map which runs 440cc injectors, then scaled it up to account for the 370cc injectors you should be running. 3. that this map is mearly to confrim that everything else is functioning properly and that it was a improperly scaled map causing your problem. My personal suggestions are: DO NOT run this map before posting up your timing tables DO NOT run this map before installing your wideband 02 sensor and having it ready and interfaced with megasquirt so you can see whats happening DO NOT consider this map a base map that is safe to go run around with and hunt for civics, as you still have not shown enough about how your car is setup, it is mearly here to see if scaling was your problem.

your maps are not set up at all for a forced induction motor... 100kpa = atmospheric, according to those maps its referencing the same stuff as the 100kpa line at anything above 100kpa... what is the max boost you plan on running on this motor setup?

pm sent

no graph attached.... off hand from your description though, and assuming that you do not have a wideband gauge since you make no mention of AFR's... i would say you need to work on your tip in response in the acceleration wizard menu, and that you need to add some fuel up top or look at your engine timing. take the car out, in 3rd or 4th gear run it to redline in an area that is dead straight with lots of room, as much as i hate to say this, just after you hit redline clutch in, go to neutral, and shut the motor off... coasting to a stop (again LOTS of room since you'll lose power brakes). Once you come to a stop, pull your plugs and check the coloring, if any of them are white then your running lean up top. the smartest thing to do would be outfit the car with a wideband air fuel gauge though, and i mean a real one, not that $60 autometer air/fuel gauge special. go pick up a AEM UEGO, Innovative LC-1, Innovative LM-1, PLX, etc...

so what is your top speed so far?

with the instant torque a electric motor can kick out, why even bother with 1st gear? i mean people can slip the clutch on gas motors to leave the line in second... seems like 1st is pointless.