BrandenZ

Congrats Keith! Everything I'm reading is amazing news! I can't believe you got it to fire after 2 clicks on the starter! Honestly, actually I can believe it because of how amazingly thorough you've been during the entire build process. Here's hoping you get all the cobwebs knocked out in a hurry, as racing season is upon us! I finally got my much less ambitious 10.1:1 comp E88+flattop F54 rebuilt and dialed in, just in time for the first Atlanta region event next weekend. It runs like an absolute demon compared to the 200+k mile tired old 8.5:1 comp L28 that was in there, but I'm sure absolutely half the absurd power that you're producing now. I genuinely can't wait to hear about how that setup performs for you. I'll be following this thread closely -- depending on the time I may try to make it out for one of your region events just so I can see her in action! PS -- Watch what you ask for, as you may just get it... my long-term plans include your exact swap in my car, so don't be shocked in a year from now when your phone starts ringing off the hook.

^ I did the same in my setup as well, works great. Also a bit curious as to how you ended up with different calipers than me. I also purchased and xtreme rear setup from Ross. It clearly states on my invoice that they're PBR calipers, and they most definitely are. In my case, the rears are also Cobras. Anyway, shouldn't have anything to do with your actual issue. Even if I proportion mine such that the rears basically do zero braking (did this by accident while trying to balance the setup!), the fronts haul down something serious -- significantly improved over my stock setup.

John -- I meant given my current setup / situation. Jon -- Great suggestion, thanks! I'll look into this, along with threads on the best solution for replacing the turn signal indicators integrated with the factory tach.

I'm using what I believe is a 280 distributor, with the optical pick-up conversion, hooked up to a Crane XR700 electronic ignition module. My ignition is spot-on and I have zero issues, but there's no rev-limiter on the XR700 and I can't find any way that one can be added through Crane, aside from perhaps replacing my XR700 with the much more expensive Hi-6 unit. Any ideas or suggestions, or should I just look at replacing it with something like an MSD 6a box or the Hi-6 mentioned above? Thanks!

Try the broom-stick trick -- hold one end to your ear and the other to various parts of the carbs / motor, see where the noise increases vs where you can't hear it at all. I just recently had a weird vibration after re-installing my exhaust and dual webers, during out to be the heat shield rubbing on one of the primaries, bent it back a touch and now it's gone!

Cyrus -- Yes, 100% there is a difference. Also, did you order the part numbers I PM'd you? They worked perfect for my fronts AND rears. Actually, you definitely did not as you mentioned Hawk HPS. Personally, I have had terrific success with the HP+ and blues, but hated the only set of HPS I ever purchased. To me, they didn't squeak or dust much, but were very temperamental. Required a lot of heat to bite, and felt like squishy-poo (technical term) when cold. Just my personal experience. DEFINITELY swap that line and report back... after re-bleeding... This will also alter your brake bias -- so re-adjust your prop valve accordingly. Likely this is why you were bottoming it out on adjustment...

One last update: Fixed the front cover gasket, and took her out today for the first maiden voyage after the rebuild... She's perfect. Zero smoking after a few runs attempting to set the rings. Plugs are spot-on, 160-165 compression across the board! Started at 4 degrees advance (E88 head on F54 flattops, being conservative), ended up stopping for the day at 10 degrees. No ping whatsoever (probably will push for 12-14 depending), pulls like a demon and doesn't want to stop even up past 6500 rpms. This is the 3rd L-series motor that's been in the car since I've owned it, and I've never had one a) make so much consistent, smooth power bottom-to-top, and feel so spot on. Cranks almost immediately even when cold, holds a dead-steady idle, rock solid oil-pressure, and has almost zero stumble (even with my DGVs). Thanks again to all for the advice and assistance, I'm extremely pleased with the end-result!

Check out this link, exceptional write-up on the majority of what you're looking to do: http://datsunzgarage.com/rebuild/ I picked up the same hone he recommends on the page, bought the exact part number referenced, and got the finest grit they made. Turned out great in my case, all done with just a simple cordless drill! You should super install new rod bolts, particularly if you intend to daily drive it for a long period of time. The factory bolts are stretch-to-yield, basically this means that when they're torqued to spec, the actual bolt stretches and conforms to lock into place. They're never meant to be re-used, as if you attempt to re-torque them to spec, they'll stretch again, weakening the strength of the fastener. I found a set on ebay for I think $60. A lot cheaper than repairing a piston through the block if you re-use them and they end up snapping. From what I've read, main bearings seem to rarely be of any issue. In general the answer is always yes, since you're already 90% of the way there in terms of the work involved, but I personally didn't bother. I checked the spec of one of the mains with plasti-gauge (the main bearing I had to pop out to replace the rear main seal -- which I do recommend doing while you're there) and it came out to spec, so I left them all alone. I did go ahead and replace the rod bearings. You've gotta take the rodcaps off anyway, and they're relatively cheap as a set -- very cheap insurance in my book. Personally, I did: New rings, new rod bearings, new rod bolts, new rear main seal, new oil pan gasket, new front cover seal, new head gasket, and new intake/exhaust manifold gasket. Ran it hard just today, still slowing dialing the timing back up -- zero smoke, plugs read perfect, 160+ compression across the board -- Very pleased!

I'm definitely not an authority of any type regarding motor rebuilds, but just from my most recent experience, it seems to me like you should be fine without a re-bore and just a new set of rings. In my case, the fact that the cross-hatching was gone is an actual indicator that of wear inside of the bore of the block, and yet I was able to re-hone and apply new rings that were in spec without any issue apparent as of yet. I'd say the fact that you see cross-hatching is a good sign. I'd also expect that rings themselves to wear as opposed to the ring lands on the pistons themselves, especially given the fact that supposedly ours all came with moly top rings from the factory. I believe the oil control ring set is cast, so if there's any wear to be found regarding the depth of the ring land, I suspect you'd find it there. Unfortunately if you posted this a week ago I could provide actual depth measurements that I experienced on my pistons, and ring-width for a new set, but mine's already buttoned back up and I hope to keep it that way for a long time to come! Also please do take note if you go through northern to ensure that you have the right set specific to your model. 280zx ring sets are different than all S30s, and they're also different between the turbo and N/A version. Additionally I found that most do stock the correct set, but it's chrome (which you don't want) as opposed to cast or moly+cast. There was someone selling a set of F54 pistons recently in the classifieds. Perhaps you could find that post and, if they haven't sold them yet, see if they'd be kind enough to measure the depth of all 3 ring-lands. Outside of that, maybe Tony D or John C will chime in here and provide more statements of fact as opposed to the theoretics that I'm spewing.

Refer to my thread here in a similar subject (re-ringing the motor due to burning oil): http://forums.hybridz.org/index.php/topic/104074-burning-oil-in-2-looking-for-suggestions-as-to-why/ I haven't had a chance to fully seat the rings yet to completely say with confidence that it's working, I'm fairly certain it will run great once I solve one last issue if the initial crank is any indicator. I personally did not bore the block or get over-sized pistons. There was very little ridging, so I didn't feel inclined to use a ridge-reamer, but the cross-hatching was gone in all cylinders, so I did re-honed it. One thing in theory that you could do is buy just 1 ring set (as opposed to the entire set for 6 cylinders), then install the top compression ring inside each of your cylinders and measure the gap. I was able to do this quite simply by compressing the ring with my hand, pushing it into the cylinder, then turning a piston upside-down to apply even pressure across the ring, and moving it down below the top-ride (the area where it will actually ride when installed on the piston), and measuring it with a set of digital calipers. Unfortunately I don't have the spec I used off-hand. All of mine came out perfectly in-spec with the new rings, so I kind of put it out of my mind. However, you can download the factory service manual and look it up yourself here: http://www.xenons130.com/reference.html I would suspect that if your rings are old and worn, that the old ones will show out of spec. To me the more important test would be if a new set of rings showed in-spec. If not, then likely you will have to go the route the machine shop mentioned. PS -- Don't forget new rod bolts (Tony mentioned this in my thread), very important as the stockers are torque-to-yield.

Never heard of that trick before! Do you have any links on the setup / how to get it working in your Z by chance?

Feel free to follow my rebuild thread here: http://forums.hybridz.org/index.php/topic/104074-burning-oil-in-2-looking-for-suggestions-as-to-why/ Fair warning -- it's long! I basically slapped a fully rebuilt E88 head on the F54 mentioned in the thread. I don't recall reading anyone having issues with cooling with that type of a combo. Personally I'm running a JTR radiator with multiple fans hooked up to a temperature probe, so I'm not terribly concerned about it. Regarding the pinging, I'm hoping I'll get "lucky" with my combo. The head was rebuild with the larger 280z valves (you already have this with your N47), and had the quench area opened up a bit. Additionally, I'm running the more aggressive (longer duration and higher lift) 240z cam which should help a bit (something like a stage2+ would be more ideal). My ignition is also rock solid, converted to optical style, and I'm running dual webers which should give me plenty of adjustability for richening up the mixture if necessary. Out of curiosity, what are you considering implementing to address the potential issue?

Here's one of the best resources I've managed to find on the subject: http://www.xenons130.com/Heads.html According to this, you'd be looking at 10.4:1. I'm just about to get an E88/F54 combo back on the road, which also should be roughly 10.4:1. Give me a week or so, and I'll report back with how much timing I'm able to dial in on the combo using 93-octane without getting pinging. From my research, the biggest criticism of this type of a combo is running it without detonation issues. Some report having to retard the timing so much that they lose most of the gains of the bumped compression.

Just wanted to update this thread in case it helps someone else in the future: All pistons and rings on the pistons pulled, every compression ring spun freely and virtually every oil ring was seized. It just so happened that the oil rings in the two cylinders that were heavily consuming oil were seize "shut" and more clamped in around the piston (less gap), and the others were seized in more of an open (more gap) state, which I assume is why this condition wasn't present across the board. Two of them that were stuck the furthest open actually managed to leave some scoring across the cylinder walls where the sharper edges from the ring-gap sat on the oil rings. I using the Hastings ring set as mentioned above (Thanks again, Lazeum!). The top rings are cast as opposed to the moly that came from the factory, but at least they're not chrome, and the fitment was perfect. Measured out the gap across all cylinders, completely within spec. I used FLEX-HONE per the recommendation of this page: http://datsunzgarage.com/rebuild/ Cross-hatching turned out great, and the scoring disappeared as well! Two tools absolutely essential to this process were a ring spreader, for removing the old rings and also installing the new ones, and a ring compressor (not sure of the official name here) which basically looks like a big aluminum cuff that can be expanded to fit around the piston top and compressed on it to compress the rings and allow for easy installation back into the cylinder without risk of scoring the walls or popping a ring out. Also went ahead and put in new bearings as well as ARP rod bolts to avoid the potential for disaster with the torque-to-yield stock bolts (Thanks for the heads-up, Tony!). All in all, the rebuild went smoothly... Except for that bloody chain tensioner! I used the block of wood trick (that I've done several times now with success), but somehow across the process (probably from flipping the block upside-down and rightside-up for the ringing process so much) it managed to slip just a hair. I couldn't manage to get the cam gear lined back up... so off went the front cover! 3 hours of basically wasted time later, I had it all re-assembled with a fresh gasket (thanks, 24 hour autozone). She fired back up almost immediately, and with no issues, even with just 4 degrees of timing dialed in (being conservative to start on the high compression combo). Aside from an initial smoke-screen, the rings appear to have done the trick with what only appears to be extremely minimal smoking even though I haven't had the opportunity to attempt to seat the rings. Unfortunately, I did not put the front cover back on with sealant at the corners per the service manual (DOH!), so the front cover is now leaking. As such, I haven't had the opportunity to fully seat the rings and report a complete success, but all initial indicators are extremely positive. I'll update this thread again once the gasket issue is resolved and I have the opportunity to seat the rings, read the plugs, and run a hot compression test. Thanks again to all for the assistance here... she's so close!

Hey Cyrus -- I had the exact same problem with essentially the same kit. For me, it was the pads. I swapped them out with Hawk HP+, bedded them in, and now my brakes are incredible. Mine is also a 240z, only difference is I'm running a 15/16th master. Also using the stock booster with no issue whatsoever. I pulled my hair out over this one, ripped basically everything apart trying to figure it out, then pulled one of the pads and realized it had an almost glassy-glaze to it. I'm convinced the pads are meant for track-only and need to be heated to a ridiculous level before they'll actually grab or perhaps before the factory glaze beds off of them (you can see more of the standard rough material below the glaze on the sides). I was going to try to lathe off the top-coat, but the Hawk HP+ pads have been working so well I haven't bothered. I'd suggest you pull one of them and see if you see something similar. If so, feel free to let me know if you'd like me to track down the specific product code for the Hawk pads I ordered. They were Mustang Cobra pads for the PBR calipers but IIRC there are two different types available and it does matter. Good luck!

Great suggestion! Carl responded to my email super fast, with the exact information I was looking for, as well as a screen capture confirming with his parts catalog that what I was looking at on the website was the correct ring set. They're ordered and should be on the way soon! Thanks Mathieu, you rock!

Awesome, thanks Lazeum. According to their website, they have a set of non-chrome Hastings rings in stock for my application. My only concern is that it doesn't specify turbo vs non-turbo, and it says something funny "use with #4 main". Do you happen to have Andy's contact information? Feel free to PM if you want. I'd like to call or email and see if I can ensure correctness (very paranoid given the difficulty in finding an appropriate set). Thanks again!

Hey guys -- I have everything needed to get this back in business... _except_ the rings. I'm having a terribly difficult time sourcing the correct rings for an N/A 280zx. Autozone, Advance, and NAPA all say they can only get the chrome ring set -- can't even order the cast ones any more. Does this look good: http://www.carpartsdiscount.com/auto/parts/81/nissan/280zx/pistons_connecting_rods/piston_ring_set.html?3593=62169 I _assume_ that because this is a $164 list, even though it's only selling for $26, that it's the entire set -- not just for 1 piston. What I can't find is a cross-reference to Grant to ensure this is a NON-chrome set. If any of you have a good source for a set (that isn't the $200+ dollar one from MSA), please let me know! Or if the set linked above looks good, happy to hear that as well ($26 is great!). Thanks!

Rej -- Thanks, but since I've already got it pulled and apart, I'm going to go the proper route. Perhaps if I knew of this stuff before, I would've given it a whirl! Letitsnow -- I'll check out the Hastings rings! Unfortunately from what I've read, the 280zx rings are different, so I need to be careful there, as most everything I can find is 75-80... NewZed -- If I were trying to solve this in a weekend or on a budget, I wouldn't see much of a problem with this. Heck, when I discovered it that night, I was fairly tempted to do exactly what you mentioned. However, given that this is the 3rd time I've pulled this junkyard motor, I decided that even my time is worth the extra money to make sure it's right this time! I'm tired of buying headgaskets that see 10 miles and get tossed! Lazeum -- Agreed. I'm gonna get a ridge reamer and honing tool. Everything specs out such that boring does not appear necessary, but the original cross-hatching is gone, so definitely going to take the time to re-hone the cylinders. Also new rod bearings as you mentioned, along with new rings, and also ARP rod bolts (thanks Tony, I would've missed that one). Thanks all for the comments and suggestions! I'll report back once I get all of the parts in and get it back up, running, and hopefully not fumigating the neighborhood!

Update: Pulled the motor again and popped out both the worst and best piston. The problem was 100% stuck rings. In cylinder #2, which appeared to be the most oil soaked from reading the plug, both compression rings spun freely, but the oil ring was completely compressed and stuck shut, so much so that it took tapping against the ring gap with a flathead to free it. The #1 cylinder, which appeared to be the least oil soaked, actually also had a stuck oil ring, but it was stuck uncompressed and protruding out of the ring land, it also took almost no pressure by hand to free it. My best guess is that this is fallout from it being a junkyard motor, which probably sat out in the elements for an extended period of time. That said, anyone have any suggestions for good replacement rings? From what I understand, the 81-83 N/A 280zx (F54s) use completely different rings than the 280z and also the turbo 280zx's. Unfortunately, MSA wants $250 for the set! I can't seem to source a Perfect Circle set at all that isn't oversized, and the only other vendors I can find (eBay) aren't leaving me with much confidence that the rings that are delivered will be _specific_ to a 81-83 N/A 280zx. :-/

Not especially, but given the oil + coolant milkshake explosion due to the warped head and obliterated headgasket, it's a big hard to say. Here's a shot of #1 and #2 (left) right after I took the head off. Granted, this was after I also rotated the crank to TDC, so it isn't exactly as it sat in the junkyard... Thanks for the response... you're probably right, blown oil ring and OK comp ring. At the end of the day, I think the answer is that I should've re-ringed the darn thing before ever putting it back in, especially given it's unknown history. Would've cost me $30-40 and a few hours. :-/

Short version of a long story: Picked up a junkyard F54 / P78, which looked like this once disassembled: Upon further inspection, the head was clearly warped, but the deck seemed to spec out fine. Swapped on a known good head, brand new headgasket -- leak down numbers come out great, no more than 10% across any cylinder, and with a less than 5% variance across all 6. Same with compression, 160-165 across the board. However, immediately upon getting it back on the road it was fogging up the entire neighborhood. After a few miles and WOT runs, the smoke seemed to be infinitely less pronounced, but upon pulling it back in the garage and yanking the plugs, I found #2 to be oil soaked (smoke even came out of the combustion chamber right when I pulled the plug), and #5 to have a very tiny amount of oil residue on it as well (although nothing I'm really concerned about, esp compared to #2). All I can think is rings here. Or maybe a stuck ring on #2 if the motor sat in the junkyard for a long time? What perplexes me is why the leakdown and compression numbers came out so spot-on awesome. Given the amount of oil I seem to be burning in just that 1 cylinder, and the fact that the plug looks nearly fouled after a few miles on the road, I'd expect some kind of smoking gun (aside from the obvious smoke!). The motor runs extremely strong and I'd never suspect a problem if I didn't look in the rearview while making pulls! Any ideas or thoughts on anything I could possibly try that doesn't involve pulling the entire motor again and completely disassembling it and re-ringing it? Thanks!

Hey Keith -- I can't answer your specific questions, but why rear LCAs instead of camber plates? You've probably read this thread 10x over like I have, but it's been more or less my deciding factor in leaning towards the plates instead: http://forums.hybridz.org/index.php/topic/54771-adjustable-control-arm-lca-lower-control-arm-faq/ Most specifically: "adjusting the camber with the control arm in the rear is not a very convenient way to go. If one is using the on the car adjustable arms, the adjusters have to be turned out exactly the same amount front and rear in order to prevent a toe change. If one is not using an on the car adjustable arm, then the rod ends can be turned out x number of turns front and back, but in order to make an adjustment the spindle pin has to be removed to make the adjustment. In addition, some rear control arms have either the front or rear rod end on the car adjustable for toe, but not the other one. In that case the spindle pin would need to be pulled to make and adjustment AND the toe would need to be reset afterwards. Camber plates are a much better way of adjusting camber than adjustable rear control arms." Again, it's probably information you're already aware of, so apologies for cluttering your thread if so, but wanted to make sure you didn't overlook it.

Picked up an F54/P79 L28e longblock from a junkyard recently, sold to me as a "good running motor", and naturally I found this: Using a long machinists square and feeler gauges, the head appears to be warped, between 4-6 thousands of an inch in various spots depending on where the measurement is being taken. At a minimum, the head needs to be resurfaced. The block, however, appears to be spot on. The rod bearings are all in spec, the journal on the crank measures out perfect, as does the cylinder bore. Compression test showed 150-160 across all 6 cylinders, and a leakdown came back with 7%-14%. I've got this lying on the shelf: It's an E88 with the A grind cam (longer duration, lift on intake) that's been hottanked, resurfaced, with L28 intake valves. Measures out to far better than spec with the same square and feeler gauges. I'm extremely tempted to put the P79 on the shelf, and bolt the E88 up to the F54. I've got a 1.25mm felpro headgasket ready to go and believe that'll give me roughly a 10.4:1 compression ratio. The intended use for the car is heavy autox, light track, light street. It'll see _maybe_ 1-2k miles / year, of which 30-40% will be wide open. I'm running dual weber dgvs with plenty of spare jets lying around, a 6-2 square port header (which also better matches the E88 head) and dual exhaust. I'm also running an optical dist with a 12v coil and crane xr700 electronic ignition (used to be alison before they were bought out). All I can find to discourage me are the threads concerning detonation issues. I have zero problems running 93 all day long, and given the low mileage and intended usage of the car, I don't necessarily have any issue with the idea of running around with cans of octane booster ready for each and every fill-up. However, that being said... there isn't a lot of point to all that compression if I have to dial the timing way way back to prevent detonation. What do you guys think? Worth the risk to go E88/F54, or should I go the "safe" route and send the P79 head off to the machine shop?

I've been wondering about this myself. Unfortunately, I'm not sure if there's anyone actively on the forums using the K-Macs. Search has yielded a few links to the K-Mac site, and people asking a bit about them, but no one really reporting back on using them. NZeder (who hopefully doesn't mind me mentioning this) has a friend running them in Australia on a tarmac rally car -- 3 years and zero problems according to his account. However, he didn't seem to feel as though he was able to get a lot of extra caster out of them, which to me was in theory the big draw of picking up a set over the GC or EMI units. RebakahsZ recently posted a very positive review (with pics) of the EMI units, which you also do not have to do any cutting to use, but you may want to check with johnc to ensure they'll work with Megan S13 coilovers and whatever strut you're using. If you're able to track down any direct accounts regarding the K-Macs, please post back, I'd love to hear of it as well!