Are these good replacements for fuel injector harnesses?

[NewZed]

I did some digging since I started the debate.

 

Here's a link to the actual RC Engineering site, with pictures - http://www.rceng.com/Fuel-System-Accessories-C9.aspx?UserID=10971335&SessionID=R8l9nP3D91Zqvscxzlz5 It shows the spring-clip style Bosch design connector.

 

That EBay picture is hard to decipher, and may not actually be showing an RC Engineering product. Actually, the heading on the ad says RC Fuel, the logo over the picture says The Racers Edge (which doesn't seem to be anywhere on the RC Engineering site) And the product pictures don't look the same (see the basic clip with pigtail) - http://www.rceng.com/Injector-Wire-Clip-Type-C-P49C9.aspx Not sure why they don't link to the RC Engineering page if it's an RC Engineering Direct Warehouse.

 

Here's another example of a Bosch style connector from DIY Autotune sans pigtail - http://www.diyautotune.com/catalog/fuel-injector-connector-bosch-ev1-p-111.html Another method to get new without cutting wires (although corroded wire ends are an issue also).

 

Same with pigtails - http://www.diyautotune.com/catalog/fuel-injector-pigtails-bosch-ev1-p-48.html

 

Many options. The need for easy removability I would think comes down more to how often you putz around with your engine, or plan to in the future. It only takes one broken connector or lost metal clip though, to make you wish you had the spring-loaded style. Quality is harder to quantify, but factory-made parts in general seem to be of higher quality (my opinion), probably because they're expected to last 100,000 miles (my conjecture). Junkyard or internet depends on whether you like wandering the wrecking yard or not.

 

Search Bosch injector connector and you'll get a bunch of hits. DIYAutotune has a good rep and is a Hybridz vendor and they look about the same price as those you asked about (one other option).

 

Edit - I made some comments about the initial EBay ad earlier, then removed them. If that EBay ad is truly from a respected Hybridz member, maybe they could confirm the link to the RC Engineering company and address the difference between what is shown there vs.the official RC site. It would worry me if I was buying.

Edited September 12, 2011 by NewZed

[mario_82_ZXT]

I've used volvo injector connectors for the last 3 Megasquirts.

 

They're easily found and cheap at the u-pull-it. There's even a used volvo parts store here in town that sells them for $2 each.

 

Also, MSD sells the updated Bosch ones in a do-it-yourself kit for $24 for 8 connectors. They don't come with the nice boots that the volvo ones come with though...

 

PS I've bought the ones from Forrest when I did my first Megasquirt years ago!

Edited September 13, 2011 by mario_82_ZXT

[rossman]

Here are pictures of the connectors in question:

 

 

From left to right: 80's Volvo, 80's BMW, "RC" (TRE Performance), Stock S30, Stock style replacement (F0rrest)

 

The stock S30 connector is broken from removal and the boot is hardened from heat and age. Both the Volvo and BMW connectors are in good shape and the boots are soft and pliable.

 

I'm using the "RC" connectors with the BMW boots as I like the look of them better than the Volvo.

Edited September 14, 2011 by rossman

[Tony D]

 

Yep, off the RC Website, those are what I have, and what I'm talking about. In the photo above with them all, I would use ANY of the three to the left-they all work the same, and I would not use the two to the right. As stated earlier, later plastic is better suited for higher temperatures, and while the stock replacement gives you 'the look' of a stock part and likely would last longer, it is still the same PITA to lift if you have to do anything to an injector or a sensor anytime during the lifetime of the vehicle.

 

The first e-bay photo I can't see the bail separation, and they looked like stock replacements compared to the RC Photo which I knew from ordering and personal experience to be the quick-release bail type, and my preference for the above listed reasons.

 

If they are the 'bail type' that is easily removable <EDIT> The photos now make it clear they are not<EDIT>...then get whatever you want wherever you want they will function identically. I'm with the comments above 100% in the differences in boots, and I did neglect to mention BMW as they have some very nice right-angle boots on their connectors that allows you to really make a nice harness when you don't want messy 'big loops' of wire coming off the back of the sensors (like at the thermostat housing near the stock fan!!!)

 

Nice thing about the BMW boots: you can order them as a separate part number from Bosch directly once you find the ones you like in the JY, a quick call, some money, and you have some really nice new boots!

[Sam280Z]

IMO, for the price, you can't beat the original poster's link. Forrest's connectors work just fine. Although there have been improvements over the years, 99.99% of the time you don't need them. I'm not sure they are worth the extra money that could be put into something that actually makes horsepower. I've had a set of Forrest's connectors on my car for over a year. I had to disconnect them this weekend while I was experimenting with some different injectors. They appeared and functioned as new. If you know what you are doing With minimal effort, that little clip is no problem. (See my post below for instructions.) There was no corrosion on the contacts - the supplied dielectric grease was still there.

 

But that's what I love about HybridZ. The level of discussion over the technical merits of something as simple as an injector clip is awesome.

 

Sam

 

Edited to remove offensive language.

Edited September 15, 2011 by Sam280Z

[rossman]

 

But that's what I love about HybridZ. The level of discussion over the technical merits of something as simple as an injector clip is awesome.

 

Sam

 

I think its because a lot of us are engineers and as such we obsess over details.

 

In my situation your argument doesn't hold up. I've already pulled mine off several times fitting up my fuel rail and head coolant piping. Its nice to just grab the connector with one hand and pull it off.

Edited September 13, 2011 by rossman

[Sam280Z]

While I'm fabbing everything up and know I'll be connecting & disconnecting stuff repeatedly, I just pull the wire clips and stash them in the ashtray. That's where they are now. When I'm done the clips go back on.

Call me cheap, but the $13 plus cost of grease and heatshrink went towards the purchase of a MS3. But, to each his own.

[Tony D]

<EDIT>I would agree, there is little a little effort to get the original clips off without damage--I usually take the bails completely off until 'final assembly', which is why I now just buy the quick-release bails. I loose them from time to time. Ever try to buy clips alone? So a trip to the JY...and while you're in the junkyard you see this row of Volvos and...<EDIT>

 

Engines are now modular, clips can't be fiddled with or require special tools to remove---they have to be something that can be detached by a technician in the field quickly for diagnosis or plugging into specialty testing machinery. <EDIT>The Bosch clips are used on industrial compressors and other severe duty environments and have gone to the QR bail type as well since some of these sensors fail regularly due to harsh environments. Some lifetimes are measured in HOURS of operation. <EDIT>

 

If the 'stock first generation connectors' were perfect, there would never have been a redesign.

 

The very essence of this board exists to improve upon designs that are 40+ years old, which is why I would give the nod to the QR Bails.<EDIT> If I was doing a restoration for someone going into ZCCA Judging, though...THEN the OEM style would be the only acceptable alternative.<EDIT>

 

<EDIT>There ARE sites out there which will sell you the PINS alone, BTW--I think for even the RC Connectors, I would prefer when making harnesses to put the pins DIRECTLY on my harness wiring and NOT use a pigtail---and for that reason BOTH the listed alternatives have an 'equal negative' to hold against them. I know pigtails are nice on service replacements, but for someone MAKING A NEW HARNESS both of these alternatives are suboptimal IMO.

 

You can harvest all the Volvo Connectors, then re-pin them for a FRACTION of the cost of EITHER of the alternatives above. I think for a new harness that would be a better idea.<EDIT>

Edited September 17, 2011 by Tony D

[Sam280Z]

I never denied that the newer style is superior or easier or an improvement. I never said the stock connectors were perfect. I just said that the improvements were, IMO, not worth the additional costs.

 

And, unfortunately, cost is a factor in most peoples' builds.

 

Kaizen can be applied both to the functional engineering of a product over its lifestyle as well as to the processes the technician (me) uses on the floor. Improvements to the processes (diagnosis, repair, or testing) can be made by giving the technician the right tools and knowledge.

 

If you want to call me out on something, call me out on the fact that I didn't give any tips on quickly removing the clip. I thought about it, but was in a bit of a hurry.

 

This is easily done with a 90deg pick. That is really all you need to snap each side of the clip out and back a fraction of an inch so that it rests inside the groove on the side of the clip. The clip can stay on the connector. The connector will slide right of the injector with the clip in this position.

 

Having the right tool available can be just as effective as the most engineered and improved upon part. And this particular tool can be used for many other purposes.

 

If cost were no factor, I'd have the newer style clips on my car, with gold contacts and carbon fiber bodies. Oh well, life is hard.

Edited September 14, 2011 by Sam280Z

[Tony D]

Well, I PM'd the source of CF Gold Plated First-Series Bosch Type Connectors to you with my final thoughts on this matter.

[Khaserwolf]

wow after reading all this, i want to look into this deeper. im glad I askedthis question lol

[Challenger]

Ive bought about 3 sets of these from him, two sets I drove on my cars for awhile. 3rd has yet to be tested. Quick shipping, everything worked great. The removable metal clip is a hassle to get off with a stock fuel rail. Its not that bad with an aftermarket rail where you have room to get your tools/fingers in there to pull off the clips. Good reason to get a new fuel rail?? haha

Edited September 15, 2011 by Challenger

[HowlerMonkey]

Don't forget to make sure you get the plugs that have a slot that corresponds with the raised "key" on the injectors of your choice or you will find that they won't plug in.