Experience needed for V8 conversion...?

[Guest Anonu]

Hey,

 

I'm a student half way through my university programme, and I've been "studying" car mechanics, the industry, etc. on my own for about 5 years, every since I discovered the wonderfull world of cars.

 

So basically, I know my automotive mechanics in a theoretical way, almost inside and out in a lot of circumstances, and i've got some garage experince, aswell as whatever i've done at home with mopeds and the family cars. I'd like to know how likely it is that, with a little help, I could perform a Datsun V8 swap.

 

I've gotton and read the JTR manual, and i understand most of it, it's nice and clear, but they do stress that a lot of experience is required before attempting sucha task.

 

So are my dreams of having my own killer Datsun on hold untill I do other mechanical things, or could this be a good, heavy-duty, project for a guy like me, who sevearly interested in this sort of work, but not an expert?

 

Thanks

 

PS. If there's a better forum to post this topic in, I'd be happy to move it or have it moved.

[Bartman]

If you use the items that JTR recommends, you should be able to handle performing a V8 swap for your Z. If you decide to do things differently you may need experience fabricating to complete your project. With the JTR book and this forum you should have access to all the information you need.

 

If you get in a bind, someone here will probably be able to provide an answer to help you out.

 

If you have the drive and ambition, go for it:) .

[sims76]

My experience is not with a V8 swap, but I can relate to your situation. Five years ago, I didn't know what any of the parts were under the hood or how they worked.

 

By reading this site, taking my time, and reading this site some more I've progressed to upgrading the brakes, suspension, rear end, transmission, turbo engine transplant, and megasquirt EFI installation. I'm even weld a little too.

 

What I'm saying is all the answers are here and for the few that are not, you just have to ask. Take your time, budget your money if necessary, and just go for it. Don't give up, you can work through just about anything that comes up.

 

The feeling of driving a vehicle that you built (or at least disassembled and re-assembled) is awesome.

[280zwitha383]

I'm going to have to Ditto sims. Go for it! You will love it without a doubt. (assuming you finish it.....)

[Brad-ManQ45]

If all you are gonna do is drop in a carbeurated V8, you shouldn't have much problem, if you haven't had any problems removing the current engine and tranny.

 

You haven't specified what year Z you were going to do this to - obviously a 240/260 would be the easiest, because the JTR manual spells everything out for you.

 

You start having to know more in dealing with the wiring harness on the Fuel Injected cars.

 

If you plan on doing a fuel injected V8, then it gets a bit more involved - but a lot of that goes away with money used to buy prefabricated wiring harness for the computer. If this is the scenario, and you wsill use the factory FI system, then it will be a matter of eliminating extraneous wires from the factory harness and knowing which wires to hook up to the bought harness.

 

If you understand wiring diagrams, not too difficult, if you don't - go carb.

 

I myself have jumped in headfirst with a '75 that needs new floor pans, fender patches and new rear quarter panel. I have bought a welder, taken lessons, built a rotisserie, in the process of building a 4' X 2' blast cabinet.

 

All this before I stuff in a Twin Turbo Chevy LS1/2 w/automatic and a R230.

 

I intend to do everything myself, but I have removed and rebuilt engines before, done brake jobs, done suspension work, wired car stereo's, etc.

 

I don't care how long it takes - it is simply something to do in my spare time and have fun doing and learning along the way.

 

If you need the car for transportation, then keep it simple and relatively low powered and don't go overboard with modifications

[Guest tony78_280z]

I never even had the JTR book, and I'm an idiot. I didn't know jack about cars. I just kind of jumped in and took off. You got the book, you got the knowlede. Do you have the skills and the desire?

From my webpage (I love to quote myself)

Little things I learned about a motor swap, the hard way

1) Research, research research. Check the net, and get the Jags That Run book. I didn't use it, and I'm telling you that you want it! Then draw up a tactic including what is your cars theme. Is this a daily driver? A weekend warrior? a race only car? Pick a category, because you can't do everything. I wanted a good looking and dependable daily driver with decent mileage and not more than 300hp that I can do burn outs in and win 9 out of 10 times at the stop light. Then do more research. Find out what components you want it to have and make a good list as to how these components will be installed, (yourself, other professional, what tools or other supplies you will need etc) and then transfer this list to step 2.

2) Design a budget for money and time to do your swap. Then double it. This will be the minimum to get it on the road with very few "While I'm at it..." Additions. No matter how good you are at fabricating, it'll cost more than you thought it would.

3) Before you start, go out and buy a good welder. Bolt on kits are rarely bolt on. Putting the motor in I had to use a crappy Arc that was older than I am. Later when I replaced the tranny, I bought a bran new Flux MIG welder. It makes any fabrication so much easier.

5) Get a good manual for your model Z, a good manual for the motor you are putting in (donor car), and a manual for every aftermarket part you are putting in. I have quite the library for my Z.

6) When you get discouraged, don't give up. Step back and replan your attack. Too many projects are left in the garage from discouraged fabricators. Think How else can I get this to work. Creatively solve the problem And down time is "re-strategize time". go over your plans, look to the future and plan you next step(s).

[Owen]

No experience for me either, besides bolting on exhausts and cutting springs to lower cars! Now I make my own fiberglass parts, weld, paint, etc.

Owen

[Guest Anonu]

Nice, your posts are really encouraging.

 

As I said, I know my car parts, I know what everything does. Coincidentally, I'm even taking a welding course right now at a community college here (arc welding).

 

I wanted to confirm that this wasn't a pipedream for someone like me, and it really appears not to be, which is awsome.

 

My challenges right now are that I don't even have a Datsun, or Chevy drivetrain. I'm gonna have a tough time finding a datsun where I am (Ottawa, Ontario), I've barley seen any floating around, much less for sale. In addition to that, I need space. Living in the city, with my mum, there's just no room. I wish I lived on a farm, then I'd rock out in a heart beat.

 

All that hasn't stopped me from starting though. I've already started planning out my goals for that car, as in what to accomplish firts and last. I've thought out a lose budget, I don't have a lot of tools, so I'm gonna have to factor that stuff in too.

 

I mentioned mopeds in my opening post. I've got a project with one now, and it's giving me great perspective on how to go about thing, how not to get discouraged, etc.

 

Thanks, fellas, you'll be hearing a lot more from me in the future when I've got my hands and mind on a Z.

[Tim240z]

What ever your budget and schedule is, multiply the $$ by 3 and the time by 5. That is a pretty good rule of thumb, and a very conservative one at that.

[Guest tony78_280z]

I've thought out a lose budget

 

I'd think about a win budget

What ever your budget and schedule is, multiply the $$ by 3 and the time by 5. That is a pretty good rule of thumb, and a very conservative one at that.

I multiplied my $$ budget by 2 and my time budget by 100!!, Guess I shouldn't be so cheap.

[Guest Anonu]

Yeah, I'm being pretty generous with the buget already. If i multiplied it by 3, I'd be in $13-16k, not really in my range for anything!

 

Actually, I'd be interested, what are some of the numbers you guys have spent over the months/years working on your Datsuns V8s?

[Tim240z]

5 years and I stopped counting at $15K. And although it was running and on the road....it is now without drivetrain again waiting for something new and fun.....

[Guest tony78_280z]

5k. I need probably another 1k, and I have yet to start body work.

[Guest Anonu]

Chevy drive trains are cheap and common, but how much should i expect to pay for a workable Datsun, post '73 preferably.

[Mikelly]

"Loss budget" Not THAT is funny... LOSS budget is a new term on me, but let me enlighten you to that which you speak of...

 

Stuff a V8 in the car, and you have a unique $5000 car... Yup, you can pretty much take a $10000 clean, otherwise unmodded Zcar and CUT THE VALUE in Half!

 

So what are your plans for this car? I hope you don't aspire to DRIVE it in some "racing" class, because the only cars it will be legal to compete against will have it beat by at least 600# and a LOT of power to weight ratio... Yea, I'm a bitter man!

 

The car will be fast if you do everything right, and upgrade the brakes and suspension... But as Tim said, Tripple the cost and multiply your time schedule by 5 and you might get CLOSE to your goal...

 

And the last thing I can tell you is this: Do a SERIOUS self analysis... Are YOU honestly capable of completing this with ZERO help?

 

Reason I ask is this: Everyone you bank on "helping" you could vanish tomorrow and THIS PROJECT is a BIG one, no matter what others say... I hope you are prepared and know the right end of a screw driver!

 

Welcome and Good luck!

 

Mike

[Guest Anonu]

Well, your point of view is sure to keep you, me and others grounded, but I'd rather be optimistic about the whole thing.

 

I think that yes, with enough time and patience I can get it done all by my lonesome self, but the help and knowledge of others is invaluable, and I want to take advantage of that when I can.

 

As far as goals, I could go into details, but basically, I want a Datsun (due to it's awsome looks, and sleeper potential) that will push you back into your seat when you press the Go Pedal. I'm not looking to run 10s 1/4miles, or smoke a Ferrari at a red light. Something not everyone has, is driven daily, and can be pushed.

 

The first thing I'd do is get the swap done. A 350 with probably a 700-R4, get it running smooth. Once it's doing that, I can casually upgrade the rest of the package (suspension, brakes, flywheel, pullies, timing, etc), as time money permits.

 

I should also mention that this would be a huge learning experience. Which is 50% of why I've chosen to do it. Otherwise I'd just save up the cash and buy one that's already done.

[Tim240z]

Your list is upside down.....you need to start with suspension, brakes and other safety related parts.....

[dr_hunt]

Half the battle is believing that you can, the other half is alot harder. Either way, it will be a learning experience that you will remember the rest of your life. I would suggest not putting a time frame on it at all since this is your first such project. Multiplying by 5 is for experienced wrenches, Newbies have no time limit.

 

I have well over 12K in my boys and we're not on to paint yet, but that is not a real cost figure since the engine was $6500 by itself.

 

Have fun, you'll learn alot here. Good luck!

[awd92gsx]

Well...it depends alot on what your goals are.

 

If you can't get a basic V8 drivetrain put into a 1G Z and be driving for less than $3000 something is wrong.

 

I have about $1600 or so total into my V8 swap (NOT including the car, of course).

 

Sure, I might not have an LS1/T56 combo...but, the V8Z runs, drives, gets good gas mileage, and doesn't seem to have any problems so far.

 

Is the car completely finished? Well...no...it's not. But, I can finish it as time and money allows and still drive it back and forth to work every day.

[awd92gsx]

Here's what I spent on my conversion:

 

Here's what I've spent so far on the swap (from memory)

 

$130 on the JTR mount adapter kit w/speedo cable- picked it up second hand, but, new

$500 on donor car (1977 GMC Sprint/Chevy El Camino - 350ci/th350 trans)

$100 on Chevy radiator *

$55 on Driveshaft flange adapter *

$65 on Radiator Mounting Kit *

$19 on Coolant Temp Sensor adapter

$8 on GM Oil Pressure switch

$80 on block hugger headers (actually more, but, the first set doesn't count)

$120 on Electric Fan w/Thermostat (3300 cfm! much cheaper than Flex-A-Lite 150 which is $300) *

$12 on Spray Paint

$12 on Wire Loom

$20 (or so) on Various Nuts and Bolts

$95 on Driveshaft modification (not performed yet)

$180 on Edelbrock 650cfm carb (not purchased yet)

$120 on B&M Tranny Shifter

$36 on a Delco Reman Alternator *

$70 on Gear Reduction Start

$150 on Exhaust (not purchased yet)

$25 on new Oil Filter/Spark Plugs/Plug Wires/Thermostat

$20 on Aftermarket Engine/Tranny Mounts - JTR recommends using GM mounts, but GM mounts are over $50 a piece!! (and GM doesn't carry the reommended tranny mount any longer)

-----------------------------------------

 

All in all, that's a little over $1800 so far (after you include shipping for some of the parts). One thing I need to change is the exhaust. It turns out I knew the guy that runs the Meineke down the street, so he hooked me up on the exhaust and didn't charge me. So, I actually have about $1650 into the swap. Since I didn't really need the Starter, you can take off another $70 (although I did go back and get a new starter later, it was optional)

 

* = parts that were replaced for cosmetic reasons or were not necessarily needed, but, made things easier.

 

Now, yes, I do work in the parts business and got a few of the things a bit cheaper (such as the alternator)..but, for the most part, everything was gotten through Autozone or places like it. I did forget to list spark plugs, wires, and valve cover gaskets, though. Add $40 to the total.