Hybrid Z Car Sponsorship?

[JMortensen]

I don't want to sidetrack the thread, but just as an example of possible problems, putting A arms on a Z is pretty low on my list of things to do. There are other ways to avoid dive that aren't anywhere near as expensive and don't require as much fabrication, like running really stiff springs for one. However, if Okimoto built a rocketship fast Z with double A arms and came and asked for sponsorship I'd look at it much differently. Instead of thinking "Wow that's gonna be a bitch to do, and the mounts will have to be really strong and it's going to require that the whole front end basically get chopped off and rebuilt" I'd be thinking "This guy ACTUALLY DID IT. Instead of just talking about it he actually did it" and that would score much higher with me. I've seen that idea thrown around since I found this place, and probably before that. As far as Hybrid Z members who actually run a double A arm, I don't know of any. I remember seeing pictures of a car that might have been a GT2 Z that had it, but I can't quite recall, and it might also have been a 510 or some other Datsun. There was a guy who actually had the A arms mounted in front, but never finished. It didn't appear to me that he had anything like the structure necessary to actually drive on that suspension though. It looked like it would have folded on the way out the driveway. One of the biggest problems is follow through. Once you had the A arms, then you'd actually have to beat a bunch of other cars that put all that time and effort into other parts of the car to prove you were actually quicker for it. Might not be quicker in the end. There are some INSANELY fast Z's with struts out there.

 

I don't know exactly what kind of budget the Pinks guys had, but I saw a bit of the parts list that they had, and it made me want to puke that the car looked that bad on TV. I know they only had 45 days or whatever, but there has to be some follow through, and that doesn't mean that the Hybrid Z car is in the "permabuild" stage forever either.

 

We all feel a need to build a badass Z, otherwise we wouldn't be here.

There's all kinds of people here with all kinds of ideas as to what would make "the most badass" Z. That again is the problem. I think the question is "can we build one that satisfies enough people to make it a worthwhile group effort?", and I still think we'd all get more bang for our buck by sponsoring other cars. Sponsoring an existing car might mean buying a set of slicks. It might mean paying some entry fees. It could mean anything. But what it probably doesn't entail is building a crazy engineering project from the ground up.

 

I'm going to try and take a step back and let some more comments get in before I jump in again. Regardless of your opinion, please share it.

[MatMan]

Consider this little slice:

 

How about builders (either individuals or groups) applying for small HybridZ-backed sponsorships WHILE the cars are being built?

 

i.e. Capital is needed to purchase a motor. Builder(s) beseech the HybridZ community who then determine the necessity and availability of said capital and award the (say) $500 to purchase the powerplant.

 

This example doesn't specifically NEED to be about money. Parts donations would also be a possibility, if available.

 

This way, the controlling interests are the builders, NOT HybridZ. HybridZ would be the donator, or silent backer, if you will.

[dr_hunt]

.

[JMortensen]

You're right in the comparison to corporate sponsorship. But I think you're wrong in the idea that nobody wants to donate if they don't get to touch the car when it's done. How many people got to be involved with the Pinks build? 10? How many people touched the car? NOW--How many people donated? There is something to be said for not getting as involved, and for this reason corporate style sponsorship just seems like a better idea to me. Ultimately it's not up to me, and it's not up to you, and it really isn't for us to put to a vote. I'm just stating my opinion that a group build is going to breed conflict and suggesting an alternate idea. I'm not suggesting a completely finished alternative with all the logistics worked out, just a direction that may be more easily followed. For instance, the decision to give a guy like you $500 to buy some slicks and some signage to put on the car might be a little easier to make than the decision to spend $20K on a ground up build of a drag racer, especially when there are already a whole bunch of purpose built drag cars here.

 

Who makes the decisions about sponsorship or dollar amounts? I don't know. Right now I'd say Dan, but he may have some idea about putting it to a vote or something amongst us admins, or something else entirely I really don't know.

 

As to group input, well I'm going to have to take issue with you on that one. Just speaking from personal experience, my car is being built with tons of membership contribution. Specifically tube80z, Jeromio, blueovalz, John Coffey, katman, 74_5.0_Z, preith, ZRossa, gnosez, ZR8ED, heavy85, PUSHER, clarkspeed, Mikelly, gramercyjam, 260DET, Jolane, Mat73GNZ, bjhines, Phyxius, and probably at least 20 others here have had SPECIFIC input that helped determine what went into my car and how it was eventually built. I really hope that they will have some sense of pride when they see how they helped shape the design of my car, as I know I do when I see someone else's project come together that I helped with. I tend to think immediately of the toe adjuster that blueovalz, jeromio and I came up with. That part is DAMN cool, and I know it wouldn't have happened without the three of us coming together here on Hybrid Z. So unless you hide in your garage and build something and then display it to the Hybrid Z world as a finished product, it is a group project IMO.

[naplesZ]

Maybe we should start by having cars nominated by other members. Then the admins can contact those people and gauge there interest and weather or not they would be a good person to represent hybrid z. Once you get a group of cars the decide what the owner wants to do. Drag , Auto-x whatever. Then have a pole to select the winner. Just start with one first to see how it works out. Then maybe have one in each region. Maybe the first one isn't a ground up build but helping a fellow HybridZ'er finish his or her car and at the same time represent hybridz. I hope I am not pointing the discussion in another direction, but maybe it can be about members coming together and helping each other out and building a stronger community and some bad ass cars.

[Twoeightnine]

Seeing that the Admins, and some outstanding members, had to clean up some loose ends from an example of how twisted a build cound get without the right people at the wheel, and the fact that it was stated that it would not be allowed to get out of hand again.

What would be the standards? Write up a sticky? Be OK'ed by the elders?

I have seen some people that are willing to band together for various builds. I have seen some interest in promoting their pride in Hybrid Z.

Can we have some word from the top? Where do we go from here?

 

Thanks to all....

[JMortensen]

Twoeightnine, what's your rush? Word from the top is we all still want to hear more opinions. Keep them coming, regardless of your viewpoint.

[Mikelly]

My view (From the side?) is that we'll never make everyone happy.

 

Quite frankly, We have a select group of members who could afford to do whatever they want with whatever car they wanted, and they just happened to fall in love with the Zcar... These members have vast resources and can contribute.

 

Then there's the rest of our members. Many can't even afford to complete their own projects, let alone contribute to someone elses.

 

There are other factors as well... A hybridZ team car would require storage, transportation, and constant maintenance. It likely wouldn't be able to be "tagged", if it was a group car. It would require some subset of members who would be dedicated to the car... And that's what got Mike S., Jeremy C. and others in trouble... they got to attached to the car, and forgot the other members involved in the process.

 

Then there's the whole "It's not a XXX motor in the car, so I'm not playing" vibe that creaps up, as it did in the PINKs build. We'll never have "everyone" satesfied. Quite frankly, the PINKs debacle was such a mess that more than one admin wanted to walk away from HybridZ and quit Zcars for good.

 

Why can't we all just get back to building our own respective cars, and showcasing our own personal and individual talents?? I guess I'm not seeing how this is gonna be "good" for HybridZ, or the members collectively...

 

Now, that said, I'M NOT SPEAKING FOR THE ADMIN STAFF... GOT IT???

 

Keep kicking the ball around and you'll eventually get a goal...

 

Mike

[veritech-z]

This discussion is reminding me of the time when I was a college radio DJ for a semester at University of South Florida. I had a show where I spun old school hip-hop and freestyle every Friday morning from 10am-12pm. I won the runner up award from the station director for best DJ just because I showed up and played good music (I suspect it was my halloween set of all halloween themed hip-hop, but I digress). The following semester, it was announced that DJ's would be expected to spend like 4 hours a week outside your show helping out the station directors doing administrative stuff(alphabetizing cd's and vinyl, paperwork, etc). I ended up leaving the station over it, because I just wanted to spin records. The point is I like getting and sharing advice and opinions, but I don't like to get roped into stuff that is going to take the fun out of the Hybridz community. If you want a Hybridz sticker/tattoo/t-shirt: I say get one/make one, whatever, and if people ask you about it, tell them what we're all about. I would spin records for the love of it, I would drive my car and represent Hybridz for the love of it. Once there are too many strings attatched, I'll take my talent and peronality (such as it is) eslwhere.

[OlderThanMe]

I am still not sure about a group build. I would think that if a build was going to happen it would go on for maybe a whole year. If a HybridZ car was to be built then you would want it to be top of the line stuff. If you try to get all of the parts quickly there wil be big gaps and stuff misplaced and even possibly stealing of group donated stuff. If the build was fully document showing where every part went, every penny and where it went, etc.. then nobody would be in the dark.

With the Pinks build I was in the dark a lot with what was going on. A builder would mention that they could not get something mounted but another member had already donated the mount for that part and most likely felt offended.

I have no money for my car, leaving for college soon, and have an engine that is messed upon an engine stand in my garage. I felt like donating toward the build would ad to my portfolio of stuff I have acomplished. I am now thinking that If I had not donated I would have enough materials to finish my aluminium console. I wanted to donate thinking that the build was going to add to an awesome car that was going to be worth something. The reality is that the car wil probably have the guages, dash, diff mount, motor/tranny, and a few other go fast goodies pulled and the rest of the car crushed. Sort of disappointing to have a fast car built but the body is not even worth donating to somebody that needs a shell.

If there is another build every step should be documented so everyone can just look through a thread and see the progress of the car and see their donated money/part/service be put to good use.

end of my thoughts.

almost.

The sponsorship is a good idea but since I already have a Hybridz logo (I made it) on my car since I have had more help from this site than any other I feel proud to display the HybridZ name. What about people that already have a hybridZ logo on their car and are proud to show it but then others get paid to have a hybridZ logo on their car? HybridZ can't send money to all people that have it's logo on their car and it shouldn't.

Just another almost random thought..

This might make hybridz members that have no had their car sponsored want to remove their Hybridz logos since they are not gaining aything from it but others are

[(goldfish)]

Particapation should be voluntary even if it's a house build. If you can't help, or even don't lke the product. Would a house car be good for the site?

[veritech-z]

originally posted by OTM: This might make hybridz members that have no had their car sponsored want to remove their Hybridz logos since they are not gaining aything from it but others are

 

The making and applying of your own Hybridz decals/logos/whatever might offend the powers that be, since if Hybridz were selling these things to gain revenue for operating the website, you are in effect stealing the likeness of this intellectual property by copying it and not giving anything back to www.hybridz.org for everything it's given to you, right? I've often wondered how the administration felt about that kind of thing...

 

*edit* in fact, I've often wondered if such merchandise was available...I wouldn't mind having a www.hybridz.org baseball cap that I could wear with my homemade Datsun jacket...

[OlderThanMe]

Point taken. If the admins wish me to remove my Hybridz logo I will do it at their request no questions. I was just trying to show my loyalty.

[veritech-z]

I think we all know why you did, I was just making the point that it could go the other way with homemade logo's too-as food for thought. All the admins seem pretty cool, I don't know if they feel this way (or considered it in those terms) or not, I was just playing devils advocate. I doubt anybody wants Corzette to have his tattoo removed either. We might not all percieve each others best intentions from the same point of view, know what I mean?

[johnc]

We're not enforcing trademarks or making significant amounts of money selling HybridZ logo'd merchandise. Tim had a run of stickers and clothing made due to demand from the members. If you want to make a sticker or a shirt or a hat for yourself because we have nothing available, go for it. That doesn't mean you can make a bunch and them sell them yourself, making a little money on the deal.

[Twoeightnine]

We're not enforcing trademarks or making significant amounts of money selling HybridZ logo'd merchandise. Tim had a run of stickers and clothing made due to demand from the members. If you want to make a sticker or a shirt or a hat for yourself because we have nothing available, go for it. That doesn't mean you can make a bunch and them sell them yourself, making a little money on the deal.

Interesting point.

With your statement, I have a question.

I contributed significantly to the PINKS build and except for the outcome, enjoyed the sponsorship. I have always enjoyed being part of race teams and race events whether as a mech or a sponsor.

As you know I provided crew shirts to the members due to the demand and request that I recieved. It is well known that a portion of the proceeds was channeled to the race team as a Hybrid.org donation. I took on a significant risk by ordering a bulk of these shirts (approximately 1,000.00 up front). Fortunately they sold fairly well. My statement being that, even carving off the top the 2.50 per shirt crew contribution, the average shipping cost of 3.00 (not including a half dozen overnighters and Jeremy's 50.00 overnighter!) still, my original investment with respect to the crew shirts, has been satisfied.

Sales from this point, would be profit based. Considering your statement, how should I handle it?

I wonder due to the fact that they have the "Hybrid Z" on them.

John, could you help clarify?

[johnc]

Don't worry about it.

[Airjockie]

On topic or off topic..take this post as it is.

 

I'm an advid car guy, I've built some cars, and I've got other projects that I'd like to build,...but ran out of money and my back just can't lift anything anymore. I'm tired of watching 240sx's take the limelight in drifting...anyone can drift a 240sx...but only a few people can drift a Z, I've been trying to drift my Z for years, and I'm still spinning out all over the place. I've blown motors, snapped tie-rods, and have had my share of cars needing a tow home from event's. I just picked up another Z, built by Chris Holmes in NY, and it's running the same as when he sold it to my freind, except my freinds fathers truck had a breaking failure, and smashed up the rear of the car. So right now, I have 2 z's nearly drift ready...but both cars needs a lot of work...mostly paint and body, and suspension work. I've wheels and tires out of my bum, and I will always need more. but the problem lies here....I bought a house, and the bills are just being covered to where I can only put about a few hundred into the cars a month. But I also have 5 cars...2 are completely dead, but one is being rebuilt to an autocross monster (87 CRX) and the other one will be scrapped.

 

If I can finish building the crx, and sell it for a decent price, then I'll have the money to finish the Z's...and if they are set up right, and I can get the seat time to play with them, then I'm sure I can get decent on at least one of them, and find someone else that would be willing to drive the other one at the same event's. If I can get both cars up and entered into at least one event this year, make a good showing and be awesome. Then I can get some packets put together to send to sponsors, like wheels, tires, safety equipment, and if this looks good my boss will also hand a packet to his freind in the company I work for and they will sponsor me with time off from work, travel fee's and other equipment to get the cars to the events and shows. I work at Sikorsky Aircraft, I'm in the commercial production hanger where we take apart, put back together the new aircraft, and test them. If I do this build-up based on safety, then they'll buy into it...plus at the event they will prolly want to use the chance to recruit some new employee's that worked on cars and see if they would be interested in learning how to build aircraft...

 

Now the downside... I've posted for positions with the company to work for them in Japan, my wife is Japanese, and the sooner I get her back home, the sooner she will be happy. And that would mean that I would have to sell everything, from the house, the cars, the garage, and jump on a plane and move back to Japan. Isn't love great...plus I yern to live in Japan again...I loved it over there for the 7.5 years that I did live there. And the other downside, my back is just not as strong as it used to be, I'm 34 years old, and my spine feels like it's 60 year old. I can't even lug the 24 foot ladder to the side of the house to finish building some gutters I started.

 

Anyways...I got the cars, I got a lot of parts, I got the tools (most of them), I got the heart to do it, but I just don't have the time, the money, or the strength to do it anymore. I might just sell it all and take up a new hobby, or bust some more a$$ and try to finish what I started...either way, I'm looking for some help, some seat time, another driver, a few sponsors, or a buyer that has the same goals...and they get everything for the right price.

 

And I know it sound dumb, but I kinda came up with a team name....

 

Team Sake....when rice turns to wine...old Japanese cars dominating the track.

[Twoeightnine]

Wow.

What a post!

Pics Please.

Got a lot of if's in that post, but your right in that when you make a good showing....you have something to sell!

If one of your options is to sell your stuff.....

 

Look forward to seeing the goods!!

[Airjockie]

The new-to-me white Z, already built for a track, but needs a lot of work still.

 

http://www.redpepperracing.com/gallery/v/airjockie/album421/

 

The original Drift 260Z...still needs some body work and a few other toys...

 

http://www.redpepperracing.com/gallery/v/airjockie/Zrebuild/?g2_page=8

 

the CRX build....

 

http://www.redpepperracing.com/gallery/v/airjockie/albun55/

 

and then the normal house re-build...from building the garage up, tothe yard and then the house..... same galleries, just flip threw a few of the galleries...