Pennyman Posted August 16, 2006 Share Posted August 16, 2006 I'm in the process of sectioning my struts and I seem to have cut a tad too much out. The gland nut fits and screws down about halfway but nowhere near the "1 thread showing" amount. If I weld the tubes with a little bit of a gap showing between them, I can get the gland nut tightened more. The gap to be filled with weld would probably be no more than an 1/8" probably 3/32" more like. I could fix this by getting a metal sleeve and putting it inside the tubes and using that to span the gap, and it would work because of the extra space between the strut tube and the insert, but I'm not sure where to find 1-7/8" OD tubing... Has anyone done the inner sleeve method? It seems like a good way to ensure everything is strong and aligned well, but it's possible it may not be necessary too if I can span the gap by simply welding it carefully. I'm new to all this, help me out... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JMortensen Posted August 16, 2006 Share Posted August 16, 2006 I wonder if you couldn't find another longer gland nut to fix the problem. The issue is the amount of threads engaged. I know on the "calling all racers" thread there was some discussion about a Bilstein gland nut that was longer. While the Bilstein gland nut might not work on your struts because it has the upside down setup where the strut is over an inch thick, you might be able to call someone like shox.com and find out what the original application was and then get the appropriate gland nuts and make them work. I think filling the gap would work too, but you might have some weld sticking inside the tube which you would then have to grind away, and it seems a bit on the cheesy side to me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
olie05 Posted August 16, 2006 Share Posted August 16, 2006 In sectioning strut tubes, it seems it is common practice to leave the insert in while welding, taking care not to weld the actual insert to the strut housing. If you purposefully leave a gap, then you are more likely to accidentally weld the insert in. The inner sleeve method would be the best by far, and if your insert fits in with this in place, go for it, just make sure you don’t rely on thin wall tubing for your strut housing and make sure it is ALL weld. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BWRex Posted August 16, 2006 Share Posted August 16, 2006 Well,I'm glad I'm not the only one to section too short! On my second pair too!The first pair I thought I'd take them to a race shop to get TIG welded.(posted about that a while ago)They F-ed them up.Sourced a second pair,used a chop saw,and cut them short.Ended up having a machine shop fab up a set of gland nuts with extra threads for the low,low,ripoff of 200.00 for 2!!! They're pretty and extremely beefy,but you'll never see them,and I'm going to use a pipecutter and measure 3 times before I do the rears........ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnc Posted August 16, 2006 Share Posted August 16, 2006 The gap to be filled with weld would probably be no more than an 1/8" probably 3/32" more like. If that gap is all the way around, I wouldn't do it. Remember, the strut is a structural part of the suspension. Find another strut or maybe patch in a 2" section. In sectioning strut tubes, it seems it is common practice to leave the insert in while welding, taking care not to weld the actual insert to the strut housing. Remind me never to buy your used shocks. Sourced a second pair,used a chop saw,and cut them short.Ended up having a machine shop fab up a set of gland nuts with extra threads for the low,low,ripoff of 200.00 for 2!!! $200 for completely custom machined gland nuts? You should thank those guys for giving you such a deal. The Koni gland nuts are $30 each. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JMortensen Posted August 16, 2006 Share Posted August 16, 2006 Section long and add a spacer. Section short and spend $200 on gland nuts or else try to figure out another nut that happens to work. So what I'm saying is... section long. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paz8 Posted August 16, 2006 Share Posted August 16, 2006 I have seen gland nuts that were fairly thick at the top were the strut rod comes through, why couldn't you remove an 1/8 of metal from the inside of the nut, that would make it seat deeper. It will make it weaker also, so start with a heavy one, just an idea. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pennyman Posted August 16, 2006 Author Share Posted August 16, 2006 I think I have an idea. I talked to a guy who has sectioned other struts before, who reccomended finding a piece of tubing just small enough to fit inside the tube to be used as a sleeve, as I stated in my first post. Weld the sleeve in, and then slide the top part of the strut tube over the sleeve, leaving a 3/32" gap between the two strut tube pieces (about the thickness of the tubes themselves). Then welding the strut tube pices to the sleeve and to eachother by filling the gap. This would ensure everything is straight and add extra rigidity, and you wouldn't have to worry about weld protruding on the inside. As for the sleeve, I figure I can go to a muffler shop, get a piece of 1.5 inch tubing and have it swedged out to 1 7/8" OD, and cut off 2 or 3 inch sections for the required sleeves. What do you think? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JMortensen Posted August 16, 2006 Share Posted August 16, 2006 I don't like this sleeving idea. There isn't a whole bunch of room in the strut housing anyway, so adding a sleeve inside isn't really that great an idea IMO. Where did you section the struts, up at the top, or down lower? If you did them up top you could weld the gap and then grind out any of it that gets inside the tube. If you did them down lower it's going to be pretty tough. I think John Coffey recommends putting a tube inside the strut housing to hold everything in alignment. I did mine by clamping them to a piece of angle iron, and that worked fine for me. If you did the tube inside the housing I fail to see how you could fill that gap without welding the strut housing to the tubing. One other idea which hasn't been mentioned yet is to do like ON3GO did when he screwed up his sectioning. He took the pieces that he cut out and sectioned again and added those pieces back in. You could do that, although it requires twice as much welding. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeK280z Posted August 16, 2006 Share Posted August 16, 2006 If I understand correctly, the stut cartridge is now a little to long for the shortened strut housing??? Not knowing what cartridges you have, is there any chance that there is a spacer on the bottom of the cartridge that you could shorten? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cody 82 ZXT Posted August 16, 2006 Share Posted August 16, 2006 I don't like this sleeving idea. There isn't a whole bunch of room in the strut housing anyway' date=' so adding a sleeve inside isn't really that great an idea IMO. Where did you section the struts, up at the top, or down lower? If you did them up top you could weld the gap and then grind out any of it that gets inside the tube. If you did them down lower it's going to be pretty tough. I think John Coffey recommends putting a tube inside the strut housing to hold everything in alignment. I did mine by clamping them to a piece of angle iron, and that worked fine for me. If you did the tube inside the housing I fail to see how you could fill that gap without welding the strut housing to the tubing. One other idea which hasn't been mentioned yet is to do like ON3GO did when he screwed up his sectioning. He took the pieces that he cut out and sectioned again and added those pieces back in. You could do that, although it requires twice as much welding.[/quote'] I think I would go the extra welding route and add material to the tube then recut it to make it perfect. By now you're bound to know exactly how much to cut off or add to the tube. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2126 Posted August 16, 2006 Share Posted August 16, 2006 As John mentioned, the struts are a structural member and band-aids fixes are not such a good idea. If you want to sleeve the tube, put the sleeve on the outside of the tube. As I remember during the sectioning of my struts, I had to grind away a little bit of the weld bead that penetrated a tiny bit on the inside of the strut tube just so my Tokico inserts would fix in properly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pennyman Posted August 17, 2006 Author Share Posted August 17, 2006 I don't like this sleeving idea. There isn't a whole bunch of room in the strut housing anyway' date=' so adding a sleeve inside isn't really that great an idea IMO. Where did you section the struts, up at the top, or down lower? If you did them up top you could weld the gap and then grind out any of it that gets inside the tube. If you did them down lower it's going to be pretty tough. I think John Coffey recommends putting a tube inside the strut housing to hold everything in alignment. I did mine by clamping them to a piece of angle iron, and that worked fine for me. If you did the tube inside the housing I fail to see how you could fill that gap without welding the strut housing to the tubing. One other idea which hasn't been mentioned yet is to do like ON3GO did when he screwed up his sectioning. He took the pieces that he cut out and sectioned again and added those pieces back in. You could do that, although it requires twice as much welding.[/quote'] The whole point of having the tube sleeve inside the strut housing is to weld it in there permenently. (BTW, i sectioned where the old spring perch was) If I use exhaust tubing, I would think there would still be enough room to have the strut insert fit. But maybe not enough for the heat transfer fluid Because I only have to span about 1/8 inch maximum, The sleeve may not be nessecary. one method as well could be to add metal to the tube by welding around the rim of the strut tube to build up material. The whole trick is, I don't know how to weld, so everytime I ask someone to do it, they propose other methods of going about it, even I know it should work the way you guys did it...arg... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JMortensen Posted August 17, 2006 Share Posted August 17, 2006 This is the reason why I disagree with John about where the strut should be sectioned. If you did it right up at the top, maybe 2" from the very top of the tube, you could do a really messy weld and get in there and grind whatever you needed to grind out. With the section way down low you're kind of screwed. I don't think you'll have enough room with another piece of tubing in there. Exhaust tubing is generally the cheapest crap they can get. You might see if there is a tube that fits that you can buy from http://www.onlinemetals.com or similar sites. You can buy one foot and that should be more than enough. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pennyman Posted August 17, 2006 Author Share Posted August 17, 2006 This is the reason why I disagree with John about where the strut should be sectioned. If you did it right up at the top' date=' maybe 2" from the very top of the tube, you could do a really messy weld and get in there and grind whatever you needed to grind out. With the section way down low you're kind of screwed. I don't think you'll have enough room with another piece of tubing in there. Exhaust tubing is generally the cheapest crap they can get. You might see if there is a tube that fits that you can buy from www.onlinemetals.com or similar sites. You can buy one foot and that should be more than enough. I called Midas, I thought about expanding a piece of 1-3/4" tubing out to the required size, making a snug fit and making the metal thinner as well, more of a chance for the strut to fit, but I really like your idea of just welding it, spanning the gap and cleaning it up afterwards. My only worry is that cleaning it up afterwards, there could be a chance of messing up the glandnut threads on the tube with any sort of grinder. But overall, I think it'll work. I just need to find someone capable. Unfortunatly, lots of guys around here think they know a better way to fix it, and won't weld it unless they can fix it their way, which sucks. I've got a friend with a mig welder who might be able to, no gas sheilding, but he'll probably do it. I had a thought about practicing on the sectioned pieces. Taking the tube sections that were cut out of the housings and welding them together with the gap, and seeing how it works, kind of like a practice run. This should let me know if any sort of gap spanning is going to be worthwhile. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blueovalz Posted August 17, 2006 Share Posted August 17, 2006 My 240Z struts have a 1.75" ID. With the 8610's, this gives me only a few thousanths clearance between the strut tube and the insert. In this example, the sleeve would not be an option. I'd measure the insert OD, and then determine what you could use if this method is your choice. Remember, the gland nut is only containing the insert on rebound. Do you feel you need 80% of threaded area, or could you use 40% instead. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cody 82 ZXT Posted August 18, 2006 Share Posted August 18, 2006 I called Midas' date=' I thought about expanding a piece of 1-3/4" tubing out to the required size, making a snug fit and making the metal thinner as well, more of a chance for the strut to fit, but I really like your idea of just welding it, spanning the gap and cleaning it up afterwards. My only worry is that cleaning it up afterwards, there could be a chance of messing up the glandnut threads on the tube with any sort of grinder. But overall, I think it'll work. I just need to find someone capable. Unfortunatly, lots of guys around here think they know a better way to fix it, and won't weld it unless they can fix it their way, which sucks. I've got a friend with a mig welder who might be able to, no gas sheilding, but he'll probably do it. I had a thought about practicing on the sectioned pieces. Taking the tube sections that were cut out of the housings and welding them together with the gap, and seeing how it works, kind of like a practice run. This should let me know if any sort of gap spanning is going to be worthwhile.[/quote'] Just put something over the threads so they can't be hurt and take your time. I would stay away from the gasless mig if you could. To much splatter to clean up afterwards. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BWRex Posted August 18, 2006 Share Posted August 18, 2006 my $$$$ set of machined gland nuts....... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pennyman Posted August 18, 2006 Author Share Posted August 18, 2006 Wow, those look like some beefy units right there! From the looks of them, you sure cut a lot out of those tubes! I went out and measued how much of a problem I have, and it turns out that only one has a large gap: the drivers-side front. The pass. front is cut slightly crooked, but is still a good length, and one of the rears is perfect, and the other rear needs to be ground down a tad. My girlfriend's brother is a pipefitter, and said that my best bet would be to weld in a small section of the tubing I removed, and then weld the rest on. So I trust his opinion. I'm over the sleeving idea, I don't think I have enough room in there for anything worthwhile anyway. I'll keep you all updated on this, though. I know it'll work out somehow... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tube80z Posted August 18, 2006 Share Posted August 18, 2006 Remember, the gland nut is only containing the insert on rebound. Do you feel you need 80% of threaded area, or could you use 40% instead. Typically rebound forces are higher than compression forces on the shock shaft. Welding a gap is a really great way to make a weak joint. If you have a gap use tubing on the outside to bridge and weld this up. That's the correct way to do this. Cary Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.