Turbo a NA 280Z

[Hrududu]

Hi everyone. I did some searching here already, but with so much info its hard to find the answer im looking for. I have a 77 280 that has an N47 head on it and i can't remeber the block at the moment. I would like to turbocharge this car without having to do and entire engine swap. About all I would really feel comfortable swapping is the head, but I just don't have the time, tools, or experience to pull the whole engine. I found a good looking 280ZXT in a junkyard here that has a complete motor with the intake and exhaust manifolds etc. If I were to buy this engine, would it be possible to swap out the turbo parts onto my stock engine? I'm not looking for anything crazy as far as power goes. I'd be fine with running at the stock 6psi or whatever, so long as i wouldn't have to switch out blocks. If i can do this without having to do any major electrical work, that would also be awesome. Sorry if this has already been covered a million times, i promise i did try and search. Thanks for you input.

[tfreer85]

A good starting point for you.

http://forums.hybridz.org/showthread.php?t=84860

 

Also you can play around with this if you curious about engine compression, etc.

http://www.ozdat.com/ozdatonline/enginedesign/

 

Also with the amount of work you'd put into swapping the Head manifolds, etc. you'd be better off just pulling the 280ZXT Engine and dropping it right in. Would be a lot less work IMO. Also spend some time using the search function on the site, it'll help you out IMMENSILY!

 

Tyson

[big-phil]

I'm the guy, I did that same thing. see look...

Then things got crazy, ........see look............

It can be done, but you need alot of the turbo stuff, oil pan, oil pick up, dizzy, wire harness, ecu, turbo, manifold....etc. Good luck.

 

I just got Megasquirt ecu, so my 83 turbo ecu, wire harness might be for sale? And I'm going to sell my 370cc injectors. hmmmmm

[GrommitZ]

I think you're much better off pulling the whole thing plus the grocery list of zxt parts from the car. Pulling an engine, with the help of a friend, should take less time than taking apart the engine at the yard.

[Hrududu]

I think you're much better off pulling the whole thing plus the grocery list of zxt parts from the car. Pulling an engine, with the help of a friend, should take less time than taking apart the engine at the yard.

Well, my plan was to pull the motor at the yard, take it home and put it on a stand while i open it up and replace gaskets etc. I use this car as my daily driver and im a college kid, so having it out of comission for a long time really isn't much of an option right now since I don't even live at home to work on it. I just saw the car sitting there and figured if I could get some cheap power out of it, i'd go for it. I'm just trying to figure out the best way to get that power. Be it turbo or NA build up. I figured if it would be cheaper just to pull the parts off this motor and put em on mine i'd just go for it.

[george.bryant]

Do it. Cheap power...just get a l28et and bolt on the turbo gear.

[KTM-EXC]

Swapping the whole motor would be much easier then just the head. Id just keep driving your car the way it is and start getting the other motor ready so you can just throw it in and go.

[JessZ]

Buy the turbo engine and sell your engine. It's way easier to just plant a stock L28et and wire the electronics into your car then go through the evil, buggy N/A swap shenanigans---WAY EASIER!

[Guest 280ZForce]

I used to have a complete L28e (n42 combo) running w/ stock turbo manifold and a t4 turbo, n/a dizzy and n/a ecu. You don't need to run all the turbo wiring and what not.

 

This setup was run on my Z before I owned it for 20+ years with no problems and was getting around 8-10 psi on it no problem.

 

Just get that stock t3 turbo and turbo manifold, the turbo oil lines and get a cheap lil intercooler (npr or similar) and get some IC piping made, get an fmu and you'll be set for what you want.

 

Although like the rest of them...I'd do recommend just swapping in the whole L28ET and wiring and what not...might be more work, but will be worth the time and money.

[Hrududu]

I used to have a complete L28e (n42 combo) running w/ stock turbo manifold and a t4 turbo, n/a dizzy and n/a ecu. You don't need to run all the turbo wiring and what not.

 

This setup was run on my Z before I owned it for 20+ years with no problems and was getting around 8-10 psi on it no problem.

 

Just get that stock t3 turbo and turbo manifold, the turbo oil lines and get a cheap lil intercooler (npr or similar) and get some IC piping made, get an fmu and you'll be set for what you want.

time and money.

 

Yah yah! Thats just what im wondering. If it is possible to just swap over those things and keep the rest of the wiring and stuff as is now. Im not looking to run anymore than the stock psi from the little T3 that is already on the car. To do that, would I need anything that isn't already on the turbo motor?

[Guest 280ZForce]

my z utilized the stock n/a ecu, dizzy and wiring on the n/a engine just fine.

 

You'll need to get the stock turbo exhaust manifold and turbo along w/ turbo oil lines from the 280zxt, then find a good aftermarket fmu for better fuel pressure and I also recommend running an intercooler.

 

Then just bolt on the turbo manifold and turbo, run the oil lines, install the intercooler and get some ic piping made. Run the n/a afm between the intake filter and the inlet of the turbo. And make sure you get that fmu in there to adjust the fuel pressure.

 

So yes, it is possible to do and keep everything n/a related on the current engine and run a turbo safely on low boost.

[savageskaterkid]

my z utilized the stock n/a ecu, dizzy and wiring on the n/a engine just fine.

 

You'll need to get the stock turbo exhaust manifold and turbo along w/ turbo oil lines from the 280zxt, then find a good aftermarket fmu for better fuel pressure and I also recommend running an intercooler.

 

Then just bolt on the turbo manifold and turbo, run the oil lines, install the intercooler and get some ic piping made. Run the n/a afm between the intake filter and the inlet of the turbo. And make sure you get that fmu in there to adjust the fuel pressure.

 

So yes, it is possible to do and keep everything n/a related on the current engine and run a turbo safely on low boost.

 

 

I don't understand. So somebody else did the swap before you bought it? Or did you? I am not questioning your work, but the parts. How exactly did this work, unless you run low RPMs all the time. With the N/a AFM it WILL NOT revv past 4k rpm. Trust me, I didn't believe it at first when I heard it, but i walked outside and started the car, revved it up and hit 4k rpm and it just redlines. Are you sure it wasn't a turbo afm, or even an N/a afm with turbo guts?

[Hrududu]

I don't understand. So somebody else did the swap before you bought it? Or did you? I am not questioning your work, but the parts. How exactly did this work, unless you run low RPMs all the time. With the N/a AFM it WILL NOT revv past 4k rpm. Trust me, I didn't believe it at first when I heard it, but i walked outside and started the car, revved it up and hit 4k rpm and it just redlines. Are you sure it wasn't a turbo afm, or even an N/a afm with turbo guts?

 

Wait, are you saying you can't rev your car past 4k rpm?? I can go well past that in mine. Maybe im not thinkin of the same thing you are talking about.

[Guest 280ZForce]

I don't understand. So somebody else did the swap before you bought it? Or did you? I am not questioning your work, but the parts. How exactly did this work, unless you run low RPMs all the time. With the N/a AFM it WILL NOT revv past 4k rpm. Trust me, I didn't believe it at first when I heard it, but i walked outside and started the car, revved it up and hit 4k rpm and it just redlines. Are you sure it wasn't a turbo afm, or even an N/a afm with turbo guts?

yeah, the previous engine setup I had was done 2 POs ago (back 1985). He had the engine redone and bored .030 over, then had the head done w/ a 3 angle valve job, port and polish, crane cam, ported intake manifold, 70-60mm taper weber tb, msd 6-btm ignition, cartech fmu, t4 turbo w/ turbonectics external wastegate, small 1-sided intercooler, N/A AFM, n/a ecu, n/a injectors and fuel rail, n/a wiring, 2.5" dp and exhaust. And it lasted about 21 years before I lost compression in 1 cylinder and blew a head gasket finally.

 

But it was the n/a afm, I'm pretty sure of it. It revved fine and I took it up to 6500 rpm or so. Cuz I then got a zxt engine and compared the afm and the turbo one was larger.

 

The engine was a beast and made very good use of the turbo, even on 7-10 psi. I could peel out all the way to mid 3rd gear pretty easily.

 

I pulled on a STi on the freeway from a 65-100 mph roll a couple times, then when I slowed down to do it again he jumped over 4 lanes to exit the freeway. Kept up w/ a 600cc bike on a freeway run, he pulled on me on me by a couple cars after about a mile of running, but after going 130mph and in the valley of freeway got a little scary w/ even a slight wind and stock sh*tty suspension at the time. But we slowed down and then he flipped up his visor and had a surprised look on his face and give me 2 thumbs up.

[Alex_V]

Hrududu-Heres an idea for you. Get megasquirt, and set it up to run the stock distributor, and run it on your car as is. Get it running and tuned. This way you'll pick up some MPG and have great driveability.

 

Then, bolt on the minimal turbo parts, and retune and your set. Put your crusing AFR to leaner then 14.7:1 and enjoy some great milage and great driveability for not too much cash.

 

~Alex

[Guest 280ZForce]

Hrududu-Heres an idea for you. Get megasquirt, and set it up to run the stock distributor, and run it on your car as is. Get it running and tuned. This way you'll pick up some MPG and have great driveability.

 

Then, bolt on the minimal turbo parts, and retune and your set. Put your crusing AFR to leaner then 14.7:1 and enjoy some great milage and great driveability for not too much cash.

 

~Alex

I think he is trying to avoid doing all the custom wiring because he says it a daily driver and he needs to drive it all the time and can't have it down for very long.

 

On my old n/a turbo setup I was getting around 18 mpg on city/highway driving w/ boosting a lot...then I took a trip to Vegas in it during the day in over 100* weather in mid 2005 and got around 24 mpg I think w/ some boosting along the way of course.

[biohazard53188]

I know this probobly doesnt help but its probobly not a good idea if the Z is your daily driver. If you say you do not know how to pull the engine then I am not sure if you should try to switch your N/A to a turbo as it is your daily driver. However we are in the same situation engine-wise, I too am looking to turbo charge my engine. I think I am just going to swap the whole thing, seems to be less problems that way and expandablility is enormous. Good luck, and be careful with which way you choose!

[Hrududu]

Hrududu-Heres an idea for you. Get megasquirt, and set it up to run the stock distributor, and run it on your car as is. Get it running and tuned. This way you'll pick up some MPG and have great driveability.

 

Then, bolt on the minimal turbo parts, and retune and your set. Put your crusing AFR to leaner then 14.7:1 and enjoy some great milage and great driveability for not too much cash.

 

~Alex

 

Hmm, that sounds like an idea. About how much will one run me?

[Alex_V]

DIYautotune.com and MSEFI.com read up on those sites and go with what you think is best, but the cheapest MS kit is $135 and you have to build it your self or $240 built and you just wire it up. But it wont just be the MS it self, you'll need some misc stuff and definitly a wideband setup or borrow a friends.

 

Theres also lots of tunes already since alot of zcar guys run them.

 

You could get a second stock harness while your driving around and then mock up all the sensors and wiring and all that so you can test it and get it completely setup then put the MS setup on the car all at once.

 

How much experiance do you have soldering and all that stuff? Its not that hard to learn, and the soldering iron and solder isnt that expensive ($25-40 plus a couple extra tips at a couple bucks each plus a few for solder).

 

~Alex

[Tony D]

I have to say the MS conversion is probably the best way to go. You can get all the wiring in place, as well as all the sensors, totally independent from the stock system. With the dual element TPS from the KA with an Automatic, you have both a switch for the ECCS to run, and another TPS showing position all within one body, so you can run the ECCS, with the MS running in parallell as a datalogger. You can then datalog your runs, get all the stuff working, have your "custom" harness run, and in an afternoon, swap over the final items like Fuel pump and EFI relay initiation wires, and connect the injectors to the MS from your pre-laid harness, and then go about tuning it.

 

You then have something you can run in EITHER mode just by switching a few wires back and forth, the only real hard part is finding one of the dual element TPS units.

 

This gets you familiar with the Megasquirt tuning, lets you get hours on the unit and confidence in that it works. Then when it comes time to go turbo, you simply remap and in a couple of hours you are running under boost. This was the way a lot of people started out when they had no baseline maps available. With the Moby Maps you should be fine as a starting point. You can actually get the MS running and do a total engine swap --- it would be no different swapping over the sensors and wiring as it is for the stock system.

 

it is ALWAYS easier and makes MUCH more sense to start any kind of conversion with KNOWN GOOD SYSTEMS IN PLACE. This allows you to get the critica fuel and spark control running and KNOWN GOOD before changing the turbo/head/engine. Then if anynthing goes worng, you KNOW it ran before, so you only have to look over what you CHANGED, instead of EVERY possibility under the sun.

 

If you are a masochist, you buy this in a box, that in a box, the other thing in a box...then you assemble it from this box and that box, and then try to make it run.

 

I do that a lot. I am a masochist, I do not recomend this for college students who need their rides to make it to abnormal psych class so they understand me better! LOL