What is it with Sellers and Paypal fees?

[JMortensen]

BTW... I'm curious. What's the difference between paying an extra 3% as a fee verses a product that's 3% more expensive?

The difference is people would be less likely to use your payment service if they have to tack an additional fee to the total. It is for the convenience that the merchant has to eat the costs as Mikelly said, and these charges should not be passed on to the customer.

 

Visa/Mastercard has very similar regulations (which I'm sure were the inspiration for Paypal's rules), only they have a hell of a lot more power to enforce the rules. The Visa/MC rule goes basically like so: You can offer a cash discount, but the advertised price cannot be raised when the customer pays with a credit card. There are quite a few other related issues that I was paid to enforce about 12 years ago. I can't remember all of them, but not setting a minimum charge for a credit card transaction was one.

 

Personally I avoid Paypal as much as possible because they tend to be a couple percent more expensive than the cc companies anyway.

[johnc]

ohn, I have to ask, why would you charge an extra 1.5% for me to pay you for something in US funds via Paypal, just because I live across a border? US currency is US currency no matter where it's sent from.

 

At this point it just sounds like a way to get more money from someone just due to the location they live in.

 

Both PayPal and my Credit Card processer charge a "cross border transaction fee" of 1.5% for any transaction that originates outside of the USA. From the fee seciton on PayPal (for a Business Account):

 

Transaction fees for cross-border payments - United States

 

Fees for receiving payments from buyers outside the United States

You are currently being charged the Cross-Border Standard Rate of 3.9%.

 

That 3.9% is a premium of 1.5% above my PayPal standard rate of 2.4% (plus $0.30) for transactions under $1,000.

 

And you're correct, PayPal is making an additional 1.5% because you happen to live in a different country then the seller.

[TrumpetRhapsody]

Maybe I'm wrong??

Nah, not wrong. (I wasn't trying to single you out on this btw. Our transaction just reminded me of my roomate complaining about this topic the other night)

 

I guess it does boil down to a decision on how to do business.

 

I suppose I've gotten so used to mindlessly using paypal as a buyer on ebay that the recent selling i've done and the trends on forums have opened my eyes to the process enough for me to start questioning it. That and recent big-ticket items factoring in more on the %.

[johnc]

Do a Google search on "interchange fees" and you'll start getting angry.

 

BTW... I can charge a "convenience fee" of some percent but according to the Visa/MC I have to charge ALL of my customers that fee, regardless of type of payment.

[JMortensen]

PAYMENT INFORMATION

We accept personal checks drawn on USA banks' date=' cash, and Credit Cards (VISA and MasterCard). We also accept Credit Cards and eCHECKS via PayPal (send PayPal payment to: [email']sales@betamotorsports.com[/email].) Payments via personal check or eCHECK take 5 to 10 business days to clear. Products will be shipped and/or vehicles will be released after payment clearance.

 

Please note the following additional charges:

1. A PayPal payment via eCHECK will incur an additional eCHECK fee of $5.00.

2. A PayPal or Credit Card payment made from outside the USA will incur an additional 1.5% cross border fee.

3. Non-US dollar PayPal or Credit Card transactions will incur a additional 3% currency conversion fee.

4. An invoice totaling $1,000.00 or more and paid via PayPal or Credit Card will incur an additional fee of 2.9%.

 

Unfortunately, the fees listed above can be cumulative. We don't like having to charge these B.S. fees but we really don't like having to absorb these

I just read this more closely, and I can tell you for sure that #4 violates Visa/MC regs. Not sure what you want to do with that info. It might suck for you though if they revoked your merchant account. I'd guess #3 is also a problem, but can't recall a specific rule to deal with international sales.

[johnc]

I'm pretty sure I'm going to stop accepting credit cards in the near future. Its really not worth the trouble for the infrequent large dollar amount transactions I process and how the transaction processors hold the money for three or four working days.

[johnc]

Well, I just found out that charging a credit card surcharge is a violation of California Law (California Civil Code Section 1748.1). But the law says I can offer a cash discount. So be it.

[RTz]

Normally, when I list something, I do not expect to be compensated by paypal. I don't advertise as such and I don't want to be bothered with it. As a seller, paypal sucks. Paypal is buyer convenience. That's my opinion, like it or don't.

 

If you ask if paypal is an acceptable payment method (instead of just assuming so), I might accept. I might also ask you to cover the fee's. This is called negotiations. If you don't agree with my terms, either counter, or say "no thanks". There's nothing illegal or unethical about negotiating terms. It's part of life.

 

P.S. Petty almost always swings both way's. Funny how often people miss that part.

[johnc]

Revised:

 

PAYMENT INFORMATION

We accept personal checks drawn on USA banks, cash, and Credit Cards (VISA, MasterCard, and Discover). We also accept Credit Cards and eCHECKS via PayPal (send PayPal payment to: sales@betamotorsports.com.) Payments via personal check or eCHECK take 5 to 10 business days to clear. Products will be shipped and/or vehicles will be released after payment clearance.

 

We offer an invoice or pricing discount of 3% for all payments made by cash or check.

 

Please note the following additional charges:

 

1. A PayPal payment via eCHECK will incur an additional eCHECK fee of $5.00.

2. A PayPal or Credit Card payment made from outside the USA will incur an additional 1.5% cross border fee.

3. Non-US dollar PayPal or Credit Card transactions will incur a additional 3% currency conversion fee.

 

Unfortunately, the fees listed above can be cumulative. We don't like having to charge these B.S. fees but we really don't like having to absorb these fees and pass the costs on to our customers who pay by cash or local check. Again, if you pay by cash or check we will dedeuct 3% from the invoice amount.

[m4xwellmurd3r]

I havent tried this so I can't remember, but if you send money via paypal with money ALREADY in your paypal account, then paypal won't tack on that fee right? so if it's a big dollar transaction, wouldn't it be helpful for both parties if the buyer sent the money to his paypal, then sent it to the seller? I know it takes almost a week to do, but in the end it can save both parties some money.

[JMortensen]

The revised version looks OK to me, but they weren't doing the e-check stuff 12 years ago. Like I said I'm not sure on the international thing, but I think that would probably be an issue too. If you have your merchant agreement that you filled out when you signed up to take credit cards on the back of it all the rules are listed. Break out the magnifying glass (seriously small print on the ones we used) and you can check for yourself.

 

Personally I think it's worth it to deal with the cc hassle and charges for my business, and I'd expect the same for you. I saved up the money for my parts before I bought from you, but how many people who are buying your body parts are actually doing that? I'd guess the percentage is fairly small. Besides, if you actually went and raised the price of a $793 hatch to $816, how many people are going to complain?

 

m4xwellmurd3r, paypal charges their fee regardless of whether you have the funds in your account or not.

[Mikelly]

I agree with Jon M. I have chosen not to purchase items on ebay when I've seen the seller doesn't take paypal. I, as the buyer, would just as soon PAY the 3% so I don't have to deal with the hassle of mailing a check or going and purchasing a money order... I want to BUY it NOW, Pay for it NOW and be done with it NOW.

 

If I can't do that, I won't play at all...

 

If you can't afford to help the seller eat the fee, then don't play.

 

Mike

[jerryb]

As a seller, I have sold many many items on ebay and by other internet means...almost all payments being through Paypal. Paypal fees cover many of my store front costs...my bank, my cash register lease, my book keeper...my lawyer.....security...etc.

 

My prices include this overhead...I cant fathom any reason to ask the buyer to pay for this service as a extra adder. Its like brick and morter stores asking for a percentage on top of the purchase price. I wouldnt pay this to a "real" store and sure as hell wouldnt to a web store. I suggest you stay away from these hams. Silent protest works!